F2 in classifieds

[Jim Nollman]

This one (http://www.mandolincafe.com/ads/67767) is the most expensive F2 I've ever seen. Right up there with the most paradisal quality F4s.

It made me wonder if this will be the price for an average F2 ten years from now? Anyway it caught my eye that the purported highest end of an F2, is being priced about the same as the highest end of an F4.

[mrmando]

One of very few F2s with a Virzi, anyhow...

[FL Dawg]

No discount for the repaired scroll, apparently :)

[allenhopkins]

I like the line that "Loar's innovations are evident throughout this mandolin." Where -- other than the Virzi, which Loar liked, but was hardly "his innovation"?

The idea that Lloyd Loar thoroughly redesigned every single model of Gibson mandolin, during this tenure there, would have to be explained to me in more detail.

How does this F-2 differ from a "pre-Loar" or "post-Loar" F-2? Inquiring minds want to know...

[mrmando]

Shut up and eat your Loarflakes... :grin:

[Gary Hedrick]

Oh the "Loar mystique" has rubbed off on all instruments during those years.....and even stretches back to 1921 and has been used on 1925 F4's etc. Marketing at its best

While I'm sure Lloyd might have had some influence on the 4's I think he was more of a front man.....and yes there are some innovations that he patented but for the F4's and F2's .....hmmmm that is a stretch to me....unless he dictated the truss rod and the slimmer necks

One could read the books and perhaps get a little different slant but as I remember upon reading the craftsmen of the time and some of the management were the true innovators.......(now let the virtol spew forth)

[hank]

For me there is a huge improvement in playability of instruments of this time. The truss rodded narrower neck is a refinement for the player who prefers the ability to fret two adjacent string sets with one finger in lieu of the wide guitar like string spacing of models before. The F5's, F4's, F2's and Snake head and non Snake head A models of this period have this distinctive change in neck geometry and playability. I have a 1913 A4 that is great in a lot of ways, loud, great tone etc. but is a bear(for me)to play compared to my 1923 F4. If you prefer wide string spacing and baseball bat neck instruments of the pre truss rod designs the changes made won't be appreciated. In reality the tone and volume is slightly better on my A4 but I'll pick the F4 over it every time because it's such a pleasure to play. I also have a great playing modern F5 Goldrush that is very similar to my F4 string spacing but with the F5,s 16 degree break angle at the bridge. I think Mrmando's point about the Virzi might explain the F4 pricing of an F2.

[Jim Nollman]

I have never played a mandolin with a Virzi. From what I am told about how it modulates tone, i think i would probably like the effect it would have on the sound of my dry-dry F5. but for the same reason, I suspect I wouldn't like it added to my oval hole jazz mandolin.

Thinking logically, I am wondering if this F2 is, today, such a rare mandolin, because others have also felt the same way as i do about not wanting a Virzi with an oval hole or round hole mandolin.

But as these things sometimes happen, someone at Gibson during the 1920s had the wherewithal and the curiosity to test this combination of F2 and virzi "just to be certain" that it might not be a good sell. The fact that this combo has not become more common since this test was made, seems to say a lot.

[lenf12]

A couple of things about this particular F-2 strike me as justifying a somewhat higher than market price. The Virzi is extremely rare in F-2s, the back and sides are figured maple like and F-4 rather than birch typically used on F-2s, and the condition appears to be excellent. Also, dealer prices are usually higher from reputable dealers. I don't think it quite justifies the $8250 asking price but Charles may be up to some dickering on this one I'm guessing.

Len B.
Clearwater, FL

[pheffernan]

I have never played a mandolin with a Virzi. From what I am told about how it modulates tone, i think i would probably like the effect it would have on the sound of my dry-dry F5. but for the same reason, I suspect I wouldn't like it added to my oval hole jazz mandolin.

Interestingly, when I bought my old Gibson oval, I was told the exact opposite. The virzi reputedly enhances an oval mandolin in the orchestra but robs a solo F5 instrument of some power.


Thinking logically, I am wondering if this F2 is, today, such a rare mandolin, because others have also felt the same way as i do about not wanting a Virzi with an oval hole or round hole mandolin. But as these things sometimes happen, someone at Gibson during the 1920s had the wherewithal and the curiosity to test this combination of F2 and virzi "just to be certain" that it might not be a good sell. The fact that this combo has not become more common since this test was made, seems to say a lot.

From what I understand, a virzi was an option at additional cost which would not appeal to most budget shoppers considering an F2.

[Kurto]

I have never played a mandolin with a Virzi.

BBM I am not sure that you have missed much. I had a chance, about 15 years ago, to spend some time with an all original '23 or '24 F5 w/Virzi. It was pretty disappointing. It was weak and thin sounding. No bark. No growl. No bite. After about an hour, I gave it back to the owner. I could have played it all day, but didn't want to. All I could think of was how much better it might sound with the Virzi removed. Maybe it would sound the same, who knows?

Does anyone know of a Virzi-Loar that sounds awesome?

[Gary Hedrick]

I owned a David Grisman cast off 1924 F4 that I bought from Carmel Music (back when Dexter has the store).....it had a great neck and a Virzi....the volume was a bit understated but the tone had a difference to it (if that makes any sense)...

Nice instrument......