looking for a shallow, rounded neck

[KarlM]

Hi all,

I'm still feeling my way through the mandolin world, and am kind of unsatisfied with the neck shape on my current one, a Kentucky KM-160. My hands are quite small and don't fit well on it, as it is moderately deep and somewhat V-shaped - for my fingers to be in the right position on the fretboard the second joint of my thumb needs to be on the middle of the neck, right where the V is. Unfortunately I live in a place with nowhere to try any out, but I was looking in a music shop while travelling a few weeks ago and found one with a shallow, rounded neck that fit my thumb perfectly and felt a lot better. But that was some anonymous brand called "Mitchell" and it sounded hideous (the guy running the place had no clue about mandolins and seemed to think that Fender and Epiphone are the best, and possibly only other ones).

So the question is: are there any good mandolins built like this? I went through the old threads and it sounds like most of them have V necks to some extent, and if anything Kentuckys' are smaller and rounder than some of the other makes.

[Jim Garber]

Mandolins are generally small and usually we hear the opposite to your complaint from players who want a wider or deeper neck because their hands are too large. It sounds like you are just starting out -- please excuse me if I am wrong about that -- but I have a feeling that you might consider speaking to a mandolin instructor. There is a possibility that you might need to change your left hand position. I am not sure what you mean by "second joint of my thumb" but if that means the one closer to your nail then it sounds like it is in the wrong place. You might post some pics to get an idea of what you are talking about.

[KarlM]

Sorry, by "second joint" I was counting from the tip and meant the middle bone, closer to the palm; I'm not that bad :) Here's what I mean:
92794

Unless the crotch of my hand is right against the bottom of the neck, the pressure point when pressing on the strings is the V of the neck against the middle of that mid thumb bone - very uncomfortable and inefficient. A round neck distributes that much better. Of course, if you have larger hands, your thumb is going to be higher up on the bass side and the V will (if I'm not mistaken) be at the lower thumb joint. FWIW, my hand span (thumb to pinky) is just under 8 inches.

[Ed Goist]

The necks on Breedlove mandolins are the classic example of what you're looking for (shallow & rounded).
The necks on Webers and Collings are also considerably more shallow and less V-shaped than the necks on Kentuckys.

[Mike Bunting]

Sorry, by "second joint" I was counting from the tip and meant the middle bone, closer to the palm; I'm not that bad :) Here's what I mean:
92794

Unless the crotch of my hand is right against the bottom of the neck, the pressure point when pressing on the strings is the V of the neck against the middle of that mid thumb bone - very uncomfortable and inefficient. A round neck distributes that much better. Of course, if you have larger hands, your thumb is going to be higher up on the bass side and the V will (if I'm not mistaken) be at the lower thumb joint. FWIW, my hand span (thumb to pinky) is just under 8 inches.

I'd say that your left hand grip is wrong. Check out this video
http://www.daddario.com/DADMediaLibrary.Page?ActiveId=2921&MediaId=352&sid=8b241b54-89d8-4ab9-8f70-b5bff12d8c18

[KarlM]

That just proves what I was saying - if I hold it the way he does, with the thumb on top, there's no way to make a gap behind and still reach the strings effectively; the point of the V pushes my thumb up too high and the gap behind disappears (like in the picture). With a rounded neck, it works right.

[sunburst]

Many custom builders will build you a mandolin with almost any neck shape you want (within reason), but you have to know what shape you want. In other words, if you go to a builder and say "I'd like the neck rounder and not as deep", that is probably not enough information. If you say "I want the width at the nut to be 1 1/8", the thickness at the first fret to be 13/16", and the profile to be an arc, that should do it, but better yet, bring in a neck that feels ideal to you so the builder can duplicate it.
Of coarse, a custom made mandolin is usually not cheap (you get what you pay for, after all) and you have to wait for it to be completed, but any time you specifically desire some feature, a custom build is a way to get it, and there are more custom builders of quality instruments now than ever before.

[bmac]

I would suggest going to the nearest well stocked instrument store and try out instruments, new and old, until you find what you are looking for... In the East it might be Mandolin Brothers, in Staten Island, NY. But there are several others. Maybe if you told us where you live someone could suggest a retailer with a good stock of mandos in your area to try out... If you are fairly new to mandolin or do not play enough to develop muscle memory (if that is the word) then it may just be a matter of "getting used to" the shape of the neck.

When I began playing some years ago I had pains in places I didn't know I had. But with practice they all went away and now I can play for hours with no pain or discomfort. I have a number of different mandolins from the last century With various sizes and shaped necks and none of them bother me at all, hand and muscle wise.

[Jim Garber]

Unless the crotch of my hand is right against the bottom of the neck, the pressure point when pressing on the strings is the V of the neck against the middle of that mid thumb bone - very uncomfortable and inefficient. A round neck distributes that much better. Of course, if you have larger hands, your thumb is going to be higher up on the bass side and the V will (if I'm not mistaken) be at the lower thumb joint. FWIW, my hand span (thumb to pinky) is just under 8 inches.

I do not have big hands either. I don't have a ruler handy but my span is prob not much more than yours. Like Bart I have a closetful of vintage and newer mandolins with varying neck profiles and none are uncomfortable for me to play. Neck depth doesn't bother me tho I did sell off a few wide fretboards which I do not like (1.25"). In fact I ahve played a few mandolins with very shallow necks and those don;t work too well for me either.

You may find the perfect shallower, rounded neck or have one built, but I would also still suggest having a good teacher give you some feedback. Perhaps you are right and you need a different neck, but I don't know how much more we can help you here other than with blind conjecture. There is nothing like some in-person evaluation by someone who knows.

[KarlM]

I would suggest going to the nearest well stocked instrument store and try out instruments, new and old, until you find what you are looking for... In the East it might be Mandolin Brothers, in Staten Island, NY. But there are several others. Maybe if you told us where you live someone could suggest a retailer with a good stock of mandos in your area to try out...

I live in Hawaii, so the nearest well-stocked dealer is ~4000 miles away...

[Grommet]

Hi Karl-
Couple of things come to mind. As you move through various levels of playing from chords through more intensive picking, you may find as I did that the mandolin neck is resting much lighter on the V of the hand and is supported a bit more by the fretting fingers and the slight pressure from the heel of the right hand. I also find that to play different passages I may shift the resting focus from the finger side to the thumb side of the V to gain better access to a run on notes. In general I like to try to move the thumb and finger a little closer together so that the neck is just off the bottom of the V, with very little weight being supported. Aside from that I would to find that perfect neck, but I gots what i gots. You could try some Uke necks to see if the next mando should have a similar profile. Lastly, try searching these threads for examples of people who have inquired about having the neck profile ot their mandlin altered. I know Big Joe has done some of these. Keep picking!

Scott