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Thread: Old vega top - warping or not?

  1. #1

    Default Old vega top - warping or not?

    I have recently acquired an old (1920's-ish) Vega A-style. On either side of the oval sound hole the top appears to be puckering up. *But*, the change appears to be uniform and the neck joint is tight. The intonation is about perfect. I've seen how old mandolins will bow under the tension of the strings. But I'm wondering if this is different, if it was designed this way.

    And second, if this is a tension related change, would there be a solution? I have one in mind, but I'm not sure if it will work or if I'm just wasting time.

    Any thoughts or insights are greatly appreciated.

  2. #2
    NY Naturalist BradKlein's Avatar
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    Default Re: Old vega top - warping or not?

    Sounds like this is a flat-top mandolin. You'll get good advice here at the Cafe, but you'll need to upload some photos.
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  3. #3
    Mando-Accumulator Jim Garber's Avatar
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    Default Re: Old vega top - warping or not?

    The cylinder back Vegas often had top warpage which I believe was due to a design flaw with the inlaid pickguard. That would only be on the pickguard/treble side of the top, tho.
    Jim

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  4. #4
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    Default Re: Old vega top - warping or not?

    Did Vega, possibly, ever try a cylinder-top design? Without photos, that's what it sound like.
    - Ed

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  5. #5
    Registered User Tavy's Avatar
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    Default Re: Old vega top - warping or not?

    Not designed that way, and a common problem: there is an inherent weakness in the top when someone cuts a dirty great big (sound) hole in it. Over time they do distort there, and that allows the neck to rotate forwards - so eventually the action can increase to the point of unplayablility even though the neck-body joint is sound.

    There is a relatively easy fix, involving damping the underside of the top where it's distorted, and slowly clamping it back to shape, then adding some small longitudinal braces either side of the sound hole to try and prevent recurrence of the issue. It's unlikely to improve the neck angle much of one that's gone too far already, but should stabilise things long term. It's a relatively common repair on old bowl backs, and seems to have no/little noticeable effect on sound, probably because we're just putting back stiffness where it should have been originally:

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    Now the open question is whether you need to do anything - you certainly don't need to run to the nearest luthier right away- this is a long slow problem that (probably) just very gradually gets worse over a period of time. So if you're thinking of getting some work done anyway, then this is a fairly routine repair that could be added to the TODO list. Though if the distortion gets worse between strings slack and strings up to pitch, then it's definitely something to get fixed. Otherwise you will have to use your judgement!

  6. #6

    Default Re: Old vega top - warping or not?

    Thanks for all the responses. John, (I visited your facebook and web page) thanks for the spot-on assessment. For about the past fifteen years I have occasionally looked for and found old mandolins in severe distress and made them playable. Not really knowing what I was doing, they only held together for a while. Aside from the issue at the sound hole, this mandolin is in the best shape of any that I have owned. I was thinking that slowly clamping the sides of the sound hole and then adding something to stiffen it. I was thinking bridge plate. But I see on you picture that you have a brace in there. So, I will go ahead and proceed with that. I really appreciate your knowledge and experience with this problem and will shortly post about another very old mandolin that I'm working on. Again, thank you very much. - Kip

  7. #7
    Mando-Accumulator Jim Garber's Avatar
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    Default Re: Old vega top - warping or not?

    Quote Originally Posted by EdHanrahan View Post
    Did Vega, possibly, ever try a cylinder-top design? Without photos, that's what it sound like.
    Only on guitars (here is mine):

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    The Howe-Orme instruments were made that way as well with cylindrical arched tops, likely steam-bent (not carved).
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  8. #8

    Default Re: Old vega top - warping or not?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Garber View Post
    Only on guitars (here is mine):

    Click image for larger version. 

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    The Howe-Orme instruments were made that way as well with cylindrical arched tops, likely steam-bent (not carved).
    No idea about making the back like that but the tops don't require steam. They are so thin, they can be pressed to that shape easily. I know, I've made many.

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    I did once see a flat backed large bodied mandolin shaped Howe Orme with a cylinder top on eBay.com. I wish I'd saved a photo as it was unlike any Howe Orme mandolin I'd ever seen before. It had a pressed cylinder top and a fixed bridge like a guitar. It may well have been an early HO, I seem to recall this one was also marked "Ottowa" where as it seems many have a Boston origin.

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  9. #9
    Mando-Accumulator Jim Garber's Avatar
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    Default Re: Old vega top - warping or not?

    I know it may not be relevant to the OP's question but for those interested, here is a link to a 1+ year old thread on Howe-Orme and similar designs.
    Jim

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