Fingertip Callouses (a theory)

[keebler]

Ok, so I have been practicing this method for a few years with success. This theory stemmed from rock climbing, where callouses that would build up would get ripped off by way of sharp rock and leave you with raw, sometimes bleeding skin. To deal with this, we would sand down the callouses so they would not build up and come off.

I had always heard rumors of some string players getting such tough callouses that they would peel off and then super glue them back onto their finger to keep playing for the night.

So I figured, that when my finger tip callouses got really hard I would sand them down a bit. I know this sounds contradictory, but in reality, you are removing the dead skin. Follow me here, once you removed the dead skin, you are left with new skin BUT the new skin has been 'trained' to be tougher so you will no longer build up 'callouses' but you will have supple 'tough' skin that is not hard but mailable.

This is a regular 'maintenance' that I do when I start to feel my finger tips getting tough skin. So instead of letting it build up and come off all at once, I'm removing it regularly so it never builds up.

I just think of skin like a muscle, you CAN build up strength. :mandosmiley:

Just wanted to put this out there for others to see and comment on. ~o)

[sunburst]

My "theory" is that a tough, calloused fingertip is much more firm than a non-calloused fingertip. I find that I can play much more accurately and with much less effort if I have good callouses so that my fingertips don't "pillow" over the sides of the strings. With a soft fingertip, the string doesn't start to depress until the fingertip has compressed enough to start the string moving, and a little more pressure puts the fingertip in contact with the fingerboard to the sides of the string. A firm fingertip starts the string moving quicker and will less effort, and the string can be fretted without an undue amount of fingerboard contact so less effort is required.

So, having callouses peel off in obviously not a good thing, but having a fingertip calloused enough to be firm is a good thing. Maintaining callouses through abrasion, if it keeps them from peeling off but leaves them firm, sounds like a good plan.

[Mandolin Mick]

My callouses peel, but never at once, one finger at a time. I've never noticed any difference in my playing if they're there or not. I play enough that they come back relatively quickly.

[SincereCorgi]

My calluses used to peel all the time, in the cyclical way the OP way saying where they'd build up and then come loose, but then at some point they just kind of stabilized into thick but somewhat springy skin. The sanding sounds like it would be a good approach.

What I really want to know is how to deal with the strings chewing through my left hand fingernails at jams...

[keebler]

so, having callouses peel off in obviously not a good thing, but having a fingertip calloused enough to be firm is a good thing. Maintaining callouses through abrasion, if it keeps them from peeling off but leaves them firm, sounds like a good plan.

exactly!

[Mike Bunting]

http://www.climbonproducts.com/climb-on/

[onawhim]

I do wonder as a woman if using creams daily has made mine tough but not dry? I have really never hard that hard dry finger tips - maybe different bodies do differnt things - maybe I dont play enough(1hr a day)!:confused:

[sunburst]

I had a girlfriend many years ago who was a gymnastics instructor. The gymnasts (girls) had serious callouses from some of the events, parallel bars in particular. They called it a "rip" when the entire callous would tear off of the palm of a hand(!) leaving them with no protection and making the events painful. Probably very similar to the problems rock climbers have. I bet they used creams and lotions...

[EdHanrahan]

My callouses peel, but never at once, one finger at a time. I've never noticed any difference in my playing if they're there or not. I play enough that they come back relatively quickly.

Same here, as long as I play a bit each day, say 30 min or so. Oddball schedules like travel & vacations create havoc by playing little than playing a lot, and having to start over!

My HEELS, on the other hand, are much like the OP's fingertips. As a runner, hiker, & skier, I'll develop a ridge around the edge. Pretty soon, it'll get REAL thick, dry, & hard, then crack, bleed, & peel... Yuck! So I rasp the ridge down every week or so to keep it flexible, plus rub in Gold Bond foot cream, pretty thick stuff, almost daily. GB is also great for fingertips!

[Mandolin Mick]

Ed,

If you're over the Hudson and thru the woods ... are you near Sleepy Hollow? I used to vacation there & Tarrytown.

[greg_tsam]

There are plenty of posts here on this subject. They rip off, crack, peel, protect us from evil...at least during Halloween. I have flat tips from all the callus that has built up over the years. If I hold them up to a light I can easily see where the finger ends and the callous begins. When mine crack I sand them with an emery board and they last forever. If I don't and just cut them off with my pocket knife it leaves an uneven surface. If I do neither they will crack and then rip off. I prefer maintaining them with sandpaper.

[Jim Garber]

I have been playing fretted instruments fro decades and have built in callouses that rarely peel, tho sometimes i get a small piece flaking off. I just bite it or cut it off and go on playing. Prob not so bad an idea, tho, to lightly sand when those appear.

I llive on the same side of the river as Tarrytown/Sleepy Hollow so I would guess Ed is in Rockland County, NY (tho we have never met--- I think).

[Ivan Kelsall]

Same here Jim. My callouses are hardly noticeable,they're more like very thick,tough skin.They do occasionally flake,so i sand the flakey bit off,
Ivan

[Ragazza]

Previously practiced violin, about six years. After about two weeks of pain, blisters, et al ,started wearing a golf glove.No more scars.Will never practice my mandolin without a glove. P. S. skin is an organ and cannot be strengthened, but you can toughen it using salt water soaks, but I would not.

[keebler]

P. S. skin is an organ and cannot be strengthened

Muscles are organs too and CAN be strengthened.

If skin could not be strengthened, then string instrument players would never be able to play longer than they could the first time they picked up their instrument. The skin on their fingertips has become stronger and less prone to tearing, ripping or bleeding.

[Darren Bailey]

I've read that it depends on your skin type. Some people's skin is naturally thinner than others and it's the thin sort that is more likely to peel. It's also related to skin colour - the darker the skin the thicker it tends to be and so less likely to crack and fall off. I've got quite dark skin and have never had my finger tips peel despite keeping a nice layer of thick callouses preventing mandolin wires from causing pain.

[Ivan Kelsall]

I don't know if the same is true of finger callouses,but despite wearing 'proper' shoes of correct width etc.,i have very thick skin on the side of the front joint on each of my big toes. A couple of weeks ago,i peeled it off & underneath was a layer of normal skin.It seemed as though the callouses had become separated from the lower layer of skin.I'm at a loss to understand why i get a build up of thick skin on my toes,as they aren't subject to any pressure,or friction. However, if i ever decide to play the mandolin with my feet - i'm one step ahead of the game !,:grin:
Ivan;)

[Bertram Henze]

I had always heard rumors of some string players getting such tough callouses that they would peel off and then super glue them back onto their finger to keep playing for the night.

That sounds so heroic it must be true :)) but I have never seen it.


I have been playing fretted instruments fro decades and have built in callouses that rarely peel, tho sometimes i get a small piece flaking off. I just bite it or cut it off and go on playing. Prob not so bad an idea, tho, to lightly sand when those appear.

Same here Jim. My callouses are hardly noticeable,they're more like very thick,tough skin.They do occasionally flake,so i sand the flakey bit off

That is the final truth to the theory. In the first years, your body detects increased stress on the fingertips and forms a fast-building callus (I like to call it callus 1.0) that is not very stable, though, and tends to peel off - obviously, your body assumes that the stress is temporary.
After some more years of stress your body takes it to the next level and builds callus 2.0: it looks exactly like normal skin, with a smooth surface, but it is much harder, it doesn't peel off.
I have it. To see it, I have to match fingers on both hands and see that my left fingers are "longer" than their right counterparts. You're able to play for hours without feeling anything, indeed you better say good bye to feeling anything ever again with those fingertips. If you think that is creepy, better stop practising NOW :cool:

[Mandobart]

Funny how the "how to get/keep callouses" thread keeps cooming back, like a callous. In the world of steel stringed instruments there are many theories/ideas/products that seek to provide a shortcut. I had some callouses from fiddle, then took up steel string guitar and they got harder. Then I took up mando, which peeled off the guitar callouses. The mando callouses are here to stay in my case; they don't peel and I don't think about them except when I give blood and offer my right hand tips to get a sample (they can't poke thru the left hand tips). Some weeks I'll have a 2 - 3 hour jam/practice, followed by a 3 - 4 hour gig the next day. On rare occasions the top-most layer of skin may peel, but the actual callous is ~ 2 - 3mm thick so I don't even notice. Think I mentioned once how a blind friend of mine gave up guitar because the callouses affected her ability to read (braille).

[Steve Ostrander]

I routinely sand my callouses lightly to smooth off the high spots that interfere with my fretting, but I never peel or cut the callous with a razor blade. That's just asking for an injury that will cause pain and suffering.

When I was learning guitar over 40 years ago I used to play until my fingers hurt, then put my fingertips on ice cubes to dull the pain so I could play longer. I actually played until I bled. With that kind of dedication, you would think I would've become a rock star....

[D C Blood]

[QUOTE=SincereCorgi;
What I really want to know is how to deal with the strings chewing through my left hand fingernails at jams...[/QUOTE]

Suggest cutting nails???:grin:

[Cue Zephyr]

If my calluses peel as they often do, I cut the peeled bit off with a nail cutter and file/sand the rest down. I didn't do it like the OP says, but more to prevent the bit of peeled skin that's left from catching onto something.

Sometimes I don't, and it just wears off with a bit of playing.

["Umm, fish?"]

I now take fish oil pills every day. My callouses never get hard and peel any more.

[rb3868]

I have been unable to play for the last 3 weeks due to an elbow injury. The other day I was surprised to realize I still had calluses intact. About two months ago, I started using Burt's Bees hand balm on them after practicing or when they felt dry. I believe that has made all the difference.

[CrazyMandolin]

I think using some sort of cream can have a big impact. I stumbled across "Guitar Hands" and it makes a big difference when I'm doing a lot of playing. I might normally wear through my calluses but they end up intact. I think the moisture is key and dryer calluses are more likely to wear down or flake away.

[JeffD]

That is the final truth to the theory. In the first years, your body detects increased stress on the fingertips and forms a fast-building callus (I like to call it callus 1.0) that is not very stable, though, and tends to peel off - obviously, your body assumes that the stress is temporary.
After some more years of stress your body takes it to the next level and builds callus 2.0: it looks exactly like normal skin, with a smooth surface, but it is much harder, it doesn't peel off.
I have it.

That is my understanding, and personal experience, as well.

[CES]

I had a girlfriend many years ago who was a gymnastics instructor. The gymnasts (girls) had serious callouses from some of the events, parallel bars in particular. They called it a "rip" when the entire callous would tear off of the palm of a hand(!) leaving them with no protection and making the events painful. Probably very similar to the problems rock climbers have. I bet they used creams and lotions...

Yep, did gymnastics for a few years as a kid...for guys high bar (especially), rings, and p-bars can all result in "rips." Knew a guy who would save all of his in a jar, and periodically offer them up as "snacks" at meets to gross people out. We didn't use any "creams," by the way ;)

[David Miller]

Interesting thread. I have never really given too much thought to the whole callous issue - I know I have them and all - but I have never really had to interact with them, per say, since I have been a stringed instrument player since I was 4, and I guess they just developed so early on I was not aware of it. After reading an earlier post, though, I did a close side-by-side comparison of the fingers on my right and left hands, and low and behold, the tips of my left-hand fingers are definitely longer and rounder than my right! Ah, the things you learn about yourself...

[Justus True Waldron]

My fingertips on my left hand are all squared off haha

[Mike Bunting]

http://www.climbonproducts.com/. Is a good product to prevent callus' from flaking.

N.F.I.

[greg_tsam]

I think my callouses 2.0 have 1.0 callouses. What's fun about having the squared off fingers is holding them up to the light to see how much callous is really there. Obviously, I'm easily amused and have too much time on my hands.

[Bertram Henze]

Obviously, I'm easily amused and have too much time on my hands.

There's a good description of a healthy mind and fingertips.

Callus: the time on your hands

[Loretta Callahan]

Hmmm, I'm taking fish oil pills, along with Vit E/D more, and my callouses are hard, but not brittle and rarely peel .... but it might also be the phase 2 callous Bertram mentions. On the rare occasion where I need to do a little callous smoothing, I use sandpaper rather than an emery board.


I now take fish oil pills every day. My callouses never get hard and peel any more.

[rb3868]

When I was a kid, I think I had Phase III calluses on my feet. I rarely wore shoes and nothing short of an upturned nail would penetrate them. Ran across a pile of broken glass, freaked out my mom, but the bottom of my feet just looked like leather that has some 80 sandpaper rubbed over it. they remained that tough until my 30s, about ten /twelve years after I started wearing shoes everywhere. I wonder if long-term pros get calluses that go so deep they just don't go away

[greg_tsam]

I used to have feet like that. Grew up in the country, red dirt roads, no shoes in the summer if I could help it.

[Miss Lonelyhearts]

I regularly use an emery board to smooth the outer layer of my finger callouses. Switching between mando and fiddle, if I didn't smooth them, my mando callouses would chew right through the relatively delicate wrapping on my fiddle strings. It's as much about maintaining my (pricey) fiddle strings as it is my fingertips. A little dusting off with the emery board also prevents snags and flaps of loose skin, which can interfere with smooth playing on either instrument, so it's worth the 10-second manicure now and then.

[Grateful Dawg]

When mine begin peeling I just put Quick Callus on them and keep going.