Bill Monroes string choice

[testore]

Just wondering if anyone knows what string was Bill Monroe using before his endorsed Gibson set. What was common in the 1940's? If there was an old thread I can't find it.

[f5loar]

Bill was fond of the Gibson Mono-steel No. 161 mandolin set. I'm not sure why he switched to the phos. bronze for his signature set but must have like them better when they came out.

[billkilpatrick]

the only strings i could find locally (siena) were from gibson - bronze wound, light gauge. i asked for a review of gibson strings in general but didn't raise a lot of interest.

[testore]

I thought I had heard that he used the mono/steel,Now is that what they refer to as Sam Bush model? Have there been any changes since? Does anyone know if he made a switch to Phos.Brnz. or just allowed them to use his name/image.

[Scotti Adams]

Back in 85 when I started using them they were called Gibson Monel Wounds. Bush used them back then as well. Still does..hence his signature strings.

[Tim2723]

Seems like every time I research one of the greats or one of my heroes it turns out that they never stuck with the same instrument, strings, picks,..anything. If I can't buy the exact stuff that made them famous, how will I ever be as good as them?

[Mandoist]

Bill used whatever strings Gibson sent him.

He did have a preference for picks though...whatever someone else would let him "borrow". I lost count how many picks I lost to him.
:))

[allenhopkins]

Seems like every time I research one of the greats or one of my heroes it turns out that they never stuck with the same instrument, strings, picks,..anything. If I can't buy the exact stuff that made them famous, how will I ever be as good as them?

Yeah, fickle, weren't they? The other issue is that you see some of the "big dogs" endorsing instruments/strings/etc., and then when you see them in performance, they're not even playing the instruments etc. they endorse -- even the "signature models." There was a "Scruggs Model" Vega banjo, when Martin owned the Vega name, but Earl kept picking his Gibson. Bill Monroe was shown endorsing Ibanez mandolins, yet I've yet to read about the Ibanez craftsmen painstakingly reassembling a smashed instrument taken from Monroe's house.

[MikeEdgerton]

Bill used whatever strings Gibson sent him.

He did have a preference for picks though...whatever someone else would let him "borrow". I lost count how many picks I lost to him.
:))

That's great. There's a story here about someone giving Bill a ride to a workshop. He didn't have a pick so he asked whomever was driving him to lend him one. At the workshop someone asked what kind of pick he used and he held up the one he had just borrowed and said "This kind!"

[billkilpatrick]

ha-ha - opp's ... other people's picks

[almeriastrings]

Yeah... and they use much-modded, refinished instruments that are nowhere near 'Original'! Tony Rice's D-28, Sam's F5...

I mean, how do they manage to sound any good at all doing that! :))

[toddjoles]

IIRC Charlie Derrington once posted that Bill never changed his strings except when one broke. In the post he also mentioned that after the poker incident, Bill would sent his Loar back to Gibson occassionally because it didn't sound right. Charlie would change strings and lower the wheels on the bridge and send it back.

[f5loar]

But Earl did use his signature Vega Nu-Sound strings on his Gibson banjo! I went back and got out a set of Gibson No. 161 mandolin strings from the 1940's and it says "mona-steel hand made strings" I got out a set from the 60's of No. 161 and it says "mona-steel hand made strings". Where do you get the "Monel Wounds" by Gibson? What year was that? From the mid 60's to the mid 80's everytime I looked in Monroe's case all I saw was Gibson Mona Steel wrappers.

[Ivan Kelsall]

From the OP - "What was common in the 1940's? ....". Betcha they weren't Gibson Monels !. They may have been Black Diamond strings. BD have been making strings since 1890 & were a very well known brand early on,
Ivan

[swampstomper]

Wikipedia (not always reliable) says "Monel was in use in the early 1930s by other musical string manufacturers, such as Gibson Guitar Corporation". There is no citation. But since it was patented in 1906 I see no reason why Gibson would not have known about it by the 30's if not earlier. It is a very good material to work with for strings (ductile and corrosion resistant).

The book "Metals in America's historic buildings: uses and preservation treatments" (Margot Gayle, David W. Look, John G. Waite) has a chapter on Monel (you can see this on Google Books). Monel was used in a lot of ArtDeco ornamentation and even the huge roof of the (long since demolished) Pennsylvania Station in NYC, built in 1907-1910, so Monel in the 30's would be well known.

I also found a quote from an Oscar Schmidt catalog, ca 1932: about their LaScala Steel Strings: " 'La Scala' strings are made by a secret patented process of fine steel metal of which Monel metal is one of the important component parts." My inference is that Gibson could well have been selling Monel strings in the 30's during Monroe Brothers time.

[300win]

What I find odd, is that Monroe had to send his mandolin to someone to change strings, reset the bridge etc. Of course I used to have a friend that always brought me his mandolin to do these things. I mean it's not hard to do, we all know that. In the case of my friend he was lazy plus was not interested in learning how whenever I showed him, was Monroe like this too ?

[toddjoles]

From the post I read, I didn't get that he was lazy. The impression that I got, was Bill didn't understand that strings went dead after a while. Hard to believe though that he couldn't hear the difference.

[f5loar]

Gibson called them "mona-steel" not "monel-steel" This is a known fact that is now part of history and cannot be changed.

[Willie Poole]

I have seen Bill playing on stage and he handed his mando to someone else to tune....Was it that he couldn`t tune it correctly or just couldn`t talk to the crowd and tune at the same time? I know taking time to tune and having "dead air" is boring to an audience...If I need to tune I ask my guitar player to try and sell some CD`s while I do it or tell them where we will be playing next or tell a joke....It`s hard to tune and talk at the same time for some people, Buzz used to put his mandolin right up to the mic and tune so he could hear it real good through the sound system....Of course some people just play out of tune, as I have stated on here before and started a rowl.....Willie

[mandobassman]

But Earl did use his signature Vega Nu-Sound strings on his Gibson banjo! I went back and got out a set of Gibson No. 161 mandolin strings from the 1940's and it says "mona-steel hand made strings" I got out a set from the 60's of No. 161 and it says "mona-steel hand made strings". Where do you get the "Monel Wounds" by Gibson? What year was that? From the mid 60's to the mid 80's everytime I looked in Monroe's case all I saw was Gibson Mona Steel wrappers.

Found this on Gibson's web site. I also remember reading about Monel in the book about the history of Gibson instruments. Mona-steel and Monel are the same.

"When Sam Bush plays mandolin, people listen. His style and sound have left an indelible mark on modern bluegrass and his tone is his signature. So when Gibson offered to develop a custom-gauged signature set of mandolin strings for him, the challenge bar was set high.
Gibson engineers were determined to recommend that his set be made of Monel, a nickel-copper alloy first used for musical instrument strings in the 1930s. Monel strings produced that magical tone heard on many famous bluegrass recordings. Once Sam Bush appeared in Gibson's corporate offices to discuss the project, we found that there was little convincing necessary. He had been using Monel all along.
"When I got my first mandolin (a 1963 Gibson A-50), it came with Mona-Steel strings," Sam reported. "I've loved the sound of Monel ever since. I had tried the bronze strings and even experimented with other manufacturers, but I missed the sound of the 3rd and 4th string on the Monel set. Through the years, I've always come back to that Gibson sound."

[300win]

When I wasa youngin' the only strings they had at the only place in town that had 'em { the corner drug store } was Black Diamond and Mapes. My dad always bought BD for guitar and banjo, Mapes for mandolin. The Mapes came with an extra E, A, D, and G, so you got a set and a 1/2 of strings. You could only see Gibsons at the big stores down in Winston-Salem.

[allenhopkins]

...It`s hard to tune and talk at the same time for some people...

I saw Michael Cooney in performance in Denver back in the '60's; he broke a banjo string, and, while he was getting a new string out of his case, putting it on the banjo and tuning up, he sang an a cappella song flawlessly. Saw John McCutcheon a couple years ago, and he did essentially the same thing when his banjo string broke. "Some cats got it, and some cats ain't," as (I think) the Coasters sang...

[f5loar]

They may be the same but Gibson only used "Mona" on the string packs themseleves and in all their advertising. I suspect it was Monel wire they used and then patented their trade name as "mona". The Gibson catalog from 1956 says this "Mona-steel strings are noted for their non-tarnishing long wearing qualities. Bronze strings have that clear tone of brilliancy and Sonomatic strings were developed for better response response and balance on Electrics. Under the "Mona-Steel Strings" sections it says "An excellent string for all-around work,non-tarnishing,brilliant and long-wearing." And No. 161 was the mandolin set at $2.10 per set. The bronze set was No. 761 also at $2.10 per set.

[almeriastrings]

$2.10 in 1956 equates to just over $17 in today's terms.

[f5loar]

That's the reason I used to boil my used strings in water to removed the dirt and grim to make them go another few gigs. That was a lot of money in '56. You could get a blue plate special (meat and 3) with a drink for 75 cents but then gas was only 25 cents a gallon.

[JeffD]

What I find odd, is that Monroe had to send his mandolin to someone to change strings, reset the bridge etc. Of course I used to have a friend that always brought me his mandolin to do these things. I mean it's not hard to do, we all know that. In the case of my friend he was lazy plus was not interested in learning how whenever I showed him, was Monroe like this too ?

If I were a professional musician making any kind of money I would farm those activities out. Heck except for changing the strings I take pay to have all that done now.