Fret side marker dots - how-to questions

[Ron McMillan]

I want to put fret side marker dots on my mandolin.

The custom instrument in question was delivered with bad overspraying that all-but hides the existing dots. As well as being on the other side of the world, the builder is not interested in helping (the list of other failings in the $4000-dollar instrument is long, but for obvious reasons, cannot be discussed here). I have spent parts of the last couple of years addressing various shortcomings. Now it's time for side dots.

For a while, a hole punch and masking tape did the job, but soon, the tape adhesive failed and the dots disappeared.

I really want to find a way to add durable, easy-to-see markers on the side of the neck. So far, the only supplier I have found is here. Does anyone have experience of this product? (The photos on the web page make the dots look rough-edged, but I think this is due to bad photography).

Because the neck is already varnished, I would have to put the new dots on top of that varnish. Without some kind of coating going on top, I suspect that the stick-on dots would eventually be worn off by my left hand the same way my masking tape dots were.

Can builders recommend a thin, clear-coat varnish that I could put over the new dots that would not look terrible, and the application of which would not confound a bloke working in his shed without much by way of tools?

The neck cannot be sanded down before the new dots are added. It is finished carbon fibre.

Thanks in advance.

[pops1]

You can get dot material from stu mac that is easy to add. You can also use masking tape with a hole punched in and put fingernail polish in the hole for a fairly permanent dot. I have had fingernail polish on a mandolin for at least 15 years with no change. It can easily be taken off should you decide to.

[mirwa]

A link on how to do this

http://www.mirwa.com.au/HTS_Install_Fret_Markers.html

[Dave Hanson]

Of my 2 Gibsons, one has no fretboard position dots and the other one has no side position dots, it's amazing how quickly you get used to this, now I never even think about it when playing.

Dave H

[Walt]

I installed side dots on a mandolin a few of weeks ago, and it is definitely a DIY friendly job. Here is the material I used: http://www.stewmac.com/Materials_and..._Material.html
The material used is actually a small plastic rod. The side dots are actually inlaid into the fretboard rather than stuck on like a sticker. Don't worry, it's easier to install than it sounds. Here's a video showing the process. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jnNOfXGBKAs
You shouldn't need to apply any sort of clear coat over these dots.

[Explorer]

I really want to find a way to add durable, easy-to-see markers on the side of the neck. So far, the only supplier I have found is here. Does anyone have experience of this product? (The photos on the web page make the dots look rough-edged, but I think this is due to bad photography).

Can builders recommend a thin, clear-coat varnish that I could put over the new dots that would not look terrible, and the application of which would not confound a bloke working in his shed without much by way of tools?

I've used the Jockomo stickers on several instruments. I've been careful to apply them to the instrument with the inatrument clean and dry, and have had them last for years so far with no problems with no overcoat. One instrument with the blue abaline side dots gets a lot of thumb usage, and the dots are still going strong.

Keep in mind that the dots are 1/8" in diameter, which might be a little larger than your expectations if you are hoping to place them entirely on the edge of a fretboard.

Good luck!

[Ron McMillan]

Of my 2 Gibsons, one has no fretboard position dots and the other one has no side position dots, it's amazing how quickly you get used to this, now I never even think about it when playing.

Dave H

At the moment I, too, have one with, one without. And I much prefer to have side markers. Hence the question.

[Ron McMillan]

Thanks for the tips. Because it is an expensive custom instrument (and because I am no luthier), I have no plans to take a drill to it, hence my interest in learning whether stickers can have a decent working life, with or without a clear coat applied over them.

[Tavy]

Thanks for the tips. Because it is an expensive custom instrument (and because I am no luthier), I have no plans to take a drill to it, hence my interest in learning whether stickers can have a decent working life, with or without a clear coat applied over them.

If you really need to coat over the dots, then TruOil would probably be the product of choice - but it does require mechanical adherence to whatever is underneath, so you would need to be prepared to scrub down the fretboard edges with 0000 wire wool before wiping on TO, but other than that, if the existing finish is varnish rather than lacquer, then it would be a good choice.

[minuteman]

Use your hole punch and masking tape to make a stencil with the hole size you want. Tape it to your neck and use the paint of your choice. I used the little jars of modeling enamel but fingernail polish may work. After it dries, a couple of light swipes with steel wool to smooth it out.

Did this to a Suzuki mandolin with no side markers about 2 years ago. Dots are still there but could easily be removed with a razor blade shaving.

Edit: Test and practice the application on a piece of scrap first.

[MikeEdgerton]

For future reference if you ever do decide to drill. This page on Frank Ford's www.frets.com is the way I do it.

[MikeEdgerton]

There are also a few people selling stick on dots like these on eBay. I have no experience with any of them.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Fretboard-Ma...MAAOSw~AVYt2sM

[Folkmusician.com]

You might get by with a decal and then lacquer over it, but I would go the drill method. It is fairly safe with a pin vise. You would use super glue and get just a little squeeze out. Once sanded/polished the dots will look factory done.

If you want them perfect, a machine shop could do the holes for you, but using a ruler and being careful, should be fine.

[Walt]

If you don't want to drill, I'd just try the stickers without putting a finish over them. For me at least, applying a finish correctly on top of an existing finishing (even adding just a light layer) is a way more daunting task than drilling. As mentioned above, you would have to start off by scuffing up the existing finish to get the new layer to adhere. If you go the sticker-without-finish route, it is easily reversible if you don't like it. And it sounds like from Explorer's comment above, his stickers are holding up fine without the finish.

And if you opt to drill later, Mike's link above is a great resource (much easier to follow than the video I posted earlier).

[Ron McMillan]

Thanks for all the comments. I know it might strike better-qualified people as a simple task, but for someone whose skill set is extremely limited, drilling holes in the side of an expensive instrument is simply not worth considering.

I have ordered some stickers from Jockomo; I like them for their apparent ease of application, and for the option of removing them at a later date. If they last a long time, great. If they don't, I'll have enough spares to re-apply, and try to coat them with a little bit of lacquer (not varnish, as I previously stated).

Thanks again.

ron

[Billkwando]

Here's the low/no risk method I used for drilling (glow in the dark) side dots in my bass. I basically used a drill bit between my fingers, no power tools. You can totally wing it and do it safely.

[HoGo]

As I read OP, he says there ARE dots but are hidden under overspray...
Why not just clean the overspray from either edge of whole fingerboard (that the guy who sprayed the finish should have done) and perhaps apply a coat or two of clear to the edge?
Or just expose the existing dots and fill with clear lacquer? The latter can take no more than 30 minutes if CA is used to drop fill...

[Ron McMillan]

As I read OP, he says there ARE dots but are hidden under overspray...
Why not just clean the overspray from either edge of whole fingerboard (that the guy who sprayed the finish should have done) and perhaps apply a coat or two of clear to the edge?
Or just expose the existing dots and fill with clear lacquer? The latter can take no more than 30 minutes if CA is used to drop fill...

I have considered that, but the neck is carbon fibre, and the overspray is some kind of lacquer, whose reaction to cleaning - whether with a solvent or wire wool or some other way - I can't possibly anticipate. I know that stickers are the easy way out for an amateur, but I'm afraid this amateur's in no position to do this correctly. And since the maker has abandoned me and I am in faraway Thailand, the options are limited.

[HoGo]

I have considered that, but the neck is carbon fibre, and the overspray is some kind of lacquer, whose reaction to cleaning - whether with a solvent or wire wool or some other way - I can't possibly anticipate. I know that stickers are the easy way out for an amateur, but I'm afraid this amateur's in no position to do this correctly. And since the maker has abandoned me and I am in faraway Thailand, the options are limited.

The cleaning is typically done with scrapers or small razor blade along the fingerboard. you can scrape just the tiny circular amount right on the dots with tiny blade (reshaped exacto blade) and drop fill with clear CA. After the CA hardens you can scrape it carefully level with the finish and then sand with fine paper (600-1200-2000-3000 grits) and polish with some polishing compound if desired.
Have a look at frets.com. Frank Ford has lots of articles on repairs and drop filling dents or lacquer chips... This is not hard to do.

[Jeff Mando]

I have painted on side dots with a toothpick that has been carefully cut through it center with an x-acto knife. If you roll it gently on a smooth surface it will cut cleanly. You might need to remove micro-burr with an emery stick. put a drop of paint on a paper plate then where the paint is thinest, barely touch the toothpick into the paint, then carefully touch the neck where you want the dot, just barely touching it, and only once. I have done many cheapo guitars that way, and some good guitars, also and the results can't be told from inlay dots, if you do it right. If you don't do it right, have a rag with paint remover on standby and just do it again. The paint will last a long time.

[pops1]

Fail safe--- punch a hole in a piece of masking tape the size of the dot you want, place it on the fingerboard, centered, put a drop of fingernail polish on and wait until nearly dry and remove the tape. The dot is round looks very good and has been on my Gibson for nearly 20 years.

[Billkwando]

I have considered that, but the neck is carbon fibre, and the overspray is some kind of lacquer, whose reaction to cleaning - whether with a solvent or wire wool or some other way - I can't possibly anticipate. I know that stickers are the easy way out for an amateur, but I'm afraid this amateur's in no position to do this correctly. And since the maker has abandoned me and I am in faraway Thailand, the options are limited.

I think my method I mentioned above would work well for you. As a matter of fact, you don't even need to replace the side dots. You could just poke the center of where the dot should be with a pin or thumbtack, and then use my drill bit method to clear just enough material from the top to make the dot visible. That way, you're only "scraping" a circular hole, and not the side of the fingerboard/fret area. You really wouldn't even need to finish over the exposed dots. I think it would look fine. When I did the very first dot on my bass, I only removed enough material to see that it was working, so I could change my mind and still have a perfectly functional dot, if I wanted to. Being me, I forged ahead anyway, and everything turned out fine.

I would do the Luminlay thing on my own mandolin, except with my screwy playing technique, the mandolin is in such a position that I can see the front of the fingerboard more than I can actually see the side dots....so it would be of limited usefulness to me currently.

Speaking of, is it just my mandolin, or are others missing the side dot on the 3rd fret? That makes my OCD kick in a little when I look at it. Makes me want to put a dot there too.