What's it worth? a 1970's Penco F5

[Mock Schimock]

Suppose you found a Penco F5 from the 70's with a crappy case but in very good condition? What do you think one is worth? (It's a Japanese Gibson copy, complete with the flowerpot in the headstock).

[Ron McMillan]

I personally have never heard of Penco, but in any case, you will always get more informed help here if you can provide a photograph or three.

r

[mrmando]

Well, it looks like it's worth $455 plus shipping.

[houseworker]

Well, it looks like it's worth $455 plus shipping.

To a buyer who doesn't realise it's made of plywood, perhaps..... :grin:

[allenhopkins]

Not that it's the ultimate authority (and the article is labeled as an "orphan"), but here's what Wikipedia has to say about Penco:

Penco was a brand of guitars manufactured circa 1974 to 1978 in the same factory (Hoshino Gakki) in Japan as the Ibanez guitars and was distributed by the Philadelphia Music Exchange. The Penco brand was of relatively high quality and part of the "copy guitar/lawsuit guitar" craze of the 1970s. Penco made Martin and Gibson style acoustic guitars. Some were fully solid wood, & some were laminate. They also made bolt neck copies of Les Paul electrics, SG guitars and basses, Rickenbacker 4001 basses, Stratocaster/Telecaster copies; and the odd mandolin and banjo.[1] They also made excellent 12 string acoustic guitars. The Penco brand was also put on "lawsuit" Korina-finished Explorer styled guitars. These were identical to the Ibanez Destroyer and the Greco Destroyer of the same period. The Ibanez line was distributed on the West coast of the U.S., the Greco was exclusively for Japan, and Penco was distributed on the East coast of the U.S.

So, basically an Ibanez, differently labeled?

[lenf12]

That's an interesting Wiki reference, Allen. Sounds like the OP needs to do a bit of wood identification i.e. what is/may be solid wood vs. what is laminate. If the top is solid spruce, it may be worth a bit more than if laminated. Is it carved vs. pressed wood? Answers to those questions would be helpful in determining the value.

Len B.
Clearwater, FL

[MikeEdgerton]

Just to say it again from the OP's other message, there were no Gibson lawsuits that pertained to mandolins. It was just one lawsuit for the open book headstock design for guitars. It was Gibson only and not Martin or anyone else.

[houseworker]

Unfortunately the Wiki article is unreliable, referencing only an online article written by someone who has "never held a Penco acoustic, so cannot say how good or bad they may be". There's no evidence to support the claim that they are simply rebadged Ibanez instruments, and I'm not aware of any acoustic Penco instruments made with solid wood.

I saw a Penco F5 for sale in London ten or so years ago. It looked nice but was definitely laminated and the sound was pretty average. Set against the current prices for lower end The Loar mandolins, I'd say the OP has paid well above the market value for an instrument that has no collector interest.

Here (http://www.vintageguitar.dreamhosters.com/3861/penco-a-15-jd/)'s a recent piece on a Penco acoustic from Vintage Guitar magazine. It'll give the OP an idea of what he might expect.

[atetone]

If memory serves me,,, I seem to remember that Penco F5s were comparable in quality to Ibanez F5s of the day.
I think that they actually were the same mandolin just with a different label etc,,,
Solid wood etc,,,
Of course as we all know, in the mandolin world companies change specs all the time without notice so this particular mandolin could be of non-solid wood construction I suppose.
Some investigation would be required before I bought it.
I had one of the Ibanez ones once and they are all solid wood, thick heavy poly finish. Mine did not sound very good but some people think they are good mandolins. I have seen the Ibanez versions sell for $1000.
I wouldn't pay that for one.

[f5loar]

These make excellent wall hangers so whatever you want to invest in something to look at on the wall is what it is worth.

[houseworker]

Unless it's already been flipped, the eBay seller got more than he expected (http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:R7H9co64hpAJ:www.blueheronclassifie ds.com/classifieds/viewad.cgi%3Fadindex%3D1491306+penco+mandolin+for+ sale&cd=4&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=uk).

[Desert Rose]

Well well, this Wikipedia article has to be the award winner of absolute junk. More holes in it than a screen door on a sub.

To start, Penco DID have a connection to Hoshino Gakki. Penco instruments were NOT ever made at the sole source factory for ALL Ibanez instruments, Fujigen, period, end of discussion. Fujigen has always been the sole source for ALL Ibanez instruments made in Japan from electrics to acoustics, mandolins and banjos. Fujigen never made Penco. Penco was phased out when the Ibanez brand took off like lightening. Penco instruments were made at a number of lower end factories all over Japan depending on what it was. Ibanez banjos and mandolins were exclusively made by Fujigen, Fujigen owning the Bluebell name also made the exact instruments with the Bluebell name on them for exclusive sales in Japan. Greco on the other hand is owned by Kanda Shokai, who is also Fender Japan. Kanda and Hoshino are FIERCE competitors and Kanda never worked as a sales agent in America with or for Hoshino. Kanda has never sold any instruments outside of Japan.

As mentioned all the references to the mythological lawsuits were off base as well.

As most here know, I live and work in the instrument industry here in Japan. I worked in engineering and quality control at Fujigen for eleven years and know Kosakabe san, whos signature can be found on all your Ibanez mandolins. Our landlord for our factorywas the vice president of Fijenge and the son in law of the original founder, so my information comes from the base

Scott

[houseworker]

It wouldn't surprise me if the Wikipedia article was written by someone about to sell a Penco instrument, and hoping to improve the price.

[MikeEdgerton]

There's so much misinformation out there.

[allenhopkins]

Right you are -- still, glad I posted the Wiki article, if only so that others with better information could correct it. Perhaps one of them would like to do an edit on the erroneous Wikipedia information?

[f5loar]

What I am surprised about is how close to looking the same the Penco is to the Ibanez and Alverez of the same period. If they weren't made at the same factory there sure was a lot of copy cating going on in Japan in the 70's.

[IlDave]

I had the opportunity to take apart a badly damaged Penco Mandolin and it looks to me like it”s all solid wood.



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[jim simpson]

I become aware of the Penco brand from when I lived near Philadelphia. I picked up this spruce top (solid) and maple back and sides (laminate) Penco acoustic guitar, 70's era. It needed a new bridge, though the lack of name recognition and a slow economy has meant that it's sitting, not selling, lol!