Handed Down Mandolin

[klandy]

Hi everyone Im new to this site. I do not play the Mandolin but I thought I might could get some help here. I have an What is written on the instrament to be an imperial from cincinnatii. This was handed down to me recently from my grandfather who has had it for about 45 years. It was first handed down to him by my great grandfather. It is in great condition and has the original case with it. No scratches and still has original strings. It will play but I dont know how to tune it. No cracks or dents nothing. It has a number on the top end that reads 4667. Also on the back it says pat applied for. My grand father was told that it has ivory on the knobs and pearl on the edge. I can send more pictures to help describe it. Can anyone give any insight on what I have and when it could be made and by whom? 106682106683106684

[billhay4]

Don't tune it until you've had a luthier look at it.
Bill

[Randi Gormley]

No information, wanted to say it's a nice looking bowlback. How's the neck? Is it still straight? I had an older bowl I put away for 20 years and the neck twisted and bowed, making it unplayable. Hope yours has kept better shape!

I'll just make the observation that original strings from 50 years ago or more aren't what you'd want if you plan on playing this instrument. It's like having 30-year-old bread in your cupboard and bringing it out as a treat for guests. Just sayin'

[Bill Snyder]

I am just curious, what makes you think it has the original strings?
Most players that play very much change their strings every few weeks or months. Some change strings weekly.

[klandy]

The neck Is in great shape for what I can tell and when I said the original strings I guess I should have said that they are the same strings my great grandfather had on them when he passed it to my grandfather. Neather one played it or so I was told. I do not know where my great grand father got it. 106687

[Jim Garber]

Obviously it is an Imperial brand mandolin made in Cincinnati. :) Actually that is what it is. I don't know offhand (I can check to see what info I have). Mugwumps.com has a list of makers and it says circa 1880-1900. Most mandolins like this are from around the turn of the last century to the teens.

It looks to be in good shape but I concur with my colleagues here and I recommend that:

It should be checked out by a good luthier
The strings should be changed -- ultra light gauge is best and a reasonably-priced set is GHS A240 (available from juststrings.com).
Tuning is GDAE (low to high)
You should learn to play it.


This is a nice mid-range instrument and if it does not need much work, would be a nice playing one. It is not particularly valuable -- bowlbacks in the US are not all that desirable except from a few of us nutcases. However it is prob wellmade and not a piece of junk or a wallhanger.

[klandy]

Thanks Jim. Yes I would love to learn to play it. haha I was so afraid to even take it out of the case. What do you think about the pat applied for that is written on the back plate and what is the number at the top for?106688106689106690

[Capt. E]

Bowlbacks such as this are not terribly popular these days for anything but Italian folk etc. Even so, I would call this a higher end instrument, not mid-range. The inlay on the headstock and fingerboard is quite nice, very nice binding (the pearl around all the edges), 30+ ribs made of rosewood and a pretty tailpiece. I does look virtually unplayed. Many people here on the cafe would love to own it.
I would loosen the strings, but not so much as the bridge falls off (it is not glued on, but stays in place due to string tension).
When you get new strings and have it properly adjusted (called set-up), it will be a very nice mandolin to learn on.

[Capt. E]

The number on the top is a serial number. Pat Applied for is probably for the tuning hardware. By the way, while it is light in weight, it is not really fragile. They are meant to be played, after all. A local violin repair shop should know how to set it up. Don't take it to Guitar Center.

[mrmando]

Judging from the apparent distance between the strings and the fretboard in your first photo, it seems to have a bowed neck. I'd immediately loosen all the strings to minimize tension on the neck.

[klandy]

Ok Thanks everyone for your replies. You have all been very helpful!! I will loosen the strings and look at it again. I think when I looked before and touched the strings were pretty loose thats why I didnt want to touch it or even try to play in fear of breaking the strings. haha but now I feel more confident. Looks like i have a good piece of history and a neat story being its been passed down. Thanks again...who knows maybe ill learn to play and post a video!!
;)

[Jim Garber]

Capt. E: I termed it mid-range because the upper end ones are seriously ornate some with fluted and/or many-ribbed bowls and with much more inlay that that one. bear in mind that was the tradition back then. There were plain one but this one is not all that ornate, however I like the look of it. Of course, it is a matter of comparison.

It is hard to tell from that first photo, Martin, but you may be right about the action being high and the next being warped. That would be too bad.

[klandy]

Yall got me curious now. Cant wait to get home to look at it know that I kinda know what to look at!
Could the strings look that way if they are loose?

[JeffD]

Bowlbacks such as this are not terribly popular these days for anything but Italian folk etc. .

...but but what about classical? And of course early music, ren fests and such, and then there is Eastern European and Klezmer, and well all over Europe actually, and... I see them from time to time at contra dances and fiddle tune jams.

But yea, for bluegrass, not so much.

[OldSausage]

...but but what about classical? And of course early music, ren fests and such, and then there is Eastern European and Klezmer, and well all over Europe actually, and... I see them from time to time at contra dances and fiddle tune jams.


None of those people have any money.

[Capt. E]

Capt. E: I termed it mid-range because the upper end ones are seriously ornate some with fluted and/or many-ribbed bowls and with much more inlay that that one. bear in mind that was the tradition back then. There were plain one but this one is not all that ornate, however I like the look of it. Of course, it is a matter of comparison.

It is hard to tell from that first photo, Martin, but you may be right about the action being high and the next being warped. That would be too bad.

That's true, I mispoke a bit. I realize it is not one of the very very ornate fluted bowl high end mandolins. Mid-range is correct. I do hope the neck is not bowed or the top sunken. It would be great to learn to play on an instrument handed down from your gr-grandfather...really seriously cool.

[8ch(pl)]

Strings need to be very light. A set of modern Bluegrass mandolin strings will impart far too much tension to this type of instrument.

[klandy]

Well good news. The neck is not bowed nor anything else. The strings were already loose but I did find that who ever strung the instrament last had two strings crossed. I called up my grandfather to ask some questions and he said a while back when my mother was small he had a person look at the mandolin and play it. He said it played beautiful and the gentleman offered to buy it. Thank goodness he didnt sell it. The guy told him that if he wasnt going to play it for a while to loosen the strings so not to have tension so thats just what he did. I also asked him about the sting being crossed he said when he loosened the string he seemed to remember he had to put a string back on. He said he thought he installed it correctly. I asked him if it was played any after he had placed the string back on and he said no..that he left all strings loose and put it back in its case. (For about 40 Yrs)!! So this poor little guy has probly seen more sunlight in the past few days than in its life. hahah Thanks again everyone for your kind and helpful comments. Ill have to keep everyone updated because I am going to find someone to string it and look at it for me.

[Capt. E]

Great news. It apparently has been sleeping in the case waiting to be awoken by a Prince Charming...perhaps you.

I don't own a bowlback at present, but have enjoyed playing one from time to time. They do have a different sound than the more common and more popular carved mandolins you see today in bluegrass bands. They are usually sweet and resonant (think Italian music). I have heard that if a builder were to make one today, he would have to sell it for thousands of dollars to make any profit. It takes many hours to shape and fit all the ribs alone...even the rosewood of the same quality you see in your instrument is expensive. I do hope you decide to learn to play a song or two on it.

[JEStanek]

Jim cave you a spot on assesment of that mandolin including it's likely provenance (from Mugwumps.com). While the bowl back may not be as popular as the Gibson styled archtops in the US anymore, I'll say forget that and once you have your mandolin checked out learn to play it. It will be fun and connect you to your family.

It's a lovely mandolin.

Jamie

[JeffD]

Great news. It apparently has been sleeping in the case waiting to be awoken by a Prince Charming...perhaps you. ... It takes many hours to shape and fit all the ribs alone...even the rosewood of the same quality you see in your instrument is expensive. I do hope you decide to learn to play a song or two on it.

Yes its great news. From the looks of it, that mandolin can provide some amazing good fun to you or to the lucky person that gets to play it.

In a way its kind of a shame it has not been played and enjoyed for 40+ years. On the other hand, that is why its in such good shape. Don't let another 40 years go by!! That thing yearns to be played.