First Jam Session

[JGregs]

So, last night I went to my first jam session. . . that was interesting. First song that I tried to solo on I botched but other than that I had a great time. Once I began to understand the chord progressions, I was choppin' away and having a great time.

The one thing I became very aware of was that I need a new mandolin. My small oval hole Johnson just doesn't have the volume and tone that I feel is needed in a Jam. I am looking at the Ibanez mando at guitar center for $299 and the local music shop sells a mandolin for 315$ with case but I haven't had a chance to play it yet. Suggestions on the upgrade? I want to keep it under 400$ if I can but I have a bonus check coming in that will probably go towards a new mando. suggestions? I would prefer an F style

[nfire]

i really like the Kentucky KM160 for a beginner mando, thats what i used. Great sound for a beginner mandolin and pretty loud too. Should be able to keep it under $300.

[Pete Counter]

Your not going to get much of an improvement in that price range, Advise given to me after my first jam and having the same complaint was simply..."Play louder". If your used to sitting in your living room and playing by yourself you do play quiet and getting used to being heard in a jam isnt simply a matter of getting a small mandolin upgrade. Save your money till you can make a bigger jump in quality and practice playing louder in the meantime.

[Jim Garber]

Let's face it: if you are in a large jam even a $25,000 will get lost esp if you are competing with multiple banjos and fiddles. In any case, I am sure many people will tell you that if you are under cost constraints an F-model will not give you any more volume than an equivalent A model. You are paying for cosmetics esp at the low price point. I will let others suggest specific models and makes.

[Earthwood]

You said "prefer" an F style but if you're not "deadset" on an F style your money will go further. You could pick up a nice A style "The Loar" LM220 VS from The Mandolin Store (http://www.themandolinstore.com/scripts/prodView.asp?idproduct=9260) and Folkmusician.com (http://www.folkmusician.com/The-Loar-LM-220-Mandolin/productinfo/LM-220/) for $379 and that will come with a proper setup. (NFI)

If you do indeed have scroll envy and are deadset on an F style (I understand and also suffered from this until I got my Eastman 315) you can pick up a "The Loar" LM520 for $499 with setup at The Mandolin Store (http://www.themandolinstore.com/scripts/prodView.asp?idproduct=9261), or if you can do a setup yourself or have someone who can do one for you for free or cheap, you can get the same mandolin for $399 without setup (factory setup only) from Folkmusician.com (http://www.folkmusician.com/The-Loar-LM-520-Mandolin/productinfo/LM-520-NS/). (again, NFI)

If you plan to buy online, I definitely recomend using one of the many vendors recomended on the cafe. I ordered my Eastman from Steve Perry at Gianna Violins and couldn't be happier with the price and setup. I also highly recommend The Mandolin Store as Dennis emailed me after ordering a CA Bridge to tell me that I wouldn't notice a drastic difference from the Eastman ebony bridge, and that I would be better off saving my money for a different upgrade. Anyone who will lose a sale just to ensure customer satisfaction is a winner in my book. I also received alot of buying advice from Robert at FolkMusician.com before I settled on purchasing my Eastman. You will find countless threads here that will show you how excellent of a community this is and the vendors that involve themselves with the cafe really care about their customers.

Also, has your Johnson oval had a proper setup? I have a lowly "Rogue" mandolin and know first hand that any instrument (even low end models) hugely benefits from a good setup. If you don't have good bridge contact, your volume and tone will suffer immensely.

[JeffD]

So, last night I went to my first jam session. . . that was interesting. First song that I tried to solo on I botched but other than that I had a great time. Once I began to understand the chord progressions, I was choppin' away and having a great time.

The one thing I became very aware of was that I need a new mandolin.

While there are always very good reasons to get a new mandolin, please don't let it get in the way of jamming. The mandolin you have will do you very well in a jam, and bring you lots of fun and enjoyment, not to mention experience, and motivation.

Consider a new mandolin, for sure, and a new one after that, and bridge upgrades and bling upgrades, absolutely, but don't delay a single jam because of it. There is amazing amounts of fun to be had between now and whenever you get the mandolin of your dreams.

[Earthwood]

While there are always very good reasons to get a new mandolin, please don't let it get in the way of jamming. The mandolin you have will do you very well in a jam, and bring you lots of fun and enjoyment, not to mention experience, and motivation.

Consider a new mandolin, for sure, and a new one after that, and bridge upgrades and bling upgrades, absolutely, but don't delay a single jam because of it. There is amazing amounts of fun to be had between now and whenever you get the mandolin of your dreams.

Yes, don't let your insecurities about your instrument get in the way of having fun at jams. I used to play my Rogue in a small jam along with a nice Taylor guitar and a nice sounding violin (don't know violin brands :confused:) and although it didn't sound that great or loud, I always had a blast and learned alot.

[JGregs]

I have been wanting a new Mando for some time now, the jam just solidified it for me.

I definetly "prefer" F style but I don't "need" and F-style. If I can find a nice sounding A style I will be fine paying extra for it. I can go above 400$ but it isn't my preference. The biggest thing is I want to make sure I get the most bang for my buck

[jaycat]

. . . Advise given to me after my first jam and having the same complaint was simply..."Play louder". . . .

That's funny, they always tell me to play softer. Or shut up altogether.

[Earthwood]

That's funny, they always tell me to play softer. Or shut up altogether.
Because the sound of how awesome you are is making them feel inadequate, right? That's how I would take it...:cool:

[allenhopkins]

If you want more projection, think "f-hole" not "F-model" or "F-style." You don't get any more sound from scroll and points added to the rims of your mandolin. You do get a more percussive sound from a carved (or pressed, at the price you're considering) top with f-shaped soundholes.

Kentucky or Loar A-models with f-holes are obtainable in your price range. Putting up with the Johnson for a bit longer, until you can save up enough to approach $1K, might make more sense, IMHO.

There surely are oval-hole instruments that can hold their own in most jam situations, but I'm not sure one is available for $400.

[Laird]

Kentucky or Loar A-models with f-holes are obtainable in your price range.

Right. My first mando was a used Kentucky 150--A style with F holes--and I got it for under $200. Heck, it's louder than my Eastman 515--just not as purty sounding. I did play one of the lower-end Loars at the local music shop a couple weeks ago and was really impressed with the sound. Unlike others, I wouldn't wait. If I had to wait for an extra grand to appear in my bank acocunt, I'd be wasting years that could have been spent wailing away at the jams!

[Alex Orr]

If you want more projection, think "f-hole" not "F-model" or "F-style." You don't get any more sound from scroll and points added to the rims of your mandolin. You do get a more percussive sound from a carved (or pressed, at the price you're considering) top with f-shaped soundholes.

Kentucky or Loar A-models with f-holes are obtainable in your price range. Putting up with the Johnson for a bit longer, until you can save up enough to approach $1K, might make more sense, IMHO.
Agreed. The scroll does nothing to improve the sound, but it looks pretty and can make it seem like the mandolin is somehow superior to an A-style mandolin. In the price range you are talking about, it's probably safe to say that is NEVER true. You'll get more bang for your buck with an A-style (F-hole) mandolin.

The Loar suggested a few posts earlier sounds like a good idea. Kentucky also makes some mandolins in that category that hold up quite nicely in jams. A fellow around here who plays out a lot gets plenty of sound from his old KM-350 and I used to play one for many years as well. You can find one for $359 at: http://www.musiciansfriend.com/folk-traditional-instruments/kentucky-km-350-artist-a-model-mandolin

There's also a KM-250 on eBay right now for $325 with a Randy Wood bridge upgrade (http://www.ebay.com/itm/Kentucky-Mandolin-KM-250-w-Case-and-Randy-Wood-Bridge-Upgrade-Display-Model-/221051007789?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3377aab32d). As I recall, the only difference between the 250 and 350 is flamed maple, which does nothing for the sound, and honestly, isn't even that flame-y, at least based on my 350.

[Mandobart]

All good advice. Some things that will make your curent mando louder - heavier strings; try J75's. Heavier pick. Many guitar cross overs to mando are still trying to use those thin guitar picks. I find now after a few years I need at least a 2.0 mm pick to get the tone and volume I'm after. And use a Tone Gard (http://www.tone-gard.com/) or consciously keep that mando off your body. And most important, a good setup adjusting the action and intonation.

I have an Ibanez M522S that you can hear and get a mini review here (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=moNWz4cAvis) for what its worth. Decent tone and volume, but no where near the quality and sound of the Kentucky's, "The" Loar's and Eastmans I've played. So I would pass on the Ibanez and stick with the recommendation to get one of the better quality A styles mentioned. Take a look thru the classifieds (http://www.mandolincafe.com/cgi-bin/classifieds/classifieds.cgi?search_and_display_db_button=on&query=category&category=Mandolins&results_format=headlines); you can get a much better used one than you could afford new.

All other things being equal (and they never are) an f-hole can cut thru a jam better than an oval hole, except when it doesn't. I have three awesome oval holed instruments built by small production American luthiers that in my hands can absolutely cut thru the herd of 6 - 10 guitars, banjo and fiddle or two that I often jam with.

[Gelsenbury]

Everyone is concentrating on the "new mando" part of your post ... I have no advice to give on the topic, but I just wanted to say that I hope you gave yourself a big pat on the back for going to your first jam session *and* playing a solo. :cool:

[JGregs]

Everyone is concentrating on the "new mando" part of your post ... I have no advice to give on the topic, but I just wanted to say that I hope you gave yourself a big pat on the back for going to your first jam session *and* playing a solo. :cool:

Thanks, I botched it but I had fun.

Anyways, I think I will skip the F-style and get an F-hole mando. I have been stopping by guitar Center and the local music shops to see when they get new stock and I will play their mandos for an hour or so finding one. I am getting an idea of the kind of tone I want. I like things that have a bit more "hollow" warm kind of sound more like the older Ole Time mando's.

[KEB]

Everyone is concentrating on the "new mando" part of your post ... I have no advice to give on the topic, but I just wanted to say that I hope you gave yourself a big pat on the back for going to your first jam session *and* playing a solo. :cool:

I'll give this a second. I went to my first jam earlier this month but chickened out on the solo. I promised I'd take some breaks and lead a long next month... uh oh... is it already almost next month...

[Austin Bob]

Congratulations on your first jam! The best way to learn is by playing with others, so keep it up. And realize that ALL of us have one time or another been with a group of musicians and had the feeling that we are not worthy, or don't belong in the same class as the rest of them. That's normal, and has keeps some people from ever joining, thus they never improve. Just remember that jams are to have fun, and no one expects every mandolin player to sound like Dave Grisman.

As per buying a new mandolin, others have said it well. Just make sure whatever you buy is set up properly.