Printable View
I prefer reading notes to tablature (I learned notes first), and so I've been trying to find a notation software I like. (Musescore is too clunky for me, and sibelius is too expensive). Ran across this: https://www.fortenotation.com/en/ but don't know anyone who has used it. Thoughts?
I found musescore to be pretty easy and fast. You can pretty much type in notation as fast as you can write after a little while. I think our bass player has used forte, I'll send him a message and see what he says.
I have messed around with Musescore. There are a ton of youtube videos online that explain different features. I agree it's not all very intuitive to use.
Musescore is what several members of the local Irish/Scottish trad community use. Since they'll occasionally post the .mscz files, I started using it.
It's clunky, yeah. Like many open source projects it suffers from encrusted feature creep, with a UI designed by programmers and not UI experts. But it does okay for the basic fiddle tunes and pipe tunes I work with. If I did any serious multi-instrument scoring I'd probably bite the bullet and get Sibelius.
I use it mainly to adjust a few notes in an ABC file download from thesession.org, when a tune in that database is just slightly different from how it's played in local sessions. I've done a couple of full transcriptions by ear from a recording, although that's a tedious process because I don't do that very often. It would be just as tedious in Sibelius, so at least I'm saving some money here with free software.
I have been using Musescore now for most of my musicnotation. It is very like Sibelius, but is open source and free to use, though donations are welcome to the makers. It allows me to do anything I want to do musically (I am one of the Irish/Scottish community mentioned above). Looks a bit daunting at first, but lots of help online, and it aloows you to copy abc notation from any source then import it via a plug-in and it will convert the abc straight into a .mscz file. It allows exporting of its files in various formats, including pdf format, and this is usually the way I go with it. It also plays back your file to you as a midi file, and even this can be exported as an mp3. Does far more than I need.
I would love Musescore to have a lite menu feature. Something that would make it easy and intuitive to enter in a simple fiddle tune or celtic tune. For that matter, the same with Band in a Box. There is so much in these programs that just get in the way. Toggle it on or off, give the user a fighting chance to create simple melody sheets.
I have Sibelius & MuseScore, Notion, but only use Notion now until I’m getting complex, when I switch to Sibelius by exporting a MusicXML file to it. I’ve completely abandoned MuseScore because it’s so clunky.
I use Notion on the iPad as my main input, midi sound file generator and checking software.
The notion Mandolin sounds are fairly decent too.
I found it very quick and intuitive to learn to use.
Well, for what it's worth, my tutorial of Musescore 2.1 basics, attempts to get right to the point, showing how to write a simple melody - these are the basics I use for writing fiddle tunes and simple songs. My tutorial is for MuseScore version 2.1 though, I have not yet had any reason/desire to switch to the newest version 3, so I have no idea how much might have changed.Quote:
Originally Posted by Gary Leonard
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zwnO-OfJUnA
(or direct link)
I did screw up on one thing though, :crying: at 17:15 in the above video where I was doing it stupidly ~:> (I didn't know any better at the time) :redface: so I had to issue a CORRECTION/addenda, the correction is only 23 seconds long:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hjAMOQtwepE
(or direct link)
No, I don't monetize those videos, and there are no ads. I make them just as a hobby, in the hopes they might help people write tunes and songs. YMMV.
Agree.Quote:
Originally Posted by Gary Leonard
As to backing-track apps, my two cents: If you happen to be using a Windows computer, I'd recommend trying Chordpulse (it's Windows only, for some unknown reason). IMO and in my limited experience, Chordpulse is a whole lot easier to get started with, much less frustrating, much more user-friendly, and a whole lot more affordable than Band-in-a-Box. I doubt anyone's making hit records with Chordpulse MIDI sounds but that's not what it's for, it's for quickly and easily making your own backing tracks to help you learn tunes and explore new rhythms and whatnot. (Beats the heck out of a metronome, for sure.)
You probably won't even need a tutorial to get started using it - just click the chords you want. It does have other features that you can explore at your leisure but those more-advanced features are *not* required to just quickly make a backing track to play along with for practice.
My only gripe about Chordpulse is that the 'snare' drums (which can be turned off or turned down) seem to be EQ'd rather shrill, :( or maybe it's just my ears picking up more high-frequencies, but some of the drum sounds are intolerably annoying. I deal with it by going into the Chordpulse "Mixer" (in the "Play" menu, easy to get to, just two clicks) and turning the darn snare off or reducing its volume - you can selectively do that without turning down/off all the drum sounds). I'm still inclined to think it's an issue with Chordpulse rather than something with my ears, because I don't get that snare shrillness with other apps such as the Hydrogen drum machine (which I'm assuming also uses MIDI sounds but I could be wrong).
Anyway, NFI.
Oh and incidentally, I've just recently been exploring another backing track app - iRealPro for Android phones (maybe works on other phones too, I'd have to look it up), and it's ok I guess, but... iRealPro doesn't seem to have as many options as Chordpulse (or maybe I just haven't quite figured out how to use iRealPro in its maximum capabilities yet, that's always a possibility) and iRealPro seems a tad more difficult to figure out how to make it do stuff. The iRealPro interface somewhat reminds me of Band-in-a-Box, which (in my case) is not a selling point. :whistling: But nevertheless, I'm keeping iRealPro on my Android device anyway, who knows I might take a liking to it someday, and in the meantime it's something different to explore once in a while. Chordpulse doesn't work on Android anyway, so with iRealPro I can tinker around with ideas for tunes/songs even if the only thing I have handy is my phone (and my little earbuds so I don't annoy everyone else with my audio experimentation). :))
JL277z, thanks for sharing Chordpulse, I'd never heard of it!
I'm also glad to know I'm not the only one who finds musescore clunky. I downloaded Forte while they had a free trial deal going, and it seems to be okay so far (especially at a price point of $0)
Forgot about this nice heads up for MuseScore. I too have found it clunky but it is very powerful. I have found many standards are available in Musescore, which I find very useful, especially as they are not available in ten format.
thanks so much
I love Musescore too!
I think the best part is the HUGE user-written library.
It’s Classical biassed of course (copyright in the Modern World), but if you can find a song or tune on it then you can add a tab track for mando.
Beginners’s paradise.
And there’s MORE.
A lot of the music is written for many parts so you can get the Tab for harmonies and play along, getting the feel of tunes in a harmonic sense.
-does Notion have a mandolin fretboard input for touch screen, and can you write out TAB with it? I’m wondering too if it’s possible to import a file from the Musescore website...Quote:
Originally Posted by Beanzy
i've never looked at tab options as I tend not to use it.
I was really answering the original poster requirements as they are similar to mine.
I think for your needs it might be one for tabledit which I used to use for converting stuff I could only find tab for.
I rarely use tab, and using ABCexplorer, I can enter a page of sheet music into ABC, with chords and ornaments, in around five minutes or less, proofing via playback included. I've written out four-voice pieces (Carve That Possum), so I know ABC can handle complex sheet music. About the only thing I've been stumped with lately is how to write an octave up notation (8ve - - - - - ) onto the printed page, and I have an idea or two how to brute force that. That all said, those of you who use Musescore, what major advantages could I expect if I were to use Musescore versus ABC? Frankly, if it involves mouse use, I'll pass. As a touch-typist from way back, I enjoy the speed of simply typing notes right into the tune without messing with a mouse.
I agree that MuseScore is clunky but I found that after a long time of use, it became easier and easier. The only reason I continue to use it rather than any other notation software is because of their extensive online help. Whenever I have trouble finding something within MuseScore, it only takes a quick google search to solve my problem.
MuseScore has a wealth of keyboard shortcuts, check this out:Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob Ross
https://musescore.org/en/handbook/keyboard-shortcuts
As for other advantages compared to ABC specifically, I like hearing the Midi playback when I'm comparing a transcription I'm writing to the source audio. Mostly though, because I operate in a musical "ecosystem" of other Irish/Scottish trad players, the ability to input music via ABC and output via sheet music is hugely useful in archiving and distributing music to other people I'm playing with. Some of them, especially those in the Scottish piping tradition, will only look at sheet music and nothing else.
On the other hand... my fiddler S.O. is very fluent in ABC, and she usually prefers doing a minor edit to something we've downloaded from thesession.org tune database in ABC. Then I have to throw it into MuseScore to crank out the dots so I can read it, since I don't read ABC myself. :)
So I can appreciate the advantage of ABC notation if you're working quickly. Horses for courses. MuseScore is a free download; it wouldn't take long to find out if it's useful or not.
ABCExplorer (and most ABC programs) prints out good quality sheet music directly or as various format digital files and plays MIDI in multiple voices. I can't actually play the ASCII characters, I play the dots. I have a rather large collection of tune books I've put together as single files. I collated all the local pick-up contra band sets and put them into ABC, and the PDF files that result can be printed or put on a tablet, thus ending up as the de facto librarian. (I did it for selfish reasons: I'm running at peak load at 120BPM, and I just couldn't read other folks' handwritten tunes at that speed.) I spend waaay too much time tracking down obscure Irish, Scottish, bluegrass, old time, English, and fife tunes, each going into appropriate tune books for practice down/on the road.
I looked over the Musescore link, and I couldn't immediately see anything that it did with less work than I'm doing now. I'm guessing either Musescore or ABC will do most of the same things, just in different ways:Mac or PC, Boeing or Airbus, Android or iOS, it's all what you get used to. Unfortunately, I don't have enough fresh brain cells left to learn a whole new programming language anymore, I think I'll just stick with ABC.
Does ABCExplorer show a sheet music format when playing back as Midi output? That's one of the things I like about MuseScore; when transcribing from an audio source or looking at a new piece I'm not familiar with, I can see the flow of the music in the dots and (to a certain extent) hear it in my head. My fiddler S.O. probably hears the music in her head when looking at ABC text, but I haven't developed that ability.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob Ross
From memory, yes Abcexplorer does show notation while playing.
Here’s a list of some apps some quite dated etc, https://abcnotation.com/software
I’ve just found an old app called TunePal on my iphone. You play a tune to it and it tells you what it is, plus some similar tunes.
For example I play ‘Happy Birthday to you’ and Tune Pal tells me it’s Planxty Hewlett. Cool.
‘oh’, it’s the way he plays it!’
As mentioned, ABCexplorer lets you play the midi while watching the sheet music, and you can go ahead and change notes while it's playing the tune. I'll try to paste a screen shot of the working page. The program is a bit long in tooth, but it gets the job done nicely.
The screen is reminiscent of an old DOS program, which I'm sure is what it started as. The upper left shows a pane of all the different files you have open; each file can contain hundreds of tunes. If you click on a file, it shows all the tunes in it, if you click on a tune, it shows information about the tune you are working with. The lower left pane is a "Temporary List", where you can pull out tunes from the file you're working with to create a new file or print out a quick tune book of selected tunes.
Attachment 180344
In the upper right is the text entry window for the particular song you are editing, where all the cryptic ( c>AF>E (3ABA (3CB,A, | G,>B,G>D A,>CF>A |) text goes. In the lower right is the sheet music version of the ASCII text you have entered. Pretty much soon as you have typed in a letter, it shows up as a dot. At any time, simply hit the play button, it starts at the beginning and plays. You can highlight just the line you're working on and just play that to find any errors. It doesn't "follow along" by highlighting whatever it is playing like TEFviewer or TablEdit does, you just eyeball the notes as they get played. Works for me.
As other folks have mentioned, ABC is a much older format, and there is only limited updates or newer programs created for it. That said, there's bazillions of ABC tune files out there, and there are different ABC programs that will work with just about any operating system currently existing. I run ABCexplorer under Windows 7 with no problem, and use the Tunebook app on my iPhone and iPad to create/edit tunes on the road.
Even if you don't want to learn how to enter music or edit tunes in ABC, just having one or two of these programs around lets you download tons of files with many, many tunes, and then you can listen and print out tunes to your hearts desire. There is SOOOO much music out there. Hope this helps.
Thanks Rob, I agree, some of those old programs are still pretty good, they still do the job.
I use Tunebook for iPhone too (I appreciate it’s simplicity though it would be nice to have a TAB display version), I have used that along with thesession.org and mandolintab.net
As you say, there is so much music about, particularly different, sometimes quite exotic versions of tunes. For this reason I now tend to use the tune collections that others have already put together. That way the versions in the collection often have some kind of musical meaning.
Here’s an example: https://www.village-music-project.org.uk/?page_id=84
I just downloaded Finale...it's pretty sweet.
Exactly! I love the older collections that are out there. I randomly clicked on one link, that of the Jackson Manuscript of 1823 in Lancashire. I know so many of those tunes from fife and drum or digging up older English tunes, but now I feel professionally compelled to learn "Capt. Ross’ Reel".Quote:
Originally Posted by atsunrise