Gibson F truss rod frozen

[Chip Booth]

Hi all, I have a '99 Fern that needs the neck adjusted, but when I opened it to do so it seems the truss rod is frozen or at least very tight. A friend of mine who is an amateur luthier (guitars only) looked at it and was afraid to crank on it any more than I was. He doesn't really have any significant experience with mandolins, but he is the most knowledgable repair guy for many miles around. Any suggestions for me before I have to take this to the big city to have something done?

[pathfinder]

Have you (or any previous owners) adjusted it before now?

[sunburst]

What do you mean by "frozen"?
Can you loosen the nut? If so, does anything happen? The neck should bow forward even more.

I have seen truss rods that were "frozen" by glue that accidently leaked into the slot and glued the rod in place. I've also seen a truss rod intentionally glued in by an inexperienced luthier that didn't know better. If that happens, the rod won't work.

If the rod is very tight and the neck still needs adjustment, the rod isn't going to do it. It needs to be repaired so that the rod will work.

If you bought it new, Gibson will surely help you out.

[Chip Booth]

I have not adjusted it before. I bought it used and don't know whether it was ever moved though it seems unlikely. There was a lot of glue all over everything in the cavity and we had to clean it up some to even get a tool on the nut. I don't believe we were able to move the nut in either direction but I can't remember for sure as it's been a few weeks since I tried it.

[evanreilly]

I speak from sad experience; don't force the nut on the rod. If it is glued/laquered/rusted and frozen, it will very possibly break if forced.
Take it to an authorized Gibson service center. But call them first.

[Frank Ford]

This is a fairly common problem, and an easy one to overcome, most of the time. The real issue is to get the nut OFF the truss rod. If you can back it off, then you can apply some nice white lithium grease ("Lubriplate") if you have some, or pretty much any grease or oil to the nut and screw threads. That usually corrrects the problem, and prevents truss rod breakage.

[sunburst]

Sometimes instruments are sprayed (finished) without masking off the truss rod pocket. The finish can build up to the point where you can't easily put a tool on the nut to turn it. Are you sure there was glue in there, or could it have been lacquer?

Anyway, if the rod is glued, it might turn into a major repair, so If you can determine that that is definately the problem, you could try something I've tried in the past that has worked for accidentally glued rods:

Obtain a piece of 3/16" drill rod, (what the truss rod is made of) threaded on one end with 10-32 threads. Also, a coupler nut so that you can screw the nut on the end of the truss rod, and screw the piece of drill rod into the coupler nut so that it extends out from the truss rod pocket.
Next, take the tip out of a soldering iron that is the right size for the 3/16" drill rod. Slip the barrel of the soldering iron over the piece of drill rod and tighten the set screw. Plug the soldering iron in and watch constantly as the truss rod heats up 'til the glue melts.
It can take several tries before the rod frees up and stays that way, but, as I said, that's worked for me in the past.
It can help if you tighten and loosen the nut on the rod as it cools. That keeps the rod in motion so that the re-hardening glue has a hard time sticking to the rod again.

[Jim Rowland]

One possibility is that the truss rod is already broken and that somebody has pulled some frets,drilled some holes and pumped glue in. Believe it or not,some have recommended this as a fix for a broken and rattling rod. I guess it does fix the rattle.
Jim

[mikeh]

Some of you may recall my story back in October posted here about my journey to owning a new Fern. The original purchase I made was a '99 Fern. It too needed what I thought was a "neck adjustment".Later on about 6 weeks ago, It was told to me that the Fern necks from this time frame have chronic problems related to the technique used for putting the trussrods in. I was discussing my story with a luthier from this area who mentioned something like they may have briefly used a bolt in the dovetail area similar to the Weber design. Not a true bolt on neck per se, but an apparent issue also. I'm not sure Gibson is happy with the instruments from this period despite thier awesome tone. I would definitely talk to Charlie or Big Joe about this instrument.

[Chip Booth]

Thanks all for the advice. The rod was glued and gunked up with all kinds of things and we had to clear it all away before we discovered the nut had been tightened as far as it would go and both the washer and wood in the cavity had imploded a bit. With some not so gentle prodding, heat, and a few tricks to keep the rod from twisting we freed up the nut. Then the washer was changed and the wood in the cavity starightened up a bit and the neck is now in good shape. Let's hope scooping the fretboard extension goes as smoothly.

[Mando Medic]

I just sent a Bush back to Gibson with the same issue. I had tightend the truss rod to the point that I was afraid it would break and still the fingerboard had too much relief. I thought about just taking the nut off and adding a washer as I do on older Yamaha guitars, but then thought, why should I, it's under warranty. If my memory serves me right I think it was a 91. Anyone else have that problem on a Gibson? Kenc

[Clyde Clevenger]

When the bow in the neck got big enough to see from accross the room, I brought it in to Ken. It's been over a week now, I'm really missing it. The Givens is a fine mandolin, but it ain't no Bush. I was getting use to the really high
action, nobody else wanted to play it, twice. I just hope it comes back as loud and proud as it was. I was sitting in with a band in Washington a couple of years ago, a single mic gig. The soundmand asked me to turn the mandolin down a little, he couldn't hear the banjo. True story. Is it done yet???

[jim simpson]

If a particular mandolin were already considered to be loud model, would the action affect the volume much?

[sunburst]

No, unless it is too low to allow agressive playing without severe buzzing. If that's the case, higher action will allow louder playing, but won't make the mandolin itself louder.

[Clyde Clevenger]

Yes.

[Mando Medic]

By the way, it's a 01' not a 91', Duh! And yes, raising the action and mandolins will help in increasing the volume. Kenc