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Scotti Adams
Oct-30-2004, 4:55pm
..just a teaser..the suns down, cant get good pics...more to come in the next few days. #40 is on the right....the one on the left is the Heirloom model

mandoJeremy
Oct-30-2004, 5:37pm
Very, very nice Scotti. I love that dark burst there!

Scotti Adams
Oct-30-2004, 6:26pm
..Im gonna get some better pics this week....this thing is so hot...I was there when it got strung up for the first time....what a feeling to witness that and feel the changes....gotta go pick.

ethanopia
Oct-30-2004, 6:39pm
Both of them look pretty awesome.

I got to play the "Heirloom" model when I had Ben adjust mine a week or so ago. That one had a much more Loar like tone, if there is such a thing.

How is the varnish?

mandolinquent
Oct-30-2004, 6:55pm
Very nice Scotti! I cant wait to see more pictures. #41 is sounding better and better everyday. I have such a hard time concentration on schoolwork when I know #41 is sitting right next to me, begging to be played! I played a popular, higher end mando last week and I dont think it even came close to my BRW. I'm very satisfied with my decision!

Fretbear
Oct-30-2004, 9:42pm
Congrats, Scotti; what's the latest take on those stainless steel D'Addarios?

Scotti Adams
Oct-31-2004, 5:39am
Congrats, Scotti; what's the latest take on those stainless steel D'Addarios?
..I like them....I still have the original set on #6...they could be changed but they still sounf good....going on about 2 months. I just put a set on the Heirloom Model and got Bushs on #40...

Scotti Adams
Oct-31-2004, 5:44am
Both of them look pretty awesome.

I got to play the "Heirloom" model when I had Ben adjust mine a week or so ago. That one had a much more Loar like tone, if there is such a thing.

How is the varnish?
..yes..the Heirloom model is a real piece of art..a masterpiece if you will...it looks 20 yrs old and has got more of the Loar sound. If Bens reading this and he obliges I will post some great pics of it...otherwise you all will have to wait until he does. It is sold...if my buddy doesnt take it my father is...I love the varnish finish...great smell and I can already tell that #40 with its 12 year old Englemann top is going to be another #6.

Undercover Brother
Oct-31-2004, 7:57am
Lordy-lordy, Look at Number 40!
Congratulations Scotti! I'm really happy it's in your hands. PLEASE post more pictures!!!
Nice work Ben, if you're out there!

Chris

AlanN
Oct-31-2004, 8:01am
Nice, Scotti, looks like the Gil tp on it, right?

Scotti Adams
Oct-31-2004, 8:05am
its a chitty pic....better ones will be posted....and yes Alan that is the Gil Tp.

Scotti Adams
Oct-31-2004, 8:07am
I dont think just one pic of the Heirloom model will hurt...its meant to look like a old one..

Mando4Life
Oct-31-2004, 8:57am
Those look amazing. Almost makes me want to sell mine and get on the list.

onlyagibsonisgoodenuff
Oct-31-2004, 11:38am
#Almost makes me want to sell mine and get on the list.
Maybe not sell, but definitely the list thing!

Great looking mandolin, Scotti, especially the scroll.

Scotti Adams
Nov-01-2004, 6:36am
..both #40 and the Heirloom Model #43 played their first gig last night..one word.....fantastic....

onlyagibsonisgoodenuff
Nov-01-2004, 7:56am
So, Scotti, do your bandmates look at you the same way mine do when you take two mandos to a job, or drag out two of 'em at practice? Always switching back and forth, trying to determine the difference while everyone looks on with the "what the hey?" looks in their eyes! http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

Scotti Adams
Nov-01-2004, 8:16am
..ha ha...funny you mention that...I took 3 to practice yesterday..#6, #40 and #43....#6 is just so full of tone and fat because its older so it really wasnt fair to compare the others to that...#40 hadnt even been strung up for 24 hrs yet at that point and it cut like a new file....#43 has been strung up for a couple of weeks...its got a different tone..like what Ethan eluded to a while back..more of a Loar like tone....#43(Heirloom) may be sold...I will know today...#40 is my new one. Im just the go between on the Heirloom Model.

Tom C
Nov-01-2004, 2:15pm
Congrats on #40 -finally. How can I take out the orange on mine? I really like what Ben's been doing. I'm thinking of getting my traditional frets replaced with larger ones. I'd have to check with Ben to see if it's something he would want to do or if I should just have a local luthier do it. He may be interested in what a years pickin may have done.

Scotti Adams
Nov-01-2004, 5:27pm
Tom..I will tell you that #6 is in need of some fret work and Ben said he was just too busy to do it...hes up to a 7 month wait and hes busy as heck....to get rid of the orange..well my friend you will have to just to order another one http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

Brian Ray
Nov-01-2004, 10:06pm
It's interesting to me that you want to "get rid of the orange". Shouldn't be too long before the rest of y'all know why...

jasona
Nov-01-2004, 11:12pm
I expect it has something to do with your unholy fascination with orange dasspunk? http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif Seeing all of those pumpkins must have really made you smile!

Scotti: very nice. When will we see clearer pics of your new 40?

Scotti Adams
Nov-02-2004, 6:17am
..Well as far as better pics....Im taking #40 back to Bens this friday for some finish up work after thats done I will take some better pics...Im having dots put in the fingerboard and an abbreviated picguard made...

JimW
Nov-02-2004, 6:34am
Scotti, what are the specs on your new #40, top wood, type of maple, etc? Also, I know it's new, but can you give us a description of the tonal makeup of #40 with its varnish finish as opposed to #6 or the heirloom model.

By the way, congrats. I can't wait to get mine.

Jim Watts

Scotti Adams
Nov-02-2004, 6:58am
Hi Jim..it has a Englemann top and Im not really sure of the species of maple...its fairly tight grained. As far as the sound....all I can say is that you can tell its going to develop "that" sound like my #6 has..deep, woody with the bell like highs..a fat sound if you will. Its already loud as hell. Thats what I was after when I ask for the Englemann top...because #6 is. Its a real hoot gettin to hear that sound in its infancy..growing each day and maturing...another cool thing is was "born" on my grandmothers 90th birthday..

makoto
Nov-03-2004, 9:39pm
Scotti, great loking mandolin. I was there with Tom when you picked her up last Saturday. I should have introduced myself but was in a stupor after talking with Ben for an hour about mandolins. I was blown away with his approach to mandolin-making. He answered all of my questions thoughtfully and sincerely.
Have you had any playing experience with the J-16's? I put a deposit down on one and am now constantly day-dreaming about it.

Scotti Adams
Nov-04-2004, 7:14am
Hi James..'twas a pleasure to have alomost met you http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif I have played probably every J16 Ben has made...one word..very consistant..as are all of his mandolins. The J16 will lend itself well to any genre of music...they have a big, full sound. Loud they are...Im sure you wont be let down.

makoto
Nov-05-2004, 11:27am
Thanks Scotti, I appreciate your reply. I will keep in touch as the months go by.

Scotti Adams
Nov-05-2004, 5:13pm
..Ok..time for some pics

Scotti Adams
Nov-05-2004, 5:14pm
and again..The great piece of Englemann spruce I got from Spruce, Bruce Harvie, Check out the grain..kinda wide on the bass side..narrows up on the treble side..

Scotti Adams
Nov-05-2004, 5:15pm
..again..I wanted the neck to have that "played in" look....perfect..I think....thats the reason for the uneven look....Ive never seen a mando neck that wears evenly...

Scotti Adams
Nov-05-2004, 5:17pm
..again...the spot behind the bridge is funky because of the lighting...actually its a shadow of the bridge.

Scotti Adams
Nov-05-2004, 5:20pm
again..the Gilchrist tailpiece and the Steve Smith bridge and a Weber endpin...

Scotti Adams
Nov-05-2004, 5:21pm
headstock..Gotoh tuners with ivory buttons

Scotti Adams
Nov-05-2004, 5:22pm
..and one of the builder himself...Ben Wilcox..hes installing the dots and later the pick guard...

Scotti Adams
Nov-05-2004, 5:28pm
..last one

JimW
Nov-05-2004, 5:29pm
Awesome pictures Scotti. Very nice scroll and I love the sunburst. Now, how about a sound clip. I wanna hear that thing. If you can record it, I can post it for you with a link here for others to hear it also.

Jim

Scotti Adams
Nov-05-2004, 5:31pm
..I will work on that next..

Scotti Adams
Nov-05-2004, 7:52pm
one more of the back

Scotti Adams
Nov-05-2004, 7:53pm
..and one of the side

Undercover Brother
Nov-05-2004, 8:37pm
Scotti!
That is a mighty fine, might fine lookin' mandolin! I really like the stripe on the back of the (unfinished) neck. Didn't know you were going to go with the Fleur-de-lis on the headstock too! Great choice.
Ben sure is a wizard with the wood. Enjoy!

Chris
[U]

Scotti Adams
Nov-06-2004, 6:40am
..Thanks Chris...yea..origionaly I was going to have a Fern inlayed but decided on the Fleur-de-Lis instead because #6 already has a Fern...

onlyagibsonisgoodenuff
Nov-06-2004, 9:17am
You may now count me as officially envious. What a beauty! http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

Scotti Adams
Nov-06-2004, 9:20am
..Thanks Fred...I went out into the morning sun to take some pics that capture the true color of it...those other pictures are with a flash..lets see how these do...

Scotti Adams
Nov-06-2004, 9:27am
another..

Undercover Brother
Nov-06-2004, 9:46am
HA! The Ohio State Tourism Board should use that last photo as an ad here in the cafe...
"Come to Ohio... where mandolins grow on trees!"
http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif
Chris

Mando4Life
Nov-06-2004, 10:20am
That is one classy looking mandolin. You are a lucky man Scotti.

Enjoy them both.

WBL

ethanopia
Nov-06-2004, 11:55am
Yeah if that were a buckeye tree I think it would be perfect!

That last pic is a really cool, good representation of the nice dark color. Good work.

mikeh
Nov-06-2004, 12:17pm
Fantastic Scotti, can't wait to see it and hear it, are you bringing it to Canal Street? That's a 3 piece neck?

Scotti Adams
Nov-06-2004, 12:41pm
..Yea Mike..I will be there...I may be a little late..if yu can..try to save me a couple of seats.....yeppers...3 piece neck..Ethan...if I would have thunk it I would have used a Buckeye tree...Ive got one right in the middle of my back yard...That would be better thatn that Poison Ivy vine its hanging from..

mandomick
Nov-06-2004, 2:59pm
Cogratulations you lucky dog! I don't know how Ben does it, each batch is so consistant in the detail. Let us know how it sounds after a while with the varnish, compared to good old #6. I really like the "worn" back of the neck on yours and this thread is the first I've heard of the Heirloom model. Wonder who's gonna get the first "distressed" BRW?

I ordered my F in March so I should be hearing from Ben anytime. Can't wait.

Scotti Adams
Nov-07-2004, 8:08am
Ben should be advertising the Heirloom Model real soon...I thought I had it sold for him but the deal fail through...somebody will be lucky to own such a masterpiece..

rmoss
Nov-07-2004, 8:13am
Very nice Scotti I love the sunburst.

AlanN
Nov-07-2004, 8:17am
Very nice F-5, Scotti. And I haven't forgotten about the strap, I'm checkin' my options...hang loose, goose.

Scotti Adams
Nov-07-2004, 9:07am
..Hey Alan..hold off on the strap...Ive got two already...if my dad would have ended up witht the Heirloom model he would of had to have one.....you know that http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif

Eugene
Nov-07-2004, 10:51am
Interesting. The fingerboard extension on the "Heritage" looks to be patterned after the 1897-1915 Washburn bowlbacks. I condone this inspiration.

Scotti Adams
Nov-08-2004, 12:10pm
..last one before I give the camera back to its owner..this is more representitive of its color..

Scotti Adams
Nov-14-2004, 4:40pm
I have a couple of emails wanting me to post a couple of more pics...I found 2 that havent been shown yet..

Scotti Adams
Nov-14-2004, 4:42pm
last one..

Scotti Adams
Nov-19-2004, 8:00am
..just a little update..this thing is really opening up very quickly....she is loud..very responsive...and the tonal qualities are very nice....very nice bass and reall pretty mids and highs...she is three weeks old today and at this point Ol'#6 has become a wall hanger..#40 has just impressed me that much. I swear by Englemann tops...at least for my preference for the kind of tone I like.

JimW
Nov-19-2004, 8:53am
Scotti, sounds great. I know when I went down to Ward's in May, he had just strung up a mandolin for the first time. I got to play it for about an hour or so that day. I just couldn't believe the changes it made in the first hour of playing. I guess that wood just has get it's "fibers" together. Of course, red spruce takes much longer to break in than englemann, but the changes you're already seeing or hearing is a great sign. It'll be a hoss I'm sure. By the way, did you have the neck unfinished and just french polished? That's the way I had mine made and Ward says it's "slick as ....." well, he says it's nice and slick and really no friction at all on the movement.

Jim

Scotti Adams
Nov-19-2004, 9:08am
..Im not sure what treatment Ben used on the neck...something he calls spooge....

Nov-21-2004, 11:10am
So what radius does it have?

Scotti Adams
Nov-21-2004, 11:18am
..its not too radical..Im thinkin about a 10..its very easy on the hand, wrist and arm.

Crowder
Nov-21-2004, 9:09pm
Hey guys....I've been sitting here playing along with Rob Ickes' "Hard Times" with Steffey on it, and I swear old number 23 is giving me about as close to that Steffey tone as I've ever been able to get. Just pure, clean tone without a lot of noise or distracting overtones. It's the tone that made me want to play the mandolin. Couldn't be more thrilled with this #23, born May 2003.

Scotti Adams
Nov-22-2004, 9:32am
Hey Mike...thats what its all about..Tone

Scotti Adams
Jan-02-2005, 1:39pm
Sorry for the bump boys but I had to make this topic more accessible....Im selling the pick guard off of #40 and I cant post pics..so this is the next best thing.

flairbzzt
Jan-02-2005, 5:06pm
What's that? You're selling the BRW for the price of a pickguard? http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif

Lee
Jan-03-2005, 2:32pm
Crowder, #24 from June or July is sounding pretty darned good now too. It's become smoother, more open, up the neck. Light picking sounds fuller. But that finish still smells strong.

Tom C
Jan-03-2005, 2:34pm
Wow, you still smell the finish? #27 doing just fine.

Lee
Jan-03-2005, 2:47pm
Even after a week, I can smell which shirts have BRW all over them when I toss them into the laundry. #A-styles, being less feminine than F's, exhibit a stronger body odor. http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

Scotti Adams
Jan-03-2005, 4:42pm
..Im still smellin varnish....its a good thing...#40 by the way is becoming quite the monster I knew she would...can you say loud?...full of tone and she aint looking too bad either...Englemann baby....Im a true believer in Englemann tone-wood.

Crowder
Jan-03-2005, 5:02pm
BRW #6 was up for sale in the classifieds earlier and now it's gone.....was it purchased? Anyone know who bought it?

Scotti Adams
Jan-03-2005, 5:21pm
It has been sold.. twice...once by me then by the person who bought it from me...havent heard who the new owner is. Dang exes...next time Im just gonna find a woman I like and buy her a mando....this makes 2 great mandos Ive had to sell because of...Love Grown Cold..

flairbzzt
Jan-03-2005, 5:39pm
Scott, I hope those weren't marriages. I was once told (after divorce) "Don't bother to get married (again), just find somebody you hate and buy 'em a house!" #Wouldn't that make a great mando tune? http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

Scotti Adams
Jan-03-2005, 5:40pm
..one was a marriage.....this one didnt get quite that far...thankfully...

kyblue
Jan-03-2005, 8:28pm
next time Im #just gonna find a woman I like and buy her a mando

Hey Scotti,

What kind of mando?

#http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

Scotti Adams
Jan-03-2005, 8:35pm
PM me and we can discuss it....at this point Im game for anything.... http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

Lee
Jan-04-2005, 10:05am
Buy #6 for her and she'll follow you anywhere (because she'll have her eyes on #40)

fatt-dad
Jan-04-2005, 11:38am
Scott, I hope those weren't marriages. I was once told (after divorce) "Don't bother to get married (again), just find somebody you hate and buy 'em a house!" #Wouldn't that make a great mando tune? #http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif
I don't think I'll get married again. I'll just find a woman I don't like and give her a house. - Lewis Grizzard

Lee
Jan-05-2005, 9:42am
What's that on the Classifieds???

Ken Sager
Jan-05-2005, 9:46am
Another Moon Beam?

WireBoy
Jan-05-2005, 9:51am
Wow, Scotti has got to be on a bad ride. #BRW #40 is now negotiable? #considering the enthusiasm he had for BRW, this just has to hurt.

Scotti, i hope things smooth out for you soon.

Tom C
Jan-05-2005, 10:12am
Being he's accepting a trade, it's does not sound financial. If I were interested I would surely ask why it is for sale but, I have one and I have no reason.

pickinNgrinnin
Jan-05-2005, 10:18am
[QUOTE]What's that on the Classifieds???

BRW #40 http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif What the???

Am I missing something here? #40 being offered for a trade with a Duff? What the???

Say it ain't so!

Lee
Jan-05-2005, 10:22am
Check out the born on date; Oct. 31. It's a Moon Beam, in disquise!

Tom C
Jan-05-2005, 10:23am
Maybe negotiations for the Scotti Adams model fell through http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

pickinNgrinnin
Jan-05-2005, 10:32am
[QUOTE]Maybe negotiations for the Scotti Adams model fell through

That might explain this bandwagon departure or maybe I've just been misreading all of the past BRW threads http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

Tom C
Jan-05-2005, 10:39am
Mine was just a joke.

pickinNgrinnin
Jan-05-2005, 11:00am
Of course it was.

I'm just surprised to see this up for sale. It does not seem to jive with the glowing reports and other BRW threads over the past year or so.

M.A.S. strikes again http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

Scotti Adams
Jan-05-2005, 11:14am
Just because its up for sale or trade does not mean its not a fine mando...for which it is..very fine indeed....lets just say Im ready to move on. Thats all. 'Nuff said..no need for speculation or trying to get inside my head and reasoning.....its simple...its been a ride..thats for sure..now Im traveling a new road. MAS can be a part of it.

Lee
Jan-05-2005, 11:24am
How true Scotti. The "A" in MAS stands for "Acquisition", not "Posession".

samuel
Jan-06-2005, 6:06pm
yeah this just isn't adding up!

Scotti Adams
Jan-06-2005, 6:46pm
1+1=3 There are and were alot of people that belong to this community that trade and or sale mandos a hell of alot more frequently than I do...even after running brand x up the flag pole for everybody to see they opt to get rid of them.....well..count me in.

Ken Waltham
Jan-06-2005, 7:08pm
Seems to me we had Brian explain the word schill a while back.....

Undercover Brother
Jan-06-2005, 7:46pm
While I too am scratchin' my head about Scotti putting #40 up for sale... I must admit that desire is a funny thing.
I'm sure somewhere on this board someone else has compared mandolins and women. The Beatles have a good line that has applied to a few of my relationships in the past - "Love has a nasty habit of disappearing overnight." (from 'I'm Looking Through You') It can be the same with objects I suppose.
Whatever the reason, I'm quite glad Scotti was so vocal about how well made and reasonably priced BRW mandolins are. I freakin' love mine and might not have looked into Ben's work without Scotti shouting it from the mountaintops. Now, if he and Ben had a falling out, that's fine. If that is the case, Scotti has handled it with class because he isn't venting on the board about it.
He may have just fallen out of love. http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/sad.gif

Chris

MandoPicker
Jan-06-2005, 9:02pm
I've heard it from a reliable source that Mr. Adams and Mr. Wilcox have parted ways. Supposedly, one demanded a mandolin or a huge discount on a mandolin for all that they had done for the other. Now you have to figure out which one did the demanding.

Crowder
Jan-06-2005, 9:24pm
It would be interesting if that were true, though I emailed Scotti about the sale and he didn't even hint at anything like that. I think many here assumed there was some backscratching going on in the first place, but I believe that was never the case.

Scotti Adams
Jan-06-2005, 9:34pm
Your so right Crowder and you are so wrong John. Its chit like that...rumors and false allegations that I hate. Id like to know who your reliable rescource is John because I can count on less than 5 fingers who knows of my reasoning. Trouble makers..gotta love 'em...besides there are better things for you all to be doing than to wonder why Scotti wants a different mando...Hell I used to be a Ford man,,,now Im a Chevy man...but tonight I looked into buying myself a Jeep...with the 20in. of snow we had a couple of weeks ago I never want to be caught with my pants down again. Im done talking about it..if you wanna talk about #40...call me. This isnt the place for it. I dont have time for these petty-a$$ games.

fatt-dad
Jan-07-2005, 7:22am
(Why I'm commenting is beyond me - but here goes.)

I love my Flatiron and my Stiver (well I love a dozen or so of my other mandolins as well. I would even start a thread if someone was interested in my oval hole Alvarez 2-pointer. The fact of the matter is that at any time, any one of these may be up for sale. One day, I may think that my Stiver is the best I will ever find and I should just relax. Some times I do just that. Other times, I wonder whether I should get (fill in the blank) to build me a custom mandolin. Somewhere in the mix, something will be sold.

That's how I see it. . . .

f-d

ebaker
Jan-07-2005, 9:15am
Scotti - Please don't buy a Jeep. I did and now I regret it. I did buy it used, but it's been nothing but a problem. I should have never sold my Subaru...good luck.

Tom C
Jan-07-2005, 9:22am
Subarus are pac-rim aren't they?

Geez 100 posts and over 5,000 views. We are asorry bunch http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

J. Mark Lane
Jan-07-2005, 9:55am
Scotti - Please don't buy a Jeep. I did and now I regret it. I did buy it used, but it's been nothing but a problem. I should have never sold my Subaru...good luck.
I respectfully dissent.

I owned a Subaru Outback wagon, and it was a very good car. Had a few odd problems, but good service. I also own a Jeep Wrangler, and it's an awesome little vehicle. The new Wrangler Unlimited is very appealing, too. I don't think I'd buy one of those little SUV's they sell, but the Wranglers are a ton of fun (my daughter loves it with the top down and the doors off).

Mark

P.S. Subaru's for the North American market are manufactured in Lafayette, Indiana.... Last time I looked, Indiana was not part of the so-called "Pacific rim."

Tom C
Jan-07-2005, 10:14am
What percentage of the parts come from asia? -seriously, I do not know.

Scotti Adams
Jan-07-2005, 10:24am
...Im leaning towards an all out sell..taking offers..trading may not be an option for me now....and thanks guys for steering this topic away from the slandering #### it was heading to....I truly appreciate it.

newbreedbrian
Jan-07-2005, 12:50pm
#The Beatles have a good line that has applied to a few of my relationships in the past - "Love has a nasty habit of disappearing overnight." (from 'I'm Looking Through You') #
great tune, my favorite line of the song too. steve earle does an incredible version of it(with some nice mandolin playin)if you havent heard it check it out.

Brian

pickinNgrinnin
Jan-07-2005, 3:30pm
Scotti-

My comments were based upon initial surprise. Given how you had talked about the BRW's over the past year or so and to see you selling #40 caught my attention. That's all.

I've bought and sold a number to get to my current. Will it be my last? Who knows. I have a wandering eye (like most of us do)for Mandolins http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif Best wishes with the next Mando and 4X4!

Undercover Brother
Jan-07-2005, 3:50pm
Brian -
I really like Steve Earle's stuff (gotta learn 'Copperhead Road' one of these days) but don't know where to find his version of "I'm Looking Through You". Is it on an album or one of his live shows? Any help would be most welcome.
Scotti - I know a fellow here in Georgia who may be interested... He hasn't called you yet (I don't think) but I'll send him your way if he's interested. Good luck!

Chris

pickinNgrinnin
Jan-07-2005, 3:54pm
[QUOTE]don't know where to find his version of "I'm Looking Through You". Is it on an album or one of his live shows? Any help would be most welcome.

That song is on his "Train A Coming" CD. It's a great CD! Check it out. http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/mandosmiley.gif

Scotti Adams
Jan-07-2005, 4:37pm
Chris...if his name is Barry he called me the first day the ad came out but I was leaning more towards a trade then so we couldnt do much. Well for the most part I think Im willing to just sell it out right....I'll make somebody a good deal on a great mando...I PM'd him earlier today to let him know my change of plans but havent heard back from him.....so yea...let him know. Thanks!

newbreedbrian
Jan-07-2005, 10:40pm
yea its on the train a comin album. absolutely the best thing he ever put out IMHO, great from start to finish. im a huge fan but i find alot of his albums pretty overproduced. if you're down with bluegrass the mountain album backed by the del mccoury band is fantastic as well

onlyagibsonisgoodenuff
Jan-09-2005, 2:01pm
Looks like even with limited internet access, Scotti has sold #40. The ad has disappeared, and once again I waited a bit too long to act!

http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/sad.gif

Lee
Jan-10-2005, 10:01am
Hopefully the new owner will post a review. I'll be curious to find out if it's someone who's played a BRW before springing, or just took a chance as I often do.

Scotti Adams
Jan-10-2005, 2:12pm
..lets just say..yea..the new owner has played a BRW before...so he knows what he is getting.

Undercover Brother
Jan-10-2005, 7:32pm
OK... gotta ask....
What are you playin' now?http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif??
And if not NOW, you gotta tell us when you DO get the next one. http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

Chris

mandoJeremy
Jan-10-2005, 10:05pm
Let's see.....hmmmm....I would guess a Rose! #Now that I think about it Scotti, don't new Roses start at $2500.00 and not $2900.00? Last time I checked they did.

mahlboogie
Jan-11-2005, 6:56pm
Don't need a weatherman to know which way the wind blows

rose#1
Jan-11-2005, 7:23pm
I guess I dont understand some of the comments that are being made here but for my varnished model I am charging $3000.00 Scotti said he would buy the keys and the tailpiece and the case for the mandolin so I made the price $2900.00. I think these prices are very resonable for what type of mandolin I am producing.I would say the tone on my mandolins compare to some of the best out there at 3 4 and 5 time the price, yes you may find a small flaw here or there on my mandos but no more than what you would find on many other brands out there that charge alot more. There are builders out there charging thousands more than I do That have no professional backers that play there instruments which I do and then you have the ones who give there mandos away to get the recognition which every pro whoplays one of mine has payed for theirs. by no means do I think I am any where near Mr. Dude or Mr. Hilburn or any of the top builders in the world I would however like to be recognized for having a nice mando at an exteremly great value.

Scotti Adams
Jan-11-2005, 7:30pm
Thanks for setting the record straight Darby..theres no doubt in my mind that you will be recognized greatly for your wares.

dj9124
Jan-11-2005, 7:54pm
I think Darby's mandos speak for themselves and I think eventually Darby will be able to charge more as time goes on, its nice to see someone putting out such a great sounding mandolin at such a great price, actually I don't know how Darby does it as he has a full time job on top of building mandos but he sure can crank them out. I have nothing but praise for Darby's mandos.
Dave

rose#1
Jan-11-2005, 8:30pm
I can say the only reason I do it is for the 2 passions, 1 I have a little 4 year old in which the mandos are named after and 2 the shear love of crafting the instruments I literally spend almost every moment of my life working at either my job or in my shop, and every penny goes to providing for my family.

Scotti Adams
Jan-11-2005, 8:38pm
..now you gotta love that.

Crowder
Jan-11-2005, 8:40pm
Darby, well said. Just make sure you spend some time with your family, that's what they'll remember.

Now, who the heck owns BRW #40?

Scotti Adams
Jan-11-2005, 8:41pm
http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif actually I do..for a couple of more days anyway.

Scotti Adams
Jan-11-2005, 8:42pm
The buyer wishes to remain anonymous...I must respect that.

Crowder
Jan-11-2005, 8:57pm
YOU can respect that, I think it's silly http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

Lee
Jan-12-2005, 8:09am
Will he use black masking tape on the headstock in public?

b.pat
Jan-12-2005, 10:37am
Wow!!
Now The Heirloom #43 is in the classifieds.
B.Pat http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif

addcourt
Jan-12-2005, 11:09am
Now just hold on! I bought that Heirloom from Ben and found it to be a great mandolin in it's price range(and probably higher). I've got three other mandolins that are all varnish finish and prefer varnish. The Heirloom came close to staying with me but I decided to order a varnish Heirloom instead. The deal with the current owner was a temporary step for him and I feel certain that he'd be happy to tell you what an outstanding instrument it is. It had NO problems when I owned it and I assume it remains that way. Please don't lose faith in Ben Wilcox over the events of the past week. He's a world class luthier and certainly on the rise. Thanks

Scotti Adams
Jan-12-2005, 11:22am
very well said Mike....Now come on people...Ben represents a fine product...I still stand by that....they are a great bang for the buck....its just Ive reached a time in my playig where I want to try something new....please respect that...no more dissing. This is all I have to say on the subject.

MandoPicker
Jan-12-2005, 9:40pm
I think this really goes a long way in determining someones character. I don't get it why anyone would want to keep purchasing a mandolin a big secret. This by itself seems shady to me. Now, I'm not one of the people that "got in the choir" and sang the BRW tune when Mr. Adams thought these were the best thing since slice bread, but I know a lot of you all bought on his rants on here. Now, I really believe you all deserve an explanation from Mr. Adams as to why the sudden change of heart. After all, you know for damn sure he'll be ranting and raving about this new Rose he ordered and will proclaim it to be the next Gilchrist. I remember him swearing his BRW to be better than his Gilchrist. I'm still laughing about that. In closing, I just want each of you to prepare yourself for the onslaught of his reviews of the next godsent mandolin that he owns. Think about all this, it really does say something about his character.

John

ShaneJ
Jan-12-2005, 11:40pm
Whatever displeasure anybody may have here, I don't think there should be any displeasure with the builders (BRW & Darby). I hate that they get inadvertently drug into stuff -- kind of like Martin Brunkella's introduction to mandoworld. I don't think any of these builders asked for any of this.

atetone
Jan-12-2005, 11:46pm
The problem with a thread like this and a situation like this is that just because one very vocal owner of a BRW decides to leave the lovefest, automatically Mr Wilcoxs' (who I don't know from Mr Adams) abilities are now thrown into scrutiny bordering on disrespect due to the secretive and sudden manner in which the parting of ways took place.
There is a nasty pall hanging over this whole series of events.
It seems to me that through no fault of his own Ben Wilcoxs' stock takes the biggest hit in all of this.
That just doesn't seem fair to me even though I have never seen or held one of his mandos so therefore know nothing of any value about him or his mandos. (I refrained from getting involved in following The Great BRW Thread.)
This is very distasteful stuff.
Not quite sure what is going on but something stinks.

Mando4Life
Jan-13-2005, 12:02am
can't a man just change his mind???

hang in there scotti....you know this will fade away soon ...

Tom C
Jan-13-2005, 8:42am
I do not know what changes Scotti's mind. It's not my business, I did not ask, and Scotti does not have to answer to me or anyone. I do not think it had anything to do with the craftmanship or that particular mando. If he did not like the mando he got, he would have returned it. With the relationship, and proximity they have/had, I'm sure Scotti would have had more flexibilty. All I know is that the mando I got was more than I could have asked for. Almost 1 1/2 years later I have not had any issues or buyer remorse. I love seeing all the new ones Ben's been building from orange to varnish to heirloom. I may even speak to him about an f-4 if he would like to take it on.

StoneSt
Jan-13-2005, 9:01am
"Don't need a weatherman to know which way the wind blows"

One of my favorite quotes along these lines is, "If that is the way the wind is blowing, let it not be said that I do not also blow." --Mayor Quimby (The Simpsons) http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

Seriously though, I have to imagine that it is the luthiers love of their craft that allows them to weather the storms the rest of us throw at 'em.

Lee
Jan-13-2005, 9:36am
If someone allows themself to jump on someone else's roller-coaster then he/she has only themself to blame for the ride.

Tom C
Jan-13-2005, 9:54am
Huh?

Scotti Adams
Jan-13-2005, 9:59am
damn..cant some people just leave things alone...surely theres more to your lives than worrying about what mando I play....a few of you are being unfair.....judging my character because I want a different mando....if some of you feel the need to snide me...feel free to call me..dont hide behide a computer screen ...937 768 2598.....Im so tired of this ####.....Im not typing another word on this subject.

futrconslr
Jan-13-2005, 10:00am
If someone allows themself to jump on someone else's roller-coaster then he/she has only themself to blame for the ride.

Huh?


I think he is saying "Buyer Beware"

fatt-dad
Jan-13-2005, 10:05am
because one very vocal owner of a BRW
Maybe it's just a vocal owner - period. I mean this is a message board and vocal people (o.k. those that type fast) are encouraged to express themselves. I see no reason to make an issue that Mr. Adams contributed on his interest in one topic and will likely contribute in the future. That said, none of us are "obligated" to discuss anything on this board. Further, maybe there is a non-mandolin-related reason that Mr. Adams is ridding his BRW - who cares?

Scheese!

Scotti Adams
Jan-13-2005, 10:09am
..now there you go Fatt-Dad...thanks...there is truth in what you have said.

Darryl Wolfe
Jan-13-2005, 10:27am
I had a Paganoni once (after I sold my Loar)...I had a Gilchrist once too...I had a Loar with a Virzi and took it out..
..I had a Herringbone D
..I had a non-herringbone D
...I sold them after I got my Henderson D...
..I bought a new D-18GE....
I bought another Loar
..I bought a bunch of A-models..I sold a bunch of A-models

What's the big deal here?...who says you have to keep everything you like...there's not a lot of difference between MAS and MGS (mandolin gigolo syndrome) and there's certainly nothing wrong with it. follow your heart and what's best for you "now" Scotti.

futrconslr
Jan-13-2005, 10:40am
Yeah, I agree....I havent been playing as long as most guys on here and I have already gone through three mandos and am looking for another!

StoneSt
Jan-13-2005, 10:49am
No big deal here, I love a new mando as much as anyone...but you gotta admit Quimby rocks! ;)
Truely Scotty, I hope the new Rose works well for you. Play the heck out of it. #http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/mandosmiley.gif # Just don't bump it for 3 years straight. (<-- and i mean that with a light heart.) http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

-Bob

Lee
Jan-13-2005, 11:06am
Sorry if I was cryptic. I wasn't insinuating anything about buyer beware.
I love to hear Scotti, and everyone else, rant and rave about their newest love. And some of us will have fickle tastes. That's human nature. Accept it. I get the impression that some have allowed themselves to get swept up in someone elses's fealities to the point were they felt the need to deride the fellow when they unpredictably changed. That's not fair.

J. Mark Lane
Jan-13-2005, 11:39am
I had a Paganoni once (after I sold my Loar)...I had a Gilchrist once too...I had a Loar with a Virzi and took it out..
..I had a Herringbone D
..I had a non-herringbone D
# #...I sold them after I got my Henderson D...
# # # # #..I bought a new D-18GE....
I bought another Loar
# ..I bought a bunch of A-models..I sold a bunch of A-models

What's the big deal here?...who says you have to keep everything you like...there's not a lot of difference between MAS and MGS (mandolin gigolo syndrome) and there's certainly nothing wrong with it. #follow your heart and what's best for you "now" Scotti.
So Daryl... You still have the D18GE?

Mark

futrconslr
Jan-13-2005, 12:32pm
"Love grows cold" definately applies to mandolins.:D

Darryl Wolfe
Jan-13-2005, 1:26pm
"So Daryl... You still have the D18GE?

Mark "

yep..great guitar..added Greven guard

link to d18 (http://www.f5journal.com/pic_day/misc/d18ge.JPG)

J. Mark Lane
Jan-13-2005, 1:51pm
Yeah, if I buy another production level acoustic guitar, it's gonna be a D18GE. Nice. Very nice.

Mark

pickinNgrinnin
Jan-13-2005, 2:31pm
I think it's great that there are so many skilled builders and outstanding Mandolins to choose from today. I know that was not the case in years past. The number of choices we have today certainly contribute to M.A.S. Buying and selling is part of the process to find one you like. Even when you do find one you like, another may come along to replace it. I completely understand that, as I have been there myself.

When folks get a new Mandolin, I enjoy reading about their experience in a vicarious way. I enjoy the enthusiasm they show towards the new instrument. However, the enthusiasm can at times (IMO) get a little carried away as we have seen with the BRW's, Brunkella's and what may be on the horizon tomorrow. If people want to buy and sell, that's fine - I don't think that is the issue here. However, It may be wise to temper the enthusiasm about the new Mandolin with some degree of moderation. Experience shows that it could be up for sale at some point down the road due to the next "greatest" one coming along. http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif That's my .02 YMMV

Ken Sager
Jan-13-2005, 2:38pm
I applaud any and every attempt to buy/sell/swap mandolins. It's cheaper - not to mention easier and less risky - to have a new mandolin (or two) every year than a new wife/husband/whatever, and a new instrument is much more satisfying on many levels than a new wife/husband/whatever could be. Sure, crowing about a new mandolin then selling it may appear suspect to some, but it's all about the joy, right?

Now, go make your dreams come true.

Joy to all,
Ken

jasona
Jan-13-2005, 2:57pm
I just can't understand why you all flip your new mandos so quickly, given how much fun I'm having with the whole "opening up--playing it in" process http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

ethanopia
Jan-13-2005, 3:24pm
I'm with Jason what ever happened to collecting,

in MAS...

the A stands for Aquisition not horse trading.

I plan on keeping mine long enough for it aquire some serious wear and love marks. War wounds come from battle, and chicks dig scars.

DBL
Jan-13-2005, 3:50pm
Hold it please.

I was the "buyer" of Mandolin #6 when it was listed in the classifieds. A certain gentleman who owned the mandolin had had it damaged. Apparently there was a crack inside the Mandonlin. Additionally, this gentleman's home flooded and in the process, the mandolin became soaked with water. The gentleman proceeded to dry the mandolin out in a Hot area.

Said Gentleman then sent this # 6 mandolin to Ben Wilcox of BRW who gave him a new instrument out of his own Christian goodness and the kindness of his own heart. The original owner asked Mr. Wilcox if he could keep #6 and Mr. Wilco agreed to let the original owner keep the damaged mandolin, UNDER THE CONDITIONS THAT THE MANDOLIN NEVER BE SOLD. Ben was of the mind that the mandolin was structurally not stabile.

The gentleman agreed not to sell #6.

Subsequently, the gentleman did in fact sell the damaged #6 to an unsuspecting new owner, WITHOUT REVEALING THE TERMS UNDER WHICH MR. WILCOX HAD SWORN HIM TO.

The new buyer played the mandolin for a few months and then decided to sell it. I thought I indeed was the lucky one who
acted quickly enough to snap it up.

HOWEVER MUCH TO MY DISMAY, I learnt that #6 was in fact, gotten from the original buyer for FREE and was DAMAGED GOODS NOT TO BE SOLD UPON FIRM INSTRUCTIONS FROM THE MANUFACTURER. First owner had no right to sell the mandolin and did so under false pretenses.

Upon learning this, I cancelled the purchase.

Apparently, the original owner, now exposed, has "sold" #40.
I bet.

BRW mandolins remain the world-class quality instruments they always were despite what despicable innuendos said first purchaser may have left on this forum. Ben Wilcox went out of his way to make this person happy, and in fact gave him a free mandolin, and in return, he has gotten smeared. He is a true gentleman and Honest. I cannot say that for the original owner.

There is only one truth under heaven and he will be so judged accordingly. But take what the original owner represents to have happenened with a grain of salt. And I expect that he will now either disappear into his shell or spew further untruths onto this board.

I was lucky enough to escape his dishonesty, but someone out there has been stuck with a lemon, which he was told was a peach.

Respectfully,

DBL

DBL
Jan-13-2005, 3:54pm
By the way...

The reason that said original owner has not revealed the new buyer of #40 speaks volumes. The Emperor has new clothes.

JD Cowles
Jan-13-2005, 3:59pm
let he (or she) who is whithout MAS cast the first stone...

this has gone too far. OK everyone, let's pick one!
http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/coffee.gif

pickinNgrinnin
Jan-13-2005, 4:04pm
Oh my gosh

mandofiddle
Jan-13-2005, 4:20pm
... and the plot thickens ... Whoa!

Scotti Adams
Jan-13-2005, 4:36pm
Well DBL....of course you only know one side of the story....and I assure you you have many facts wrong..Im not gonna public with this...Ive got more class than that....I sent you a PM...read it..and read it good....because thats what happpened...

Scotti Adams
Jan-13-2005, 4:39pm
By the way DBL..you were the second buyer of #6....the first buyer was happy with it..he knew the history on it as I knew it and the whole cafe community knew it. It was only after you made your contact with the builder that some other info that I never knew about the mando came to surface....for instance...I never knew the whole top center seam had been reglued...this info was not given to me when I bought the mando....

Scotti Adams
Jan-13-2005, 4:42pm
Im done with it Jim...people are gonna believe what they want to believe.....some people have just got it out for me..I dont care....I just want to put the whole mess behind me....frankly its nobodys business. By the way DBL...the new owner of #40...wants to remain anonymous for the time being...that wasnt my call...that was his..I will respect that.

DBL
Jan-13-2005, 5:01pm
Scotti, I don't think you are telling the truth, either in your PM to me, or to the board.

I think you still have #40.

"Anonymous"....hmmm....

So are you saying you did not get a FREE mandolin and sell it?

The lord knows the truth. Don't insult me by trying to lie to me. This will settle out; probably not during our lifetimes.

Scotti Adams
Jan-13-2005, 5:19pm
DBL..there are a handful of people who know the truth..consider yourself lucky..your one of them.....Im outta here....probably for good....I dont have time for these dog and pony shows...

mandofiddle
Jan-13-2005, 5:28pm
You know, all this back and forth makes me wonder if this whole thing started out as a mole hill, and was made a mountain simply becauue of the secrecy and speculation that comes from it. #I think that we, as humans, will make something WAY more dramatic when left to our own imagination than if we simply knew what was going on. #I mean, for example, look at the stuff on Area 51, and all the "alien believers" who use that and Roswell in their theories. #I mean, if there were aliens and we were aware of it, would it even really be that interesting? #Or would it be just another thing that we're used to living with everyday?

Things that make you go hmmmm http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif

Jonathan Reinhardt
Jan-13-2005, 5:55pm
Don't close the door, Scotti -
there are those of us, your internet friends, who appreciate you, your enthusiasm, you love of mandolin, and your care for fellow pickers.
a friend also trusts - and you have given your internet friends no reason not to do just that. you are allowed to conduct your business in private, even though you are in the spotlight at the moment.


rasa

AlanN
Jan-13-2005, 5:57pm
Yeah Scotti, you're a true mando dog if ever there was one. Don't let the blue meanies get to ya http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

fatt-dad
Jan-13-2005, 6:00pm
So, is 3726 posts the goal to aspire to? That's no fun.

f-d

DBL
Jan-13-2005, 6:00pm
Mr. Adams -

I would imagine it's going to be tough with #40 sitting in a case for the rest of it's life. We'll see what you are playing at your next gig.

BRW
Jan-13-2005, 6:01pm
Here's my two cents. I originally built this mandolin and sold it at a discounted price because the shapes were not as good as I wanted and it had some flaws (the body is slightly too big, etc). A fellow in Texas owned it for a year or so. He then wanted to trade it in for a newer model. I traded it with him and I then sold it to Scotti. Scotti had it for a while and then a finish crack started to open up in the top center seam near the tailpiece (about 1-2 inches in length). Then the center seam itself started to come loose. I can correct the comment posted earlier in this forum by informing you that this mandolin has never had the entire top seem re-glued. It is hard to track down the cause of cracks sometimes. I didn't know if it was because of the humidity change from Texas to Ohio, or if it had taken a knock in the shipping which did not make any observable crack but later separated, or if it had been damaged during use, or if it was simply a poor joint. I then cleated the top from the inside and it held for a while but it continued to worsen. I became suspicious of the integrity of that particular piece of wood and its ability to retain its shape after the repair and I started discussing the possibility of replacement. Scotti agreed to have a replacement built. A while down the road Scotti called the shop and said that his basement had flooded and that the mandolin had been flooded. He indicated that water actually got into the mandolin and I believe he made some discussion of this on the Mandolin Cafe. He also told me that the mandolin had been shrinking due to moisture loss perhaps because it was in a de-humidified area and that the top had even pulled back a little at the scroll (I cannot recall whether this was before or after the flooding). I did not see this with my own eyes. I had however lost all confidence in the integrity of the instrument and continued to build the replacement. When the replacement was finished he asked what would become of #6 and (as I remember) I said that I did not want it to be sold and that I did not want it to be on the market. He was very intersted in keeping it because it sounded so good and I proposed that he could keep it for six months or until it died and I told him I would like him to keep it in his basement for his own playing only. This discussion was more "in-passing" than it should have been. I did not make a formal agreement with him. We just used the word "OK" which just doesn't do much good. I did not have him sign anything; I did not have him shake on it, and I didn't even make it clear that it was really a difinitive decision. I had my mind more focused on other instruments at the time that I had finished this replacement, and so I never resolved it. He took the replacement and I went about my work without re-visiting the issue or paying it any more thought. Scotti decided to sell number six and put it up in the ads. I was unaware of its sale and so I didn't object. When that first buyer decided to sell it, the new prospective buyer said, "Apparently Scotti dripped some water on the finish and there is some slight cosmetic damage, but I'm hoping it is minimal." This surprised me as I did not expect it to be on the market and I had thought I conveyed the idea that this was on "loan" until it reached its demise or I decided I wanted it back. I felt as if I had more information to give him about the mandolin so I told him that my understanding was that it was "flooded" and that the wood in the interior had actually been wet causing crazing of the finish. While this is not terrible cosmetic damage, I felt that because this mandolin had been "replaced" because I was unconfident in its integrity, additional stress from water was something to be of particular concern. So I gave the prospective buyer my opinion on the instrument's integrity and I also told him that I believed it would not be sold and was surprised that it was already one more owner down the line. I did not tell him to not purchase the instrument. I did tell him that the mandolin does sound amazing as has been advertised. I told him to make his own decision. The mandolin was sold at a significantly higher price than was paid for it. It is entirely possible that it is worth that amount despite the damage or my lack of confidence in its integrity. I did however advise the prospective buyer that in my opinion it should be at a lower price or not on the market at all, but I indicated that it was still the buyer's decision. He decided against purchasing it. The person who bought it from Scotti apparently discussed these issues with the prospective buyer and indicated that he felt that he was not happy with the deal after hearing my opinion of the instrument and its re-sale.

I take full responsibility for not making a formal aggreement with Scotti about what would happen to #6 after it was replaced. I did not talk about it enough and I did not make an issue out of it, which really left the door open for him to do with it what he wanted. I do not think that he can be discredited for my lack of implicity about the no-resale condition on the instrument. I think it is inevitable for the "story" to change as things get passed down the line simply out of translation. I even see some inaccuracies cropping out of what I told the prospective buyer; simply because the description of the damage gets re-interpreted with every re-telling of the story. I told Scotti he couldn't sell it, but I was not explicit, not forceful, and not specific, and it was right in the midst of a larger conversation. I offer my apologies to Scotti and others who feel affected.

I have the ability to resolve this issue and I am going to take the appropriate steps. I will replace the instrument for the second buyer and re-claim it this time. That will satisfy my wish to keep it out of the market and the owner will be happy to have an undamaged mandolin. Scotti has his replacement instrument and can do with it what he wishes. I do not see why it is a big deal that he wants to switch brands. There is not only one good thing out there. Perhaps he is tired of my instruments, or perhaps he needs to sell it to assist in cashflow; perhaps he has found another builder that suits him better. I strongly discourage band-wagoning when buying instruments. I think that each person needs different things at different times and it is perfectly normal to need to move on to something different, whether it be tonally, or visually, or in regards to price or prestige. I encourage prospective customers to try out different instruments. It is supposed to be an adventure. If Scotti tried out a hundred different instruments and gave them all accolades on the message boards that would be fine and probably all well deserved. There is a plethora of wonderfull options out there. I don't think he deserves to be prodded to discover his motivations and intentions.

I see no point to arguing over who-sold-what-to-whom. I see no positive change coming from that. If Scotti wishes to change pants, let him. I think Scotti is a kind-hearted person and is a very good judge of tone, so do not try to discredit him just because he is making a change. I am the one responsible for #6 being on the market against my preference and I will take responsibility and take care of it for the current owner. Again I implore you to be kind to each other. I can attend to each one of your needs in a suitable fashion and I have made what I think is a responsible and fair offer to resolve the situation regarding #6. I say let bygones be bygones and lets get back to whatever is important (and I am sure that is not using the Mandolin Cafe Message Boards for fingerpointing).

If it will help resolve any hard feelings I offer to take responsibility and absorb the issue. I also sincerely offer my apologies to those of you who are upset.

Best Regards,

Benjamin R. Wilcox

BRW Musical Instruments

Scotti Adams
Jan-13-2005, 6:11pm
..and there as Paul Harvey would say.."theres the rest of the story. My many thanks to Ben....it was and is a simple case of "what we have here is a failure to communicate and nobody wanted to talk about it."

DBL
Jan-13-2005, 6:17pm
Next up on Sports channel: Scotti miraculously gets his BRW returned by the new buyer!

Scotti Adams
Jan-13-2005, 6:19pm
..man you just wont leave it alone will you...

AlanN
Jan-13-2005, 6:25pm
quote here...Charlie and BigJoe you should be taking notes....

My goodness, one fight is winding down and you want to start another one? Get a life.

DBL
Jan-13-2005, 6:25pm
Selling a Mandolin that is falsely represented is not right. Could you imagine what would happen if everyone sold damaged goods on the classifieds without revealing the truth?

You are lucky that Ben chose to be magnanimous, but how 'bout coming clean? Seems like you still have some 'splainin to do.

G. Fisher
Jan-13-2005, 6:33pm
Ben,

It is nice of you to come here and lay out the details. The way I see it you are out two free mandolins and one at a discounted price. I don't think it is fair that you ended up replacing the same mandolin twice. But, you seem to be very conscientious of your work and willing to step up and do work that#you shouldn't have to do.

Jonathan Reinhardt
Jan-13-2005, 6:40pm
as do you, David. Or better yet, let's bring this discussion to an end.
This is not about sides. It appears to be a personal vendetta of your's.
Your post explaning the facts from your perspective was unclear and confusing. (From a paper grading standpoint, it would have failed.)
You did not purchase from Scotti.
And the Cafe is not the place for this.
I would suggest you think it through and refrain from pursuing this particular agenda. You are welcome here, but this line of posting is counterproductive.

rasa

DBL
Jan-13-2005, 6:42pm
Scotti,

My last post. I'm sure you'll be happy.

Tell you what. Stop PMing me begging me to "let it go." Obviously there's something not kosher bothering your conscience.

How bout a nice plug for Ben? And letting everyone know that you are going to keep #40 cause it's a great axe?

Then we'll be whole and I will plug it.

JimW
Jan-13-2005, 6:47pm
Ben, I'm sure you're not looking for pats on the back, but I'll simply say you're a class act. I think you're going above and beyond your responsibility on this one and I commend you for it. I'll be in contact with you soon as I'm looking into getting a varnished A5.

Jim Watts

Scotti Adams
Jan-13-2005, 6:51pm
..Im gonna make one last comment and I hope this issue dies....I didnt misrepresent the mando...I told the history of it as I knew it...the issue of the top seam crack..like Ben said got blown way out of perportion.....I kept that mando another 10 months after the inch long grain crack was repaired and the small water damage occured. I wanted to make sure that the mando was solid....I didnt want to sell it knowing that it may not be worthy....after 10 months..after no problems....and due to personal issues i put it up for sale. As Ben made clear...our agreement about not selling it was about as clear as mud. So I sold it...the first buyer was happy with the mando...it was only after DBL went to buy it that this misconstrued info got back to me about the mando supposedly having "many repairs" including the infamous seam crack. That pissed me off..thinking I had not been told the truth all along about the mando and that made it look like I misled someone. Anybody who truly knows me knows Im not a con or a liar. Im a straight shooter. That may get me in trouble sometimes but oh well. As far as the issue with #40 goes...like Ben said...I am free to do with it as I please...I chose to sell it....I shipped it over night to the gentleman....and he is truly getting a fine mando. One positive note...I think..along with my help ..BRW mandos were put into alot of hands and buyers during my relationship with Ben and ver rightfully so because they are a fine mando. So..Im done with this subject...please people..let it go. Ben is a class act..and yes..#40 is gone and it is a fine, fine mando...so there...lets eat. http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

Tiderider
Jan-13-2005, 8:24pm
Scotti, I'm not going to pass judgement but as a "straight shooter" and being that you made a profit on #6, I would probably send Ben a check to help offset his loss. JMHO.

Lee

pickinNgrinnin
Jan-13-2005, 8:58pm
I've never me Mr. Wilcox nor have I played one of his Mandolins. After reading his post, I have nothing but respect for him as a person and as a builder. I'm not sure many people in a similar position would fall on the sword like Mr. Wilcox did. He appears to have taken a bath on the deal and accepts full responsibility for not reaching a formal agreement in regard to the re-sale of #6. Given what #6 had been through, it's difficult to grasp how the re-sale ban could have been misunderstood.

Unreal

I may now be thinking of a BRW. Props to Mr. Wilcox!!!

atetone
Jan-13-2005, 9:10pm
Well I am a believer in the old adage than eventually things work themselves out.
Even though it seems that Ben Wilcox is going to lose big on this financially his personal integrity stock just soared through the ceiling. That was my concern in all of this affair.
Turns out that he comes out a winner when all is said and done.
Ya gotta love a good ending!!
One thing that I truly like about the mando community is that despite running into the odd joker, my experience has been that the vast majority of the people are pretty good eggs with lots of real class acts sprinkled in all over the place.
Lots of those class acts that I have run into are also mandolin builders.
I have often wondered just what it is about building mandolins that either attracts or creates such calm, easygoing, fair people.
Is it something in the sawdust??
Anyway,, I feel like I just discovered another one cut from the same cloth. Good stuff.

ShaneJ
Jan-13-2005, 9:17pm
Amen to that!

Crowder
Jan-13-2005, 9:19pm
I'm glad Ben posted here, and not only because it will let others get an idea of what a good guy he is and how conscientious he is regarding his work and his reputation.

dj9124
Jan-13-2005, 9:52pm
I would like to add something here as I am currently the ownwer of #6. Ben said he was going to make it right one way or another, before all of this exploded on the message board, he did not decide to replace the mandolin because of what was posted, he decided that before all this came to a head. Above and beyond? You better believe it, Ben is going way above the call of duty. I would have been satisifed to get it retopped but for Ben to build a totally new one to replace it just blows me away. Ben is definitely a class act and I think this leaves no doubt in his stance for customer satisfaction whether you are the original purchaser or not.
Dave

Tom C
Jan-13-2005, 10:40pm
Ben's a double class act, since this is the second time he's is replacing it. Scotti is too sincere to have done anything knowingly wrong. This whole thing just never made sense til now. Communication problems often cause unnecessary pain.

jacobw
Jan-13-2005, 11:30pm
I have a lot of respect for Ben Wilcox. "Stand by your brand!" http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

Lee
Jan-14-2005, 8:16am
Was that Scotti and Dave I saw on the back porch clinking glasses of single malt? Boys, it's much to early in the morning for that!
Thanks for setting things straight, Ben. You're the greatest!

Darryl Wolfe
Jan-14-2005, 9:04am
I guess we know now why C. F. Marin & Co. simply band saws them up and sells little momento pieces.

My hat is off to Ben..class act response in a difficult situation.

pickinNgrinnin
Jan-14-2005, 9:18am
It's more likely that Dave is clinking glasses with Ben.

Dave is one lucky fellow in that he is dealing with Mr. Wilcox.

gilman7995
Jan-14-2005, 9:34am
boy am i glad i stumbled upon this topic....i have a nice little scotti story tell....i bought scottis 1980 gilchrist some yrs ago....when i went to dayton to pick it up i noticed some repairs had been done to it...at that time i asked about them...SCOTTI TOLD ME THAT IT WAS LIKE THAT WHEN HE BOUGHT IT....within days i found out the mandolin had a replacement neck done by guy hart of buckeye fame (he builds a good mandolin by the way) from another i found out scotti knew about everything that had been done to the mandolin....heres a quote from mr adams.......

it was only after DBL went to buy it that this misconstrued info got back to me about the mando supposedly having "many repairs" including the infamous seam crack. That pissed me off..thinking I had not been told the truth all along about the mando and that made it look like I misled someone. Anybody who truly knows me knows Im not a con or a liar. Im a straight shooter. That may get me in trouble sometimes but oh well.
GEE SCOTTI I KNOW EXACTLY HOW THAT FEELS SINCE IT IS WHAT YOU DID TO ME...to get to the point scotti is a liar and he will misled someone to sell a insturment...people like the "straight shooting" mr adams will always find a justification in their own mind to treat others like they do....its bad that he continues to do this...i will not hide behind the internet like he told someone else in a post...my name is mark royal from ky......remember me scotti ol pal?http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif??

gilman7995
Jan-14-2005, 9:35am
correction ...pete hart.....not guy hart.........

cbogle
Jan-14-2005, 9:42am
This is the most entertaining read I've had in years. And these are my final words on the subject.

Tom C
Jan-14-2005, 9:57am
"boy am i glad i stumbled upon this topic...." #
Gee 2 posts. Registered on the 13th. It seems you went out of your way to register on this web site just to bash, troll and add more grief to an already existing issue. I remember when Scotti sold it to buyer #1 and they were fully aware of what they were buying. There were posts Scotti put up when the seam split, there were posts of when his house got water logged. It would have been most impossible for Scotti to pass it off as just used because of all his posts . He would #not then turn around and pretend nothing happened to it. Because buyer #1 did convey those issues to buyer #2 properly, this should have not come back to Scotti,no less Ben. Any pics of #44 - #50?

Tim
Jan-14-2005, 10:14am
Any BRW owners in the Northern Virginia area? #Mr. Wilcox's response to this whole thing makes me want one but I'd like to hear/see one first.

mandofiddle
Jan-14-2005, 10:24am
After Ben's post, he's definitely on my list for my next mandolin purchase. Now I'll have to decide between him and Hilburn. Darn it, it was so easy before http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

Tom C
Jan-14-2005, 10:26am
Just to add more drool . Once again #27

Tom C
Jan-14-2005, 10:27am
Front

Keith Wallen
Jan-14-2005, 10:31am
"boy am i glad i stumbled upon this topic...." #
Gee 2 posts. Registered on the 13th. It seems you went out of your way to register on this web site just to bash, troll and add more grief to an already existing issue. I remember when Scotti sold it to buyer #1 and they were fully aware of what they were buying. There were posts Scotti put up when the seam split, there were posts of when his house got water logged. It would have been most impossible for Scotti to pass it off as just used because of all his posts . He would #not then turn around and pretend nothing happened to it. Because buyer #1 did convey those issues to buyer #2 properly, this should have not come back to Scotti,no less Ben. Any pics of #44 - #50?
So Tom you are saying that everyone in the world (being a potential buyer) looks at the mandolin cafe and does searching on all the threads before they purchase a mando?? http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif

gilman7995
Jan-14-2005, 10:40am
yes i did go outta my way to register...but just to tell a true story about what happened to me and i hope the same dosent happen to someone else.....mr

Tom C
Jan-14-2005, 10:42am
No, but it's nothing that the orig seller would have hid from anybody else since he made made it all very visible here. That's all. If that was an '80s Gibson that the orig owner sold to buyer #1 who was aware of fixes. and Buyer #1 then tried to sell it to buyer #2 without telling buer #2 about fixes. Buyer #2 finds out Gibson fixed A,B,and C. Why should this come back to the original owner? It should fall on the last person to own it.

Lee
Jan-14-2005, 10:45am
After Ben's post I've half a mind to drive to Virginia to show Tim my BRW, tho I admit, it's "just" an A model and not as flambouyant as Tom's.

Tom C
Jan-14-2005, 10:46am
cbogle,
#You still with us. We don't want to bore you. http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif

cbogle
Jan-14-2005, 11:26am
Still with ya, Tom; and these are my final words on the subject. http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

fatt-dad
Jan-14-2005, 11:50am
Somewhere in the mix is personal accountability. I mean if you buy an expensive mandolin and you are not capeable of discerning whether it is as represented by the seller, then you would take it to a luthier, pay some fee (what are we talking $50.00) and get a condition report. Isn't that how we buy cars?

I don't know what Mr. Adams knew or didn't know. I am sure that there are things about some of my mandolins that I don't know and I've returned mandolins in the past - may even do it again in the future.

While all this whining is entertaining (great lunchtime reading), do we really have to continue the flogging?

fatt-dad

Izaac Walton
Jan-14-2005, 12:38pm
Ben Wilcox, dream builder. Anyway you read it, it's right on! Proud owner of BRW #42.

Izaac Walton
Jan-14-2005, 12:41pm
#42 back

Scott Tichenor
Jan-14-2005, 12:50pm
I'm closing this thread as it appears the main players have had their say. Everything else appears to be little more than ambulance chasing. I'd like to announce this is the last one of these bouts we'll have but that's highly unlikely. I'd tell everyone what I really think of this kind of behavior but unfortunately the people I want to hear the message don't listen.