Harmony "Viol" Mandolin

[brunello97]

This one is for Mike. These have come up for conversation before here and this one has some pretty wood and nice headstock detailing. I've never seen one of these old Harmony labels. Now that Regal has been sorted out (sort of) in the new book, maybe Harmony is due for similar in-depth study.

Here is the link to the ebay auction:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-1920s-1930s-Harmony-model-34-Viol-Mandolin-Flame-Maple-Etched-accents-/250941138373?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3a6d41e5c5

Mick

[Jim Garber]

Nice, Mick. I always liked how that style looked and that headstock design is quite entertaining, sort humorous and quirky.

[Jared Heddinger]

Is it just me, or does that headstock remind you of a mustache?

The mustachioed mandolin anyone?

[MikeEdgerton]

An Albert Shutt (http://www.harpguitars.net/history/shutt/shutt.htm) inspired or designed mandolin.

[JEStanek]

I love the mustached headstock. Very hep these days, once again.

Jamie

[Markus]

I really like it, the headstock is a little strange ... but it's wonderfully unique.

[JeffD]

I have access to one of these, described here (http://www.mandolincafe.com/forum/showthread.php?59622-Hamony-mandolin-an-interesting-one).

Mine looked pretty close to that, but had some further oddity - the nut has these rollers for the strings.

There was also a strap button in the middle of the back of the headstock, but that might not have been original.

No label that I could see.

[Dobe]

What's with the hole on the back of the headstock above the beautifully engraved coverplate ?!? Looks like a hole , no ? :disbelief:

Let me guess; to hang it from your drywall screw in the wall ! :)

[JeffD]

What's with the hole on the back of the headstock above the beautifully engraved coverplate ?!? Looks like a hole , no ? :disbelief:


Wow. On mine that is where the strap pin is. Hmmm.

[JeffD]

It looks to be a real fun instrument, if its like the one I played its bright sounding, loud enough, and could make someone happy for the rest of his/her life.

Other than that its total junk. :)

[Jared Heddinger]

Do those rollers make it sound like it has a zero fret, or are they more like a regular nut?

[JeffD]

Do those rollers make it sound like it has a zero fret, or are they more like a regular nut?
I am not sure, really. I don't have a zero fret instrument so I am not sure.

I am guessing it is more like a regular nut. Perhaps the rollers prevent drifting out of tune when the dimensions of the wood and metal change small amounts due to humidity and temperature.

I really don't know. I have never seen rollers like that on any other instrument.

[MikeEdgerton]

I would say that the hole on the back of the eBay instrument's headstock used to house a strap button with a very short stem and that this pretty much proves that the button on the back of Jeff's was original equipment.

[Jim Garber]

That one sold for more than I thought it would have: $910.

[Jake Wildwood]

Real high end Harmony stuff is super rare, and maybe folks know? I just shipped a carved-top, x-braced, flamed maple, Harmony-made archtop guitar today.

And I'm a bit bummed by seeing it go...! It was a winner.

[brunello97]

On a good day $910 will get you a Gibson A. Do we think that Harmony Viol was a carved top? :confused:

Those lobe-y two points seem to raise the pulse for some folks like maple-bowlbacks do for me. Jake, did you post photos somewhere of the Harmony archtop guitar you referenced? I would enjoy seeing it.

thanks!

Mick

[MikeEdgerton]

The Harmony might have been carved, it was early enough but that price is in Hollywood. Somebody wanted it real bad.

[Jim Garber]

that price is in Hollywood

Man, you see how rumors start? Now someone will say that Harmony mandolins were built with holly wood back in the day. Oh well, it is seasonal, right?

If my pockets were deep, tho, I think I would commission a quality luthier to make a modern version of this one. I do like the look.

[MikeEdgerton]

I wonder if there ever were Holly trees growing in Hollywood?

[Jim Garber]

I did hear that someone once decked Monty Hall... :)

[BradKlein]

It's an interesting and poorly understood design, and has very little in common with Gibson's mandolins of the teens. There was a huge price difference, for one thing. This model in its standard form sold through Sears for $19.99 in 1923, when the 'other' f-hole mandolin of the day, the Gibson F-5 sold for $250 without a case! The basic design with variations was manufactured for a very long period of time, from at least the early teens to the forties. I think that the majority, if not all, were made with solid woods - and I think the great majority, if not all, were made with 'pressed' tops, rather than carved. The tops (and backs) are NOT braced and have no tone bars which is an important factor in their sound. Also, often overlooked is the fact that the neck block is not contained inside the sides as in a Gibson, but rather extends across the instrument, sandwiched between the plates, to just below the 'shoulders' like the familiar Vega cylinder-back mandolin line. Notable is the long neck, which is joined to the body in a tapered dovetail starting between the 12 and 13th fret, and extends over the top, strikingly similar to Loar's later design for the F-5, although the details of the fb extension are much more basic than Loar's. The neck is normally one-piece with no reinforcement.

The longer neck moves the bridge 'north' on the body, and rather then place the ff-holes to the side of the bridge, as in a violin, the designer moved them up to where they were almost touching the neck block. Harmony later made at least a few guitars with this design as well. Remember there was no 'standard' placement for ff-holes on guitars and mandolins until Gibson's designs of the 1920s. The neck angle is significantly lower than on an F-5 which is probably a good idea given the relatively light top and lack of any tone bars. I suspect that the design was by Albert Shutt of Kansas, under contract for Harmony who I suspect did the manufacturing, and did own the patent on the design. (I'm no scholar, so I'm happy to be corrected by those who know more!)

The long unreinforced neck and light top combined with heavier strings sometimes make for structural problems. Certainly not as tough or solid as a Gibson mandolin of the 1920's, but overall constructed much more carefully than a Strad-o-lin.

[brunello97]

Lots of good information, Brad. Thanks. I was figuring these were pressed tops, but had drawn a non-sequitur out of Jake's lament for the carved top guitar.

Maybe the buyer will show up here with more to tell.

Mick

[Jake Wildwood]

Someone asked for pics.

Here's a link to the blog post of the just-sold one:
http://antebelluminstruments.blogspot.com/2011/07/c1935-armstrong-orchestra-archtop.html

And a photo:
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-LSbIHV8YU-k/Ti3UC8C3rxI/AAAAAAAANxI/FXq1U_XFAEo/s1600/army1.jpg

Here's a link to another one I worked on:
http://antebelluminstruments.blogspot.com/2011/05/c1940-armstrong-dansant-archtop-guitar.html

And a photo of that:
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-sTYpRqTJgwA/Tc29MJy8osI/AAAAAAAAMEA/VlVVsuE8Ztk/s1600/dansant0016.jpg

[Jim Garber]

That one looks like a copy of a Martin archtop. I had a couple of Armstrong Dansant guitars way back in the 1980s and I sold them both. One was 6 string and the other was tenor. I think I may have some catalog pages for this brand somewhere. I have to look.

[Jake Wildwood]

It's certainly very close to a Martin archtop copy -- even the neck profile on both is distinctly Martin in flavor.

The body outline, however, belongs to the Harmony flattop line, so they must've used the flattop molds which were closer to the Martin shape -- but no cigar.

[brunello97]

Here is a Harmony 'Patrician' mandolin for sale on the Ebay: similar in design to the Viols and other Shutt related works:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=220953865243&ssPageName=ADME:B:SS:US:1123#ht_17946wt_1286

Mick

[germano]

Can anyone tell me where the 'viol' in the name comes from?

I also play viol (not very, very well, I'm afraid) and it doesn't look or sound anything like this instrument. I play a consort bass viola da gamba--with 6 strings but larger than a cello and slightly smaller than a violone (precursor of the bass violin). It is the largest of the bass violas, usually tuned starting at D below the bass staff and tuned further up as a regular guitar--4ths and a 3rd in the middle. I usually tune my lowest string to C to be able to play C music at pitch.

I'm out of my informational league here, but again, why the 'viol' in the name?

germano
_____

[BradKlein]

Hi Germano,

I suspect that this and other similar marketing efforts were not related to the VIOL family of instruments at all. Rather, the VIOLIN family of instruments. The idea of adapting violin construction techniques to the mandolin family of instruments was still a new one in the early/mid 20th century. The manufacturers were tying to call attention to carved tops, f-holes, graduated plates, elevated fingerboards, varnish finishes. Not all the instruments that bear these names actually have these features, in spite of the high claims that may be found in the catalogs of the day. But they look at least superficially, more violin-like than european mandolins, or even the first Orville Gibson models, and I think the marketing departments were trying to work with that.

[Michael O'Malley]

Anybody know anthing about Armstrong instruments in general? I had an Armstrong mandolin which looked identical to a Stradolin, except for an Armstrong decal on the headstock. I suspect Armstrong was a wholesaler or distributor who had their instruments made by others, but I don't know anything about the company. Have also seen Stradolins labelled Orpheum and Gretch.

[MikeEdgerton]

We refer to the rebranded mandolins that were obviously made by the same people that made the Strad-O-lin's as Strad-O-Lin genre mandolins. There's an entire Strad-O-Lin social group here that has many pictures. There is a catalog page for Armstrong-Strad-O-Lin here (http://www.mandolincafe.com/forum/group.php?gmid=41100&do=discuss). I'm sure they were a distributor.