Nice mixing board for small band

[erick]

I just picked up a Soundcraft EFX-8 small mixing board for my band, and I'm pretty impressed with the features. Among them- 8 independent mic inputs,each with phantom power, 3 band eq with sweepable mids, effects and monitor sends and solo and mute buttons with a 60 mm fader. The whole thing has a nice hefty feel to it; the knobs move smoothly ,the jacks are heavy duty, and on board effects are pretty decent. There are a few nice perks like a mono out, discrete left and right house outs ( can let you create an extra monitor mix if you're clever) phono jack ins and outs, insert points on all channels, and additional line in channels. I got mine at Full Compass in WI for just under $400. For bands that need more than 4 phantom powered inputs ( most of the small Mackie boards only allow phantom on 2/3 of their input channels), this board looks like a winner. Oh yeah, and I like the way it sounds too!

No financial interest, I just wish they could make it in a first world country....
Eric Kilburn
Wellspring Sound

[Tim2723]

I picked up the six-channel version of it for our duo when I got the new Bose PAs. They are very well made, full-featured mixers. Like you say, it has features I didn't expect in such a small unit. I've had nothing but success with it. The only things I'd change is that there's no on/off switch, and the spot they chose for the AC cord to plug in is not too handy (but only because I don't rack-mount it).

I'm not concerned where things come from anymore (I have the serenity to accept something I can't change) and hadn't paid attention to that. It's so well built that I assumed it was from a first-world country. Soundcraft products come from Harman International who also make JBL, AKG, Crown, DigiTech, DBX, BSS, Studer, and a bunch of other fairly well-known names. They practically own the professional recording business and those brands are in studios everywhere, so I never gave it a second thought. Where are they made?

[foldedpath]

The only things I'd change is that there's no on/off switch, and the spot they chose for the AC cord to plug in is not too handy (but only because I don't rack-mount it).

IIRC, there's a little push button next to the AC input, isn't there? I agree that's not a great location, but I guess they ran out of room elsewhere. I had an EFX8 for a while, and it's a great little mixer! With Soundcraft you get the same mic preamps used in some of their more expensive, larger frame mixers. Nice and clean, with plenty of headroom. Soundcraft is also one of the few companies that give you a sweep (semi-parametric) mid EQ in this size and price range. That's a huge advantage for tone-shaping.

I did replace my EFX8 recently with the slightly larger MFXi8 model, but that was mainly because I needed LED's to indicate mute status, and the MFXi has a control for monitor output level, which makes it easier to use powered monitors. The MFXi is a little larger though, and heavier. Sometimes I miss the small size of the EFX8.

Note: anyone looking for compact mixers in this class should also check out the Allen & Heath ZED series, like the ZED 12FX (http://www.allen-heath.co.uk/zed/zed-12FX.asp). That's another British company making good quality mixers, with a sweep mid EQ. They prioritize different things though, like more AUX channels and longer-travel faders. The long fader travel is nice... makes mixing a little less twitchy... but along with the extra AUX channels it means the chassis is larger and heavier. Soundcraft also offers more XLR mic preamp channels in the comparable models. Anyway, I thought I'd mention Allen & Heath since they seem to be the main competitor to Soundcraft in this feature/price range. Both are a step up from Mackie, and way better than Behringer.


I'm not concerned where things come from anymore (I have the serenity to accept something I can't change) and hadn't paid attention to that. It's so well built that I assumed it was from a first-world country. Soundcraft products come from Harman International who also make JBL, AKG, Crown, DigiTech, DBX, BSS, Studer, and a bunch of other fairly well-known names. They practically own the professional recording business and those brands are in studios everywhere, so I never gave it a second thought. Where are they made?

It's manufactured in China, like just about everyone else is doing at this price level. My powered QSC K-series speakers are manufactured in China too. What isn't, these days? Well, my DPA clip-on mini mics aren't, but look at the price you pay for assembly and testing in Denmark, compared to the rest of the mini mics that are mostly manufactured in Asia (I know Audio Technica is, not sure about K&K).

Local factory floor jobs aren't coming back any time soon for these companies, so I think the important thing is to support the companies that do fund quality control and supervision at the overseas factories. And that also have an additional layer of quality control and support once the finished product arrives back in the home country for distribution (which does provide jobs). For example, QSC's 6-year warranty on their powered speakers. Or the overall component quality in Soundcraft and A&H mixers. You're not going to get that from Behringer.

[Tim2723]

No, there's no power switch, at least not on the six-channel version. I can see why they would put the AC cord where it is for rack mounting, but otherwise it's a minor PITA.

I pretty much figured they were made in China. Almost every other electronic thingy comes from there or at least has lots of components from there. It's all about quality in the end though, and the Soundcraft mixers have that in spades.

Odd that you mentioned Behringer. I just ordered a small four-channel mixer last night to serve as a backup. I don't really think I'll need one, but I'm one of those completely paranoid guys who needs a backup to everything. I've only owned one Behringer product (that little five-channel powered mixer they sell), and it still works perfectly after three years of bouncing around all over New Jersey. Some good products, some bad ones I guess.

[foldedpath]

Ah ha, I was thinking of the 8-channel version.

That's a good point about backups, and something I should probably think about more often. The most recent gigs have been within a short driving distance of the house, and I could swing by and grab my ancient Mackie 1202 in an emergency. But I should probably just toss it in the car every time.

More important, because there's a higher actual risk of failure... I do carry plenty of extra XLR cables, AC cables, 1/4" instrument cables, and spare mics (good 'ol 57's that have outlived their usefulness otherwise). Also I've thought about various other failure scenarios and how to cope, like on a pre-St. Patrick's gig last year when the fiddler's wireless rig got swamped with RF interference. I had to switch gears and hard-wire his mic, and it was a good thing that I remembered to carry a box of adapter plugs. Microdot twist-lock to XLR isn't something they sell at the local hardware store.

'Ya know... one of these days it would be nice to just show up at a gig, and only have to worry about remembering the set list, and the music cues. Let someone else run the 'danged PA. You ever get that feeling?
;)

[Don Grieser]

I know that feeling well, foldedpath.

That efx8 could certainly take the place of the Mackie 1604vlz I've been lugging around and never using more than 6-8 channels on. I assume you could do the "plug 1/2 way in" on the inserts on the 8 channels on the Soundcraft to get separate line outs for multitracking a live show?

[Markus]

I got mine at Full Compass in WI

Glad to hear they did you right ... their building is a couple miles away, always nice to hear when a local business does good. [No personal connection, knew someone who worked there a decade+ ago]

Thanks for the mixer review ... I'm filing this one away for future use.

[pops1]

I have been using a Carvin Head. It is compact, light gives me 12 channels with phantom, 3 power amps, two eq's switch for main and monitor. I can use two power amps for main and one for monitor each with an eq. Three band eq on each channel. all in one head it's really a nice compact unit. Now they are making the 12 channel with 4 power amps and 4-9band eq's. Believe they are made here, just have no middle man so price is fair.

[Tim2723]

'Ya know... one of these days it would be nice to just show up at a gig, and only have to worry about remembering the set list, and the music cues. Let someone else run the 'danged PA. You ever get that feeling?
;)

Preach it brother! I carry spare parts for things I don't even own!! I'm the Mommy. Adapters? You kiddin'? I have an old tin box with every adapter on Radio Shack's wall. I can plug anything into anything.

[Charlieshafer]

I have to say I'm impressed with you guys who run your own sound. I've no idea how you can make adjustments during a show based on audience size, ambient noise, etc. It's tough enough just doing the sound alone. Do any of you run a complete mix as it sounds out in the room back to the stage as a monitor so that you can hear what's out there? I know it's not a complete panacea, as the sound can change depending on what clothes are being worn by the audience, but at least it has to help, I would think.

[Tim2723]

For the last couple of month's I've been using the Bose PAS systems that function as main and monitor, so there's only one mix. It doesn't sound like it should work, I know, but it does. And better than any conventional main/monitor set up I've used in 30 years.

[foldedpath]

That efx8 could certainly take the place of the Mackie 1604vlz I've been lugging around and never using more than 6-8 channels on. I assume you could do the "plug 1/2 way in" on the inserts on the 8 channels on the Soundcraft to get separate line outs for multitracking a live show?

Yep, that would work on the inserts, although I think it's safer for live gigs to use a plug with the leads shorted, so you can insert it all the way in without worrying about the halfway position. That way, it can't be accidentally bumped or the cable yanked to interrupt the live signal during a gig, and you still get the tap for recording. HOSA makes an inexpensive plug/cable adapter for doing this, or you can make the same thing yourself for less money if you're familiar with soldering cables and plugs. Here's the prefab adapter:

http://www.zzounds.com/item--HOSDOC10

Here's the diagram for wiring it:

http://www.hosatech.com/media/document/DOC106.pdf

I've used those HOSA adapters to do scratch band rehearsal recordings on separate tracks, running into an RME Fireface 400 interface and a laptop computer. It works fine.

[foldedpath]

Do any of you run a complete mix as it sounds out in the room back to the stage as a monitor so that you can hear what's out there? I know it's not a complete panacea, as the sound can change depending on what clothes are being worn by the audience, but at least it has to help, I would think.

I run a single monitor mix that's EQ'd the same as what's going out to the house, except for a few extremely narrow bands of auto-digital notching for feedback control. But I don't fool myself that it's what the house is hearing.

Even aside from the difference in speakers I'm using for mains and monitors, what the audience hears out in front isn't what I'm hearing on stage unless it's a very small room. It's not the same volume, and not the same tone when you take into account room modes, cancellation, reflections, etc. It's just not the same, and can't ever be.

What I try to do, as a self-mixer is this:


Get familiar enough with the band and the gear so the baseline channel EQ and input level at the mixer's head amp doesn't change from one gig to the next. The main speakers I use are good enough that I don't bother trying to "EQ" the speakers to the room, unless there is some major problem like a totally dead room that needs a little boost in the highs.


When there is time for an actual sound check, I walk out into the audience area with a wireless rig on my mandolin and guitar, so I can sound check with everyone playing (including me) and at least hear what the room sounds like. It doesn't include the body absorption or ambient conversation levels from the audience, but it's a starting point for setting the output volume.


When the break comes around, I ask anyone whose ears I trust in the audience if we're sounding okay. Or the person who is writing the check for the night.

It's not a perfect system, but it gets us close if we have enough time. There's only so much you can do without a sound person. And I would rather do this, than work with some PA systems and sound persons I've met... so that's the other side of the coin. I would gladly hand over the keys to anyone who knew what they were doing, and had a decent rig.

[Tim2723]

I don't even consider myself among those who run their own sound. With a duo everything is easy. Difficulties increase exponentially with the number of members involved, so a duo is nothing. We set up, set the volume we need, increase or decrease it with the crowd. The only EQ we might do is to add or subtract a touch of treble from the vocal mics for a particular room.

[rynando]

Note: anyone looking for compact mixers in this class should also check out the Allen & Heath ZED series, like the ZED 12FX (http://www.allen-heath.co.uk/zed/zed-12FX.asp). That's another British company making good quality mixers, with a sweep mid EQ. They prioritize different things though, like more AUX channels and longer-travel faders. The long fader travel is nice... makes mixing a little less twitchy... but along with the extra AUX channels it means the chassis is larger and heavier. Soundcraft also offers more XLR mic preamp channels in the comparable models. Anyway, I thought I'd mention Allen & Heath since they seem to be the main competitor to Soundcraft in this feature/price range. Both are a step up from Mackie, and way better than Behringer.

If you're considering something like the ZED then Yamaha's N8 and N12 should also be on your list. They're very, very nice mixers and full featured digital audio interfaces as well. The compression on the N-series is superb and the reverb used is from one of Yamaha's dedicated reverb boxes and is almost too nice. The mic preamps are similar to what they use on their high-end digital consoles. I bought an N12 used for $600. The N8 is probably less. With something like an N8 or a ZED you could both provide a live mix and multi-track record your shows very easily.

[Tim2723]

I've seen the Yamaha N8 and it is a superb mixer for its size and price class. Excellent call. I've always liked the Yamaha products.

[GVD]

'Ya know... one of these days it would be nice to just show up at a gig, and only have to worry about remembering the set list, and the music cues. Let someone else run the 'danged PA. You ever get that feeling?
;)

Only every time I play a gig!!! ;)

[foldedpath]

If you're considering something like the ZED then Yamaha's N8 and N12 should also be on your list. They're very, very nice mixers and full featured digital audio interfaces as well. The compression on the N-series is superb and the reverb used is from one of Yamaha's dedicated reverb boxes and is almost too nice. The mic preamps are similar to what they use on their high-end digital consoles. I bought an N12 used for $600. The N8 is probably less. With something like an N8 or a ZED you could both provide a live mix and multi-track record your shows very easily.

Those Yamaha mixers are interesting. One thing to note, is that they're full digital mixers under the hood: everything is digitized after the head amps, so the EQ is also digital and should be very clean. Both the N8 and N12 can output each track separately for recording (which the A&H ZED series can't do, it's stereo mix only). However, the multi-track recording output is Firewire, and you'll need a fast and stable Firewire interface on your computer to handle multi-track recording. Good multi-channel Firewire interfaces aren't cheap.

Also, the N12 with the same number of mic preamps as the Soundcraft MFXi8 is over twice the price, due to the digital innards. The N-series mixers are designed mainly for recording, with space on the panel taken up by a DAW interface. It will work as a live mixer, but it only has one AUX output for monitors, and that might be limiting for some band setups. An all-analog mixer like the Soundcraft is theoretically more rugged and resistant to AC power weirdness than a digital mixer, but Yamaha builds good gear, and that might not be a problem.

While we're talking about the more expensive digital mixers like this...

If anyone is considering spending $1,200 USD for something like the N12 to get the multi-track Firewire output, you might want to consider looking at the PreSonus StudioLive 16.4.2 (http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/StudioLive16/) at $2k USD. It's more money, but it's not much larger and has many more features, like limiters and gates on each channel. The big difference is that it has scene recall (with manual fader matching), which to my mind is one of the big reasons to use a digital mixer. Scene recall is a big time-saver if you play in the same venue frequently, or need to quickly recall settings for different bands you play in. You do have to write down the head amp settings, since those are out of the digital loop, but it's still nice to have all the other stuff in memory.

We're getting away from the compact/rugged mixers for a "small band" where the thread started with these more expensive mixers, but I thought I'd mention the StudioLive because the Yamana N-series mixers are a sort-of halfway step in that direction.

[Charlieshafer]

I do have several friends using the StudioLive and absolutely loving it. With all the presets, it can make set-up a lot easier and quicker. They all say the sound quality is great as well. I recently went with a new board, and went Allen and Heath GL2400, only because I'm so used to the A&H layout is so familiar. The learning curve on the StudioLive was steep for me, but only because I'm really lazy with technology. Spending the 2K, as Folded suggests, might not be a horrible idea. What seems like a lot of cash now might have you saying that it's the best money you ever spent in a couple of years, when you get used to the quality and incredible flexibility. I do know you can mix all the channels and send one firewire mix out that will be just about studio quality, if you forget about the room noise and ambient acoustic problems. Some of the recordings I've heard to date off the StudioLive were pretty darn impressive for such modest cost, at least in terms of professional recording equipment. You just have to get that initial mix right.