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Thread: Is it worth it

  1. #1
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    Default Is it worth it

    I have a Kentucky Km-630, do you think it's worth sending it off to be overhauled and upgraded, or would my money be better spent by saving to buy a nicer mandolin?

  2. #2
    Registered User sblock's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is it worth it

    This is always a difficult choice.

    This answer depends on what's actually involved. If by "overhauled" you simply mean to get your mandolin professionally set up, with a nice, level fretboard, proper nut/bridge slots and heights, a low action for good playability, and so on, then by all means go for the overhaul. Every mandolin deserves a good set up. This would be money well spent. However, if by "upgrade," you're imagining more serious work, for example, changing out the tailpiece or tuners, making changes to the carving of the tone bars or the top, changing the neck profile, and so on, then I'd advise you to save your money for a nicer mandolin.

    An intermediate level of intervention that you might consider is to replace the stock bridge with a higher-end one, like the Cumberland Acoustic or Randy Wood models. If you fit the bridge to the top yourself, you're just out the cost of the bridge, i.e., about $65. If you have it done in a shop, it might run you around $150 in all. However, the stock Kentucky bridges are said to pretty decent, so this might not make for much of an improvement. Again, you might want to save your money instead for a better instrument.
    Last edited by sblock; Apr-11-2017 at 11:33am.

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    Default Re: Is it worth it

    I second sblock.

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    Default Re: Is it worth it

    Much thanks, I was really thinking maybe a new bridge and nut plus a professional setup.

  7. #5

    Default Re: Is it worth it

    Modifying a music instrument away from factory specification destroys it's resale value.

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    Default Re: Is it worth it

    Quote Originally Posted by antiquemusic View Post
    Modifying a music instrument away from factory specification destroys it's resale value.
    I don't think a setup destroys anything, it should improve value as it will play and sound better.
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    Moderator MikeEdgerton's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is it worth it

    Modifying a music instrument away from factory specification destroys it's resale value.
    If that was true all Stradivarius violins would be worthless as I believe there is only possibly one that is original. It also depends on the instrument. If he was talking about stripping and refinishing a 1923 Gibson F5 it would be different but as much as some people may not want to believe it, there isn't a Saga Kentucky mandolin that has been built yet that can be called an antique.

    Beyond that, as pops1 has stated, setup isn't going to destroy anything. Frets wear out, bridges and nuts wear out, even tuners wear out. Keeping them "original" and making the instrument not playable doesn't make any sense.
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  12. #8
    Registered User sblock's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is it worth it

    Quote Originally Posted by antiquemusic View Post
    Modifying a music instrument away from factory specification destroys it's resale value.
    Categorical statements like this need more careful qualification! As the ironic saying goes, "All generalizations are false!"

    Nearly every Stradivarius violin (all but one!) has had its neck replaced, and this did nothing to lower the (incredibly high) resale value. Mandolins with added pickguards don't sell for less. Mandolins with good setups don't ever sell for less. Mandolins with upgrades to their bridges (CA or Wood), nuts, tailpieces (Allen; James), tuners (Waverly, Alessi, Rubner), and so on, don't sell for less.

    On the other hand, if you were lucky enough to own a 1922-24 Lloyd Loar-signed Gibson with original hardware in good working order, I would not advise "upgrading" it, because it has collectors' value purely due to its original condition. But if you played it every day for a living, and the hardware might require an upgrade anyway! Certainly, some of the top players (not collectors!) who own and play Loars have had the fingerboards replaced, or scooped, etc. They have changed the tuners. These changes might have reduced the resale value, or maybe not. But that is a different calculus altogether.

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    Default Re: Is it worth it

    I got to touch a 1924 F-5 but that's probably as close as I'll ever come to that!

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    Default Re: Is it worth it

    Also, my mandolin doesn't have much "value" other than the fact that I really like playing it and it's mine. Even if I attempted the work my self it probably wouldn't change.

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    Default Re: Is it worth it

    Quote Originally Posted by Mandofin View Post
    sending it off to be overhauled and upgraded, or would my money be better spent by saving to buy a nicer mandolin?
    Worth it how?

    The way I think about this is what do I want the outcome do be, what problem(s) am I solving. So if there is a list of issues with the mandolin, I would see about getting those things addressed. (I have never had a mandolin overhauled. If that is the same as a set up, then if you need one, by all means get it.)

    If the problem is that you are wanting a better mandolin, I don't think there is an amount of upgrading that will really satisfy you. (Wouldn't satisfy me!) I would get the nicer mandolin. Keep in mind, you said nothing about selling the old one. If you are keeping both (like I would), the first one still has those issues that you still have to address, and it may still make sense to get it set up, (or get the set up checked).

    If (as I have experienced) you are just looking to do something to revitalize your mandolin and make playing it feel new again, that is a whole 'nuther thing, and need not involve spending a lot of money. (new case stickers, new strap, new case, some new tunes, a new exercise, a mandolin photo shoot, playing with a new guitar player, joining a new jam, changing your brand of bourbon, etc.)

    I hope I am understanding things correctly here. Is this helpful?
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    Default Re: Is it worth it

    If you basically like your mandolin, why not pop for a bridge, after all, this is a hobby for most of us. I'm going through the thought process myself with my MK. On one hand, I bought it cheap so why not invest in the fun of trying to make a surprisingly decent mandolin better? On the other hand, I bought it cheap so why not just enjoy it and save my money?

    My trip to Gryphon yesterday just enforced the reality that to get very much better, I'm going to have to spend rather big bucks. I'll probably go for the fun factor and cut a bone nut and get a CA bridge. I've had several bone nut blanks in my parts box for twenty years, so why not? I hate plastic.
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  19. #13
    Innocent Bystander JeffD's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is it worth it

    Quote Originally Posted by antiquemusic View Post
    Modifying a music instrument away from factory specification destroys it's resale value.
    Which is only relevant if you are planning to sell it.

    Avoiding modifications because of resale value, (to me) is limiting what I can do in the present, because of some un-named future. I can't get what I want because someone I have never met might not buy my mandolin some time from now. So I will settle for almost what I want, in the hopes that that unspecified unknowable someone may pay more for it if and when at some point I want to sell. Without knowing how long I have to live with almost what I want.

    I get enough of that with compromises I have made with my house to keep its "value". Very frustrating. My laundry has to match the capacity of the house (number of bedrooms), not the actual need for laundry. The washer and dryer have to match in color, but dryers last twice as long as washers, so I can't get the color I want because it may not be available in the same shade when I replace the washer, better to get white, because white will always be available. There is no value in upgrading the kitchen because the new buyer will unhappy with it and want to do the it over anyway. Get a pool. Don't get a pool. ahhhhhh!
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  20. #14
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    Default Re: Is it worth it

    OK, time to get real. Say I have a Kentucky F style mandolin, any year, any model. I change the tuners to Waverly tuners. Changed from the original spec, is it worth more or less on the open market?
    "It's comparable to playing a cheese slicer."
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    "Bargain instruments are no bargains if you can't play them"
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  22. #15
    Registered User Tom Morse's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is it worth it

    Quote Originally Posted by MikeEdgerton View Post
    Say I have a Kentucky F style mandolin, any year, any model. I change the tuners to Waverly tuners. Changed from the original spec, is it worth more or less on the open market?
    More.

    I have a circa 1984 Washburn "Jethro Burns" M4S, F style. Year's ago, Maine mandolin maker Steve Ryder installed a Fishman bridge pick up. Then I was lucky enough to have Maine luthier Scott Connolly do a lovely set-up to it a few years ago. New frets with a better, harder grade of fret wire. Planed the neck. Set the string height just so. And then a couple years ago, after one of the prongs on my tailpiece snapped off, I ordered and installed an Allen forged tailpiece. Is it worth more than when I bought it? I'd have to say absolutely, but then I'd also have to ask, "Why would I ever want sell it?"

    If you love playing it, you'll never regret well thought out upgrades. Just don't paint it.
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  24. #16
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    Default Re: Is it worth it

    Quote Originally Posted by MikeEdgerton View Post
    OK, time to get real. Say I have a Kentucky F style mandolin, any year, any model. I change the tuners to Waverly tuners. Changed from the original spec, is it worth more or less on the open market?
    Isn't this kinda like remodeling a room in your house? Usually, the remodeling makes the house nicer for you, and may make it easier to sell, but you probably won't get all your money back out. The value of the house increases, but not by as much as you spend on it.

    If you put Waverly tuners on a Kentucky, you have probably improved the instrument, but it may have also been a bit of overkill, sorta like an all granite kitchen in a plain, small house. We got to this point with our first house, it was time to either stop upgrading or move on to another project house (we moved). Upgrades need to be commensurate to the house or the instrument, no?

    Necessary upgrades (working bathrooms or working tuners as opposed to non-functional ones) may be another matter, it's hard to sell a house or a mando without them.

    But spending money on a house or a mando isn't always about investments, you may want to do it because life is more pleasant for having the upgrade done, particularly if you like the house or mandolin. The way I look at it, spending $150 on minor upgrades on a mando doesn't cost much per hour over the amount of time you spend practicing and playing, even in a single year. Way cheaper than many other types of entertainment. And if you can do your own work, that lowers the cost of course.
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    Default Re: Is it worth it

    You couldn't expect to sell the instrument for enough to recover the additional cost of the tuners (even assuming no labor cost for installation). Then again, guys have been known put $10,000 worth of rims and tires on cars that are worth $2,000 .

  26. #18
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    Default Re: Is it worth it

    The question wasn't could I recover the cost of the tuners, the question was would it be worth more or less and the answer is it would be worth more. And yes, I love seeing a car that's worth less than the tires and wheels that are on it.
    "It's comparable to playing a cheese slicer."
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    "Bargain instruments are no bargains if you can't play them"
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  27. #19
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    Default Re: Is it worth it

    Quote Originally Posted by sheets View Post
    ...you may want to do it because life is more pleasant for having the upgrade done, particularly if you like the house or mandolin....
    Exactly.
    "It's comparable to playing a cheese slicer."
    --M. Stillion

    "Bargain instruments are no bargains if you can't play them"
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  28. #20
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    Default Re: Is it worth it

    If I put on waverly tuner so it would almost double what I paid for it.

  29. #21
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    Default Re: Is it worth it

    Quote Originally Posted by Mandofin View Post
    If I put on waverly tuner so it would almost double what I paid for it.
    I rest my case
    "It's comparable to playing a cheese slicer."
    --M. Stillion

    "Bargain instruments are no bargains if you can't play them"
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  31. #22
    Registered User Lane Pryce's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is it worth it

    It's worth it. Make it "yours." Lp
    J.Lane Pryce

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    Innocent Bystander JeffD's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is it worth it

    I think any modification on any mandolin is worth it if it makes the mandolin more fun for you to play, entirely irrespective of what it does or doesn't do to the resale value.
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  35. #24
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    Default Re: Is it worth it

    You can change any of the black parts on a violin without changing it's value. It is considered maintenance. I would think the same applies to a mandolin. You should be able to refret, change the bridge, tailpiece, nut, fingerboard and really not lower the value of the instrument. If they wear out or you put better material on it should be worth the same or more.
    THE WORLD IS A BETTER PLACE JUST FOR YOUR SMILE!

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  37. #25
    Mando accumulator allenhopkins's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is it worth it

    Quote Originally Posted by MikeEdgerton View Post
    ...is it worth more or less on the open market?
    Yes.

    More or less.
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