"The River" [Archive] - Mandolin Cafe Forum

Laird

Apr-08-2012, 8:04pm

One star - who makes that decision - I know that my music isn't for everyone.

I could be wrong, but I imagine that whoever rated it didn't listen to the track. (I didn't either, in fact.) I took it more as a negative response to the idea of using this site either for self-promotion or free advice on your playing. You don't see much of either on here--and when you do, it doesn't usually draw much response.

By the way, it was only seeing the one star that led me to click on this post anyhow.

MikeEdgerton

Apr-08-2012, 9:08pm

The star ratings are done by individual members of the forum. They only become visible if you enter the forum through the Forums menu selection and then through the Forum heading. If one comes in and clicks on Today's Posts they are not visible. The rating system is driven by the members. I would assume that the vast majority of members don't make use of the function. Very few threads in the overall listings are rated at all.

Steven Clarkson

Apr-09-2012, 7:51am

thanks Mike - the music is free nonetheless so it's not about self promotion - I been doing this since 2007 and have made less than 200 bucks - the website costs 175 dollars a year to maintain, do the math.

Steven Clarkson

Apr-09-2012, 8:24am

The only motivation I have for sharing my music is to help people find a degree of peace in their lives when they might be having a hard time. I suffer from a medical condition and making the music helps my focus and also helps in my devotion times. There is no hidden meaning behind it and as long as I can still play the mandolin, I will be making music.

Laird

Apr-09-2012, 8:27am

Brother, I was just trying to help you out, suggesting that a reader's low rating of your post might have had nothing to do with your music--that, instead, it might have been a reaction to the type of post. Best of luck to you.

Steven Clarkson

Apr-09-2012, 9:23am

Laird,

My comments were not directed at you. I just find it strange that one person would have the power to tell this community that my website and the music contained in it are worth 1 out of 5 stars. I'll brush it off and move on. Thanks for your help - and I do see it that way,

Steven

ccravens

Apr-09-2012, 9:38am

Steven - don't worry about the star. I won't go into the type of personality who would do that. They obviously have "nothing positive to contribute" to this thread. If I didn't like it, I just wouldn't rate it at all, but I wouldn't go negative as they have done.

I appreciate your attempts (I've seen them in the past) to have folks listen to your music. I think it would be cool if MORE people did as you have done, and posted original songs, regardless of ability level. People could get encouragement, constructive criticism, and honest advice about their playing and music. That would be very cool. And it happens on plenty of other instrument-centric websites as well. Not sure why it doesn't happen more here.

If people want to just post all day, and really aren't that interested in self-recording, original songs, or getting constructive feedback, etc. that's cool too. There's room for all. But we have plenty of that now; it would just be cool to have more people posting original (or cover) tunes as well. Not that I have a probelm with the semi-annual capo thread, or anything; it would just be nice to have a little difference also.

So keep on playing pal, and thanks for letting us listen!

Laird

Apr-09-2012, 10:08am

Not that I have a probelm with the semi-annual capo thread, or anything; it would just be nice to have a little difference also.

The "weekly capo thread" is more like it.

Steven Clarkson

Apr-10-2012, 3:55pm

I wanted to thank those who responded in private in support of my efforts - I have decided to post to this thread only after I have recorded more material - my new song, same website/same page, is called "Beaver Lake" dedicated to Spring in Montana. Again, I will wait until I record a few more songs - this is not self promotion as many of you may think - I just want to share my gifts with others - in terms of being a beginner - I've been playing for 17 plus years - my style is probably just not something you can relate to and that's ok

Steven Clarkson

Apr-10-2012, 3:57pm

For those who need the link again here (http://www.chocteemusic.com/newmusic.cfm) - bottom of the page

Mike Bunting

Apr-10-2012, 4:24pm

I don't think that the one star rating had anything to do with your music, it's the proselytizing involved that is sort of questionable.

Steven Clarkson

Apr-11-2012, 11:30am

That's the very reason that I send people directly to the new music section of my site - I don't want to change who I am, and my site is a reflection of part of me. I stand by my efforts, music and otherwise. Sometimes people have a tendency to judge the surface of things as apposed to digging deeper into what is offered. Most of my music is instrumental, thus it doesn't hold a position on anything but my efforts to produce what's in my heart. And that's something I feel the need to share. Thank you Mike for your insight.

ccravens

Apr-11-2012, 2:48pm

I don't think that the one star rating had anything to do with your music, it's the proselytizing involved that is sort of questionable.

Proselytizing? "To convert or recruit?" Sorry, you may be correct, but I don't see it. To me, I saw a guy coming on very low-key, saying, in essence: here's some of my mandolin music, it's free to download it, hope you like it, I'll try to put some more up from time-to-time "if folks don't mind." I can't think of anything more un-proselytizing in nature.

Why do threads on how to pronounce a company name get 4 pages, whether to use a capo 7 or 8 pages, etc., but a guy very un-assumingly puts up some original mandolin music (this is a mandolin site, right?) and he gets a one-star rating for the thread, and a negative comment? Go figure; I can't.

If posters here aren't interested in playing, recording, or listening to mandolin music, that's their business. I'm a BIG proponent of "to each his own." But get ignored or even put down for doing so?

I'm sorry, but you'll just have to explain that one to me.

Play on, Steve.

mandotrout777

Apr-11-2012, 3:10pm

Proselytizing? "To convert or recruit?" Sorry, you may be correct, but I don't see it. To me, I saw a guy coming on very low-key, saying, in essence: here's some of my mandolin music, it's free to download it, hope you like it, I'll try to put some more up from time-to-time "if folks don't mind." I can't think of anything more un-proselytizing in nature.

Why do threads on how to pronounce a company name get 4 pages, whether to use a capo 7 or 8 pages, etc., but a guy very un-assumingly puts up some original mandolin music (this is a mandolin site, right?) and he gets a one-star rating for the thread, and a negative comment? Go figure; I can't.

If posters here aren't interested in playing, recording, or listening to mandolin music, that's their business. I'm a BIG proponent of "to each his own." But get ignored or even put down for doing so?

I'm sorry, but you'll just have to explain that one to me.

Play on, Steve.

The content of the linked site could be viewed as proselytizing. If the same type of link was made to somebody's music on a site themed the opposite of Steven's, it would probably be deleted.

ccravens

Apr-11-2012, 3:33pm

Thanks Jeff!

I think I "get" now why Mike chose that word. Noone ever accused me of being the sharpest tool in the shed. So it's the religious aspect of his song choices and titles that people aren't happy with? His song titles seem pretty generic to me, and I certainly have no problem with them, but at least I can see now where you are coming from. Thanks for helping me out with that.

Of course that brings up the whole issue of gospel music and it's importance to bluegrass (like the "Satan Is Real" Louvin Brothers album), but that's another subject entirely.

It still doesn't solve my question of why so many would rather talk & post than play, record and share their music. But it does make me feel better about this instance. If people are simply turned off by his religious connotations, I think Steve can understand and accept that.

I am the member of a fiddlehangout and a banjohangout. On those, people post original tunes and covers daily. Many times daily. And they get listened to, and receive positive feedback and encouragement from the other members. I was always curious why seemingly little of that goes on here. Is it just mandolin players in particular?

Thanks again.

OldSausage

Apr-11-2012, 4:04pm

It still doesn't solve my question of why so many would rather talk & post than play, record and share their music. But it does make me feel better about this instance. If people are simply turned off by his religious connotations, I think Steve can understand and accept that.

I am the member of a fiddlehangout and a banjohangout. On those, people post original tunes and covers daily. Many times daily. And they get listened to, and receive positive feedback and encouragement from the other members. I was always curious why seemingly little of that goes on here. Is it just mandolin players in particular?

Thanks again.

Have a look at the Song A Week group (http://www.mandolincafe.com/forum/group.php?groupid=67&pp=50) and at the Song and Tune projects area (http://www.mandolincafe.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?55-Song-and-Tune-Projects). I always kind of had the feeling that the General Discussions area isn't the best place to post the latest example from your oeuvre.

Steven Clarkson

Apr-11-2012, 4:14pm

Chris,

I understand and share your opinions - my song titles are not meant as a statement - they are based on my intuition and the base of my beliefs - I certainly am not out to offend anyone and if I have I am sorry - as many have, based on my google stats, entered the site and immediately leave it - that really doesn't bother me - the great thing about the internet is that you can leave a site or not read a thread based on your inclinations.

I do agree with Chris that we, as a mandolin community, would be better off if we posted more original music. I would be happy to listen to it as I'm sure many others would.

I offer my original music as a means for folks to enjoy what I consider is good natured mandolin music. Nothing more, nothing less.

I do appreciate the support I have gotten from Scott and company and Chris, I will continue to record and will post links on this thread. And as I said before, I will have a few more songs before I do so.

Regards,

Steven

Steven Clarkson

Apr-11-2012, 4:21pm

Respectively Old Sausage,

I checked out both sites and I don't think what I do would fit into either forum - not to say that they don't have their place - but thanks for the links,

Steven

ccravens

Apr-11-2012, 6:40pm

Have a look at the Song A Week group (http://www.mandolincafe.com/forum/group.php?groupid=67&pp=50) and at the Song and Tune projects area (http://www.mandolincafe.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?55-Song-and-Tune-Projects). I always kind of had the feeling that the General Discussions area isn't the best place to post the latest example from your oeuvre.

Thanks for the links David. I found these 2 threads within those areas:

http://www.mandolincafe.com/forum/showthread.php?55700-Thread-for-Social-Group-MP3-posting

http://www.mandolincafe.com/forum/group.php?groupid=67 (as you mentioned)

You're "Bury Me" version is just great. I'm fixing to sit down and go through it now.

Thanks.

Steven Clarkson

Apr-11-2012, 7:12pm

The Mp3 posting section would seem to work for me - thanks David- didn't catch that one at first glance.

OldSausage

Apr-11-2012, 9:49pm

Thanks Chris - I think there's something in the song a week group for just about everyone, some of us have also posted originals there. It's very instructive and fun to see everyone doing their stuff. I hope you'll join in!

Steven Clarkson

Apr-12-2012, 3:26pm

The inherent problem with the mp3 section of the forum is everyone needs for you to download their tunes - I would much rather stream this and if I like them, then download them. BTW, while I'm posting, I finished a new tune "The burn" - incredible light was the dictionary phrase that stood out - goes from D minor to G minor back to D minor. I will not be posting on this thread for awhile.

Steven Clarkson

May-08-2012, 5:16pm

Well, my first album of 2012 is complete - "The Calm of the Dog" is it's title and it's available for free streaming and/or download here (http://www.chocteemusic.com/newmusic.cfm) - The last track, at the bottom of the page, is the one I recorded today - it's called "Moon Reflections". Hope you enjoy.

JeffD

May-08-2012, 10:52pm

And they get listened to, and receive positive feedback and encouragement from the other members.

Maybe it doesn't happen as much on the cafe as on other websites, but when it does occur, the feedback is usually insightful to very insightful, and overwhelmingly encouraging.

Why doesn't it happen here more? I don't know in general, but I can answer for myself - I play with people 3 days a week, jam actually, sometimes more, plus some classical mandolin coaching with a violin teacher, and the feedback I get is in real time when I play with real people. I don't feel drawn to playing for anyone, on a computer, or to get feedback for it. I don't have a single bit of my playing on here, and if I am not mistaken none on line anywhere, except what might have popped up by mistake.

For me, and I only mean me, it feels too synthetic to play into a computer for others to hear at some point in the future to give me feedback that I will receive sometime in the future after that, all asynchronously. Especially when (after all these years) a real live musician (or two or three or four) is only a phone call and short drive away.

Don't misunderstand. I love concept of the song a week group, and listen more than somewhat, and I think for those that are comfortable with it, it is a fantastic resource. And I do love it when people post a clip and folks get to comment. A valuable part of it all. Especially for those for whom access to regular pickin buddies is a bit more of a problem.

But my computer doesn't have a microphone or a camera. Music, for me, is real person in the presence of real person where ever possible, and I am fortunate that it is possible more than I could ever take advantage of.

All of this may change, because that interview with Mike Marshall on his on line school really looks interesting, and I may just have to get used to asynchronous musical interaction in order to do it. Access to Mike Marshall is just not something I can get any other way.

OldSausage

May-09-2012, 9:17am

Ever since they invented that gramophone playing device, music has been asynchronous as well as face to face.

I play with people several nights a week, and on stage several times a month. I also do one or two videos for YouTube each week and sometimes a video for Mike Marshall too. I think it can be what's known in literary circles as the "anxiety of reception" that holds a lot of folks back, but I have found the world of online video posting is every bit as welcoming as the local jam, and possibly more so.

Plus you get to play what you want to play, and the audience for what you like to do finds you. It's very different from playing on stage, of course, so I quite understand anyone who just doesn't feel like doing it. But if you do like to play for folks, it's another way you can.

The other thing is, the act of making a video of yourself that you are going to put on display so anyone at all can see (and watching it back, and re-recording it, and listening to it again days, weeks or years later) teaches you a great deal about your playing, and even some things about yourself. Based on my own experiences, I would recommend it to everybody. And I salute everyone who does it. It ain't easy.

JeffD

May-09-2012, 3:08pm

Ever since they invented that gramophone playing device, music has been asynchronous as well as face to face.

Based on my own experiences, I would recommend it to everybody. And I salute everyone who does it. It ain't easy.

Well that is true. My point was really that given the choice of playing with people and playing on line, with people is preferred, and luckily, I never have to do without.

But I can see that some things can only be done on line. The chances of me getting Mike Marshall as an instructor are zero. So what else can I do. Playing into a dead computer, that doesn't smile, or tap a foot in response, or care how I sound. It is the only thing holding me back from jumping into Mike Marshall's school, so I will probably take the plunge at some point.

I also hate the permenence. A video of me, on line, for all time. Yikes!

jaycat

May-09-2012, 3:22pm

Steven -- I like your music.

Elliot Luber

May-09-2012, 3:25pm

I'm not of your faith, but I did enjoy your music. It was very cleanly played and sensitive.

Steven Clarkson

May-09-2012, 3:26pm

Thank you very much - and in terms of an audience, as I do it for devotion purposes a lot, the audience is there. Just a thought in response to the other posts.

OldSausage

May-09-2012, 3:30pm

I also hate the permenence. A video of me, on line, for all time. Yikes!

Well, I wonder: you do an awful lot of forum posts, which are just as permanent, asynchronous, and probably far more revealing about you than any video would be :)

Steven Clarkson

May-09-2012, 3:33pm

The great thing about instrumental music is that people of all faiths can enjoy it - I have listened to a lot of music that is faith based from other countries - I love world music and have used the tabla and tanpura a lot in my recordings - I really just put the music that is on my heart out there and hope that it brings peace and soothing feelings to those that want to listen. The instrumental music, which most of my are, is not meant to make any particular kind of statement. Thanks for the feedback and taking the time to listen.

JeffD

May-09-2012, 9:41pm

Well, I wonder: you do an awful lot of forum posts, which are just as permanent, asynchronous, and probably far more revealing about you than any video would be :)

Yea but I have some anonymity here. For all you know I may really be Shirly from Agana, Guam. :)

I was thinking I would point the camera too low to see my face.

OldSausage

May-09-2012, 10:23pm

Yea but I have some anonymity here. For all you know I may really be Shirly from Agana, Guam. :)

I was thinking I would point the camera too low to see my face.

A fake beard, or nose and glasses combo, can be purchased very cheaply at your local haberdashery.

Marty Henrickson

May-10-2012, 5:34pm

A fake beard, or nose and glasses combo, can be purchased very cheaply at your local haberdashery.

Here's an example of the disguise technique. This felllow's playing reminds me of Mike Compton, but who can tell?

9kDR2Hz-GGo&feature=youtube_gdata_player

Steven Clarkson

May-10-2012, 5:45pm

Thanks for redirecting my thread - next time I post something, it will be in a new topic.

JeffD

May-11-2012, 12:18pm

Steve, my apologies.

Just redirect the thread back.

Marty Henrickson

May-11-2012, 3:48pm

Steve, I enjoyed your website, even though I couldn't get any of the music to play (which is most likely a problem with my PC).

Steven Clarkson

May-11-2012, 5:15pm

Thanks Marty and Jeff - Marty, if you send me your address, I'll put a couple cds in the mail if you wish - you can send it on the private message part of this site. Thanks again.

Steven Clarkson

May-11-2012, 5:19pm

Marty,

You could also download what you thought might interest you and then burn it to disk - play it on the ol' stereo or ipod or whatever. I just went to the site and the songs are streaming fine on my end - but in this day and age, I've found that what works on one computer doesn't necessarily work on another. Good day.

Thanks,

Steven

Steven Clarkson

May-12-2012, 5:23pm

Just started in on a new album, "The Tulip and the Crane". The first track with that name can be found here (http://www.chocteemusic.com/newmusic.cfm) at the bottom of the page. It is an interesting piece as it flows between D and D minor quite a bit. I recorded it for my kids who are getting into origami - we made both a crane and a tulip last week. Hope you enjoy!