Antonio Tsai

[Davetnova]

MAS has struck again. I cuoldn't resist this, just on looks, and it was fairly cheap. Now I know that others in the builder section have used some of his inlay work but has anybody played one of his mandolins?
His web site is hereAntonio Tsai (http://www.inlaidartist.com/)
Here's the one I bought

Yeah, I bought one of those on a lark to. The top can't handle much more than light strings. The bridge is a joke as is the tailpiece. It's a wall hanger, maybe not a total POS but close. Mine is hanging there waiting for me to install a decent tailpiece & a bridge wide enough to straddle the "tone bars"............you asked!

[Jim Garber]

Antonio is Taiwanese, not Indonesian. He is know for his inlay work. A friend of used him to do some fancy work and his prices are amazing considering the craftsmanship and comparable artists in the US.

What is also amazing is that considering the number of instruments he seems to sell on eBay, Dale is the first one I have heard who actually bought one and is willing to report honestly on how it plays. Where are the other Tsai buyers?

There are a few other threads about him here (http://www.mandolincafe.net/cgi-bin/ikonboard.cgi?act=Search&CODE=02&SID=4149a85b1a0102cc).

Jim

[b.pat]

[QUOTE]What is also amazing is that considering the number of instruments he seems to sell on eBay, Dale is the first one I have heard who actually bought one and is willing to report honestly on how it plays. Where are the other Tsai buyers?

You know, I wached 7 or 8 of his F styles sell to the same buyer within a few days. I just can't imagine hording these.
Very strange http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif
B.Pat

[mad dawg]

The model pictured above looks very intruging, and I can see how MAS would kick in. His F-styles that I've seen on eBay howver, are litteraly covered with inlay, including the back of the body, and the back of the headstock. It looked liked really nice inlay work work on those F-styles, but IMHO it crossed the line into excess (sort of like a Jeepney with strings).

[mandough]

I bought some shell material for inlay and also one of his brass tailpieces and a bridge. #They were all a piece of ####. #Workmanship on the tailpiece and bridge were horrible! #His shell pieces were all very dull and way too thin to use. #The bridge holes didn't match any known configuration and looked like a blind orangutan shaped it with a blunt hammer.
I wouldn't buy a thing from the guy. #He's nice but the quality of the things he sells on ebay are just laughable.
Just my experience.

I also was very curious about his mandolins awhile back, but, after I received these other pieces, I said fooooooorrrrrrrgettttt about it.

[Potosimando]

My experience was very similar to mandough's. #I bought a bunch of components just to check them out: couple of tailpieces, an inlaid fretboard, two bridges, a so-called pickguard. #I didn't know that quality could sink so low (material and execution). #I have to say, the inlay on the fretboard was nice, but the fret slots were not even parallel with on another, let alone spaced correctly (so far off, in fact, that I thought it would be fun to put it on a mando for what surely would be the world's worst intonation ever). #I find it very difficult to believe that this guy can even make a mandolin. #Don't throw your money away on one of his mandos--wallhanger at best (man, I wouldn't even want one of those on my wall though...what would a piece of #### on the wall say about its owner?).

[Potosimando]

P.S. Antonio Tsai (Tony) was looking for an outlet for tortoise shell on his last communication with me. Sure, Tony...let's finish off the last of that little old endangered species while were at it--in celebration of your luthery. Tony is a nice guy, but clueless nice guys can do a lot of damage to the world, I dare say.

"(man, I wouldn't even want one of those on my wall though...what would a piece of #### on the wall say about its owner?). "

What a wonderful play on words, I really apprieciate that. http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/mad.gif
It's easy to hurl insults when your hiding behind an anonymous screen name. Having that on my wall makes me brutally honest EX mandolin peddler who calls that mando just what it is.... at my own expense.

[Potosimando]

Sorry Dale, didn't mean any offense to you (wasn't even thinking of you or your post when I wrote my post), nor did I intend any play on words at all. #Just meant to say that Tony's workmanship isn't worth hanging on the wall. #I guess I am still smarting a little (and overreacting a lot) from spending hard-earned cash on his junk that has no use at all in my book.

Makes me uptight to see people getting suckered into buying Tony's wares. #He means well, I am sure, in fact I would bet that he believes he is one of the world's great contemparoary mandolin makers. Regardless, it seems to me that his junk puts a drag on the world view of mandolins..."Oh, so that's what a mandolin sounds like...hmmm". #But again, that's probably an overreaction on my part, and the last thing I plan to ever say again regarding Antonia Tsai. #Not worth the energy and time to complain, especially if I am inadvertently offending fellow mando-cafe folks with my poorly worded opinions.

[Davetnova]

Well thanks for the honesty. I admit to buying it purely because I liked the look and for the money I din't really expect a great mandolin.
You live, you learn and this is a great place to do it.

Potosi, Thanks for the post. I basically feel the same way about the guy's mandos as you.

Dave, yours is prettier than the one I have BTW.

[wsm]

I had Antonio do some inlay work for me. I sent him a nice piece of Ebony and artwork for a headstock inlay. I got the inlay back and it looked like something out of a comic book. I picked it up and and broke it in two pieces and threw it in the trash.

[Jim Garber]

My friend had Tony do a peghead inlay for a mandolin that Bill Bussman built for him. he sent Tony a detailed drawing and the first attempt came back not to my friend's liking. Tony then sent him a much-improved inlay which my friend was pleased with. I think that Tony absorbed the extra cost for the redo + shipping.

I have a feeling that quality in the Far East means different things to differrent people. Not sure what happens to his QA but he obviously need to work on it or be educated.

Jim

[Potosimando]

I know I said I wasn’t going to say anything further re. Antonio, but wsm’s comment brought back a few memories that bear repeating, at least for humor’s sake.

wsm broke his inlay piece in two and he threw it away. My inlaid pickguard broke completely in two on its own. The pickguard inlay included this really ugly obese/pregnant mermaid of some kind, as I recall (my girlfriend, who never swears, said "My God" when she first saw it). Then, I kid you not, the two pickguard halves had been sitting on top of my upright piano and one day simply fell/jumped off the back side (trying to commit suicide, I guess)—I have not seen the pickguard(s) since, as it’s not worth the effort to move the piano.

The now-severely-twisted fretboard came with a very large crack, which I did not notice at first because the crack was filled with the thick ebony-colored boot polish (or whatever) that Tony had applied to the entire fretboard. This original crack extended completely through the fretboard. Today the fretboard has three more large cracks that extend completely through, and it looks like the fretboard also might break apart on its own and go the way of the pregnant mermaid. Most of the boot polish has sublimated away now, and the previous black fretboard is becoming quite light colored as time goes on. Seeing how the fretboard was advertised as ebony, it is obvious to me that Antonio has secured a supply of “white ebony”, which must have great value because of its rarity (well…except for that darned propensity to self destruct).

[wsm]

I had heard that Antonio was using inferior Ebony and that is why I sent him a really nice slab. #

The artwork I sent was drawn up by my brother in-law and was of a long haired lady sitting on a crescent moon sprinkling stars out of a bag. #Based on some of his inlay I had seen on e-bay I thought he could knock this off with no problems.

I really should have taken a picture of the inlay because it was hilarious...

[Jim Garber]

Boy, AT's ears must be burning even over all this distance...

I hope that he does hear some of this... or maybe he just doesn't get it and never will...

Jim

[neal]

Well, I'll tell you, about a year ago he started with these interesting a mandolins with a double side, and I was intrigued. Never bought one, but asked some questions here. Dale is the first one on the board that bought one and gave his opinion, aside from another one that simply gushes over the F-style that she/he bought, and who's posts I've not seen since. I thinks I'll pass.

[Jim Garber]

Now these mandolins are starting to show up second hand on eBay (http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=10179&item=3749749264).

Jim

[jim simpson]

Wow,
The inlay work on the Ebay model looks pretty nice. It's hard to believe after reading the accounts of his poor work quality. I wonder if the fact that they are showing up on Ebay means that the purchaser didn't get quite what they expected.
It is interesting how he incorporats the A-tuners on the headstock that suggests the F-style.

[mandoJeremy]

God help! Those frets just don't look quite straight to me!

[Tom C]

The nech is barley tapered, if it is at all.. but the inlay work on the one we see for sale do look pretty nice. -Then again it's a pic.

[Jim Garber]

God help! #Those frets just don't look quite straight to me!
Benefit of the doubt... it could be an optical trick caused by the inlays... or not http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

Jim

[oldwave maker]

Ray's raised fretboard F4 had spectacular peghead inlay by Ron Chacey, havent seen what Tony did to the C#, heres the pickguard Tony did for the F3, looks fine to this hillsboro hick, but dont know if Id have a new mexistan hillbilly make a shamisen for the tokyo classical market unless he already had a collection of them to refer back to.....

[Davetnova]

Well I just took delivery. The quality is about what I was expecting after the comments here.
Review - the mandolin as a whole has been well put together although the finishing is poor. Very much that's good enough rather than is that good enough, so it looks Ok until you start looking close. The inlay work is beautiful. The headstock ebony is not best quality. The machine heads are cr*p. They stay in tune but don't feel nice and a fair bit of play. The bridge is compensated quite strangely.
Now having said that, it sounds really really nice and it has an nice easy action.
As has been said somewhere you get what you pay for and for what I paid I'm happy. Most cheap mandolins I've seen are a kind of reverse of this with poor materials and a thick finish to cover the flaws and many not quite so cheap ones have finish flaws every bit as bad.
So I've got a sweet sounding and playing mando ( but no bluegrasser) that doesn't want too close an inspection but is perfect for parties and festivals and camping ( once new tuners go on). As Dale said not quite a POS. All in all I'm happy with it for the money but I wouldn't recommend buying one without seeing/playing it (I thinnk there will be a lot of variation) and if you do remember what your paying and don't expect a Loar.

[Jim Garber]

Ray (the owner of the F3 that Bill is building and that tony did the pickguard for) asked me to post for him. He says his experience is that Tony want sot please but that if you want to commission inlay work from him, you need to stress that you want top quality workmanship (might cost you a little more) and to ne quite specific in what you want, ie, provide very accurate drawing etc. Ray's experience is with the inlay only,,, as far as the instruments... you are on your own.

Sounds from Davetnova, tho, that it is not all that bad as some folks would have you think. Perhaps there is a diplomatic way for us to constructively criticize Tony's work and therefore help him imporve the quality. If he is willing to put a bunch of time into these instruments and they are basically decent for the price, perhaps they can improve with feedback from us as mandolin players.

What i can't figure out is that he is not living in an instrument vacuum -- I would think there are decent instruments to copy over there in Taiwan. Maybe he is trying out his own ideas to the exclusion of what went before

I guess he has a few other folks working for him. According to his some of his eBay listings, he mentioned that someone in his shop made this mandolin.

Jim

"If he is willing to put a bunch of time into these instruments and they are basically decent for the price, perhaps they can improve with feedback from us as mandolin players."

Why?.........I wouldn't swap a used Breedlove Quartz OF for 3 of these damn things if I had to play it. #I found the violin shape interesting & for $300 I guess I got what I paid for (not much!). Let's support the folks here at home as I've yet to buy a Pacific rim mando that holds a candle to what we can already buy here for very little more.

Don't throw the Eastmans, MK's & other stuff into this either.....I'd still rather have a Quartz........ IMHO http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

[Jim Garber]

Why?
A good question... I actually don't own a single pacrim mandolin but I find that the concept of an inexpensive instrument that plays well enticing. So I do agree with you that there is Breedlove and Mid Mo in this country.

On the other hand, I believe that Tony has a small shop that is capable to doing some fine work. Evidentally from the few folks who have dealt with him, he is trying to make a living and trying to ply his art. There is a human face on this maker, unlike Eastman or Epiphone or Washburn, etc. Besides what if there were a small pacrim maker who could make an instrument that was as good as a north American one. He/she may be out there somewhere.

Hey... isn't Gilchrist a pac rim maker? http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

Jim

"Hey... isn't Gilchrist a pac rim maker?"

Yeah.......& I might swap a Quartz for one of those. http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif