All Walnut Body?

[Narayan Kersak]

Is Walnut ever used as top for an acoustic instrument? Not just back and sides?

If not, why not. If so, what kinds of qualities does it impart tonally?

I found this on a forum for solid body instruments...

"What Walnut does is to comb away (notch) some midrange frequencies while still having a good, highly present midrange. A huge oversimplification of "combing" would be to go to a 31 band EQ and raise every other fader all the way up, and lower every other fader all the way down. A notch filter takes designated frequencies and eliminates them without affecting the surrounding frequencies, like some feedback filters. So that's how I describe Walnut. It is a great guitar wood. It has a sharper attack than Mahogany because it's harder. It resonates a little like Ash so it's sweet sounding in the midrange, assuming you get a lighter piece. Since it's not as hard or dense as Maple, it still represents the low frequencies well, too. I love it with Ebony and Pao Ferro boards. "

Any thoughts on how this would translate into an acoustic instrument of all walnut?

[billhay4]

Brian Dean made a concerto model with a walnut top. It had an internal soundboard, though, so it may not be what you are asking about. For some reason, he has taken that model off of his web page, but it is (was) for sale right here.
Quite an instrument according to Marty Jacobson who had one in his possession for a while.
Bill

[Seter]

Appalachian dulcimers are made with walnut tops fairly often, like this McSpadden for instance. Mine has a dogwood top though, walnut back and sides.

[CarlM]

I am not sure about top but I built my first one with back, sides and neck of some walnut my father cut 30 years ago. The top is cedar. The bass is a little weak but not badly. Other than that it is well balanced and sweet sounding.

If memory serves I saw a Taylor at one of their roadshows that was all walnut. Here is a Youtube of one.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5WbREcynTYE

[multidon]

I remember Mike Dulak (Big Muddy) made some of his flat tops in all walnut. I believe it was a limited edition. I have no idea how it sounded but it sure was pretty!

[Marty Jacobson]

Walnut is indistinguishable from maple in terms of tone, in my opinion. Of course every piece is different, but maple varies a lot, too.

[Karl Hoyt]

Having used a lot of walnut over the years for acoustic guitars and electric basses, I'd agree with Marty: it doesn't have as many subtle mids and overtones as maple has. But a strong fundamental. My initial thought is that a Mando top made from walnut would be all fundamental and not as much of the overtones that make acoustic instruments to sweet sounding. Having said that, what the hell? It's heirloom wood so go for it..... or ...........save the walnut you were going to use for the top and make yourself 2 mandos with conventional topwoods.

[Mandobar]

Black walnut and redwood (top) paired together make a wonderful cittern or octave mandolin. Bob Abrams (Trillium) used this combination a lot, and I have a cittern made out of these materials. The sound is not a pointed as a spruce-topped instrument, but you get a lot of nice overtones for chording and playing melodic lines.

Marty, in my experience, the maple instruments have a brighter, edgier tone over the walnut instruments. You can hear this in Sobells instruments as well as in other builders. Myrtle is actually my favorite tonewood for octaves (and for guitars). I think its highly under-utilized, and from what I understand is part of the walnut family.

[multidon]

Ok, so here's something I've always been curious about, if I may be permitted to broaden the discussion a bit.

Generally, we think of string instruments being made with a hardwood body and a softwood top. But sometimes they are made with all hardwood, and people seem to think that's ok. The first and probably most well known example is the all mahogany 15 series and old 17 series of guitars from Martin. These are pretty well loved. Another is all koa instruments, ukuleles but sometimes guitars too. I went to a Taylor Road Show several years ago and among the one offs they brought along was an absolutely stunning all walnut body guitars. They were extolling its sound as well as its appearance. And here is a mandolin example- The Mandolin Store apparently has an Eastman 415 made of all mahogany, top included. And crazy beautiful figured mahogany at that. It is truly lovely. Don't know about the sound though.

So, is there a question in here somewhere? Yes, several. Doesn't the use of a hardwood top fly in the face of conventional wisdom, that you need softwood on the top for the proper tonal characteristics? If you really need softwood, why do it at all? To put appearance over sound? Or do certain hardwood species sound better than others when used for a top? I notice that you only see certain species used for instrument tops: mahogany, koa, walnut, even myrtlewood (Breedlove). But I have never seen any string instruments, guitar or otherwise, with a maple or rosewood top. Wouldn't an instrument with the entire body made of the same hardwood throughout be stronger and more stable than a softwood-hardwood combo, since the rates of expansion-contraction would be more consistent?

If it would be possible, and if it would sound good, I think an instrument made entirely of flame maple would be a thing of beauty! But I suppose that if it was a good idea, someone would have done it, right?

[Mandobar]

Don,

I think it depends on the bracing and the construction and the size of the instrument. I played an all walnut guitar once that had absolutely no sound, but I have played others that were very nice sounding. The all myrtle ukuleles I've played sounded great, but would an all myrtle guitar sound just as good?

There are lots of variables to be considered when building instruments. The selection of wood and combinations is something to consider along with the mechanics of building.

[fscotte]

The general rule of thumb is "light as can be while being as stiff as can be". So you choose the wood for the top with those two factors in mind. Spruce has always been in that category, one of the highest stiffness to weight ratios around.

We need light tops because we want more volume, tone, sustain, etc..

Guitars are a tad different because they have these huge long strings that generate alot more "oomph" than a small and short string like on a mandolin. So more "oomph" means you may be able to get away with using a heavier wood for the top.

And besides, if Steinway pianos use sitka spruce soundboards, why would ya wanna do anything different?