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View Full Version : Is a satin finish more susceptible to pinky rub?



FrDNicholas
Nov-29-2009, 5:11pm
I noticed on my Collings MT with a satin finish that almost within a short time of playing it, the spot where I rest my pinky of my right hand (yes, I know I'm not supposed to do that) looked shiny. Is a satin finish, which I have on the MT, more susceptible than other finishes?

mandroid
Nov-29-2009, 5:46pm
yea it will shine up , Matte in the usual sense means it just didn't get the buffer run over it in final production, .. no biggie..

Chris Biorkman
Nov-29-2009, 7:09pm
Yes. That's what bugs me about matte finishes. I think it looks terrible.

Douglas McMullin
Nov-29-2009, 7:12pm
I ended up buffing out my MT to gloss. It didn't take very long and it looks great.

Steve Ostrander
Nov-29-2009, 7:42pm
I buffed out my MT as well. I like it much better this way.

FrDNicholas
Nov-29-2009, 8:15pm
What did you use to buff it out? Is this a process the mechanically disabled can do without disastrous results?

fishtownmike
Nov-29-2009, 10:02pm
Some think satin finish is a regular finish that hasn't been buffed out and sometimes deglossed with something like finesse pads or steel wool. Thats not always true. A true satin finish has some chemicals added to it which makes it dry with less sheen. Many times an instrument with a satin finish( in many case a lower priced instrument) can also have less coats then its gloss counterpart. So be warned of the possibility of buffing through the finish. Be careful when buffing. Might be better to do it by hand then with a power buffer...Mike

resophil
Nov-29-2009, 10:11pm
I hate to be picky, but you're not getting a gloss finish when you rub a satin lacquer finish, you're getting a semi-shiny satin finish. And there's more difference than buffing or polishing with an abrasive (no matter fine...) between a satin and a gloss finish!

All lacquer starts out in life as "gloss", that is, it has the requisite reflective qualities that the paint chemist formulated when he sat down to make the stuff. However, satin or matte finishes have a "flatting agent" added to them that diffuses the light as it reflects from the finished surface of the laquer coat. Finely ground mineral bases, such as silica, are used for this purpose. They are the same sort of thing that is used in the cosmetic industry to make face powders and makeup. (No woman wants a shiny nose...)

After the flatting agent is mixed into the lacquer, there is nothing that can be done to change the reflective quality of the lacquer coat. It'd be like trying to get the eggs back out of a cake after it's been baked.... You can polish from now till the cows come home, and the surface of the lacquer will get smoother and shinier, but it won't get glossy! The measure of gloss is if you can see your true reflection in the finish, details and all, not just light and dark or shadow!

Collings makes the MT model with a gloss top. Why not look for one of those instead of messing with what you've got. I always get nervous when amateurs talk about going after a finished surface with abrasives... Will your next question be, "How do I fix a spot that's been rubbed through?"

Pete Counter
Nov-29-2009, 10:26pm
Im seeing a lot of scientific, high knowledge posts about how why you cant get gloss finish from satin finish. But none of them change the fact that when you play a satin finish instrument for awhile the part that you come into contact with.......get shiney! The back of the neck, the forearm area, where your pinky touches the top, get shiney! If you rub out the whole mandolin....it gets shiny, its a fact. I have a satin finish instrument and I have those shiny spots, wich I am ok with, but some people would rather have all shiny or all satin.

resophil
Nov-29-2009, 10:45pm
Do what I said....

Look into the shiny part of your mandolin and see if you can see your reflection... In detail!

There's a difference between shiny and glossy! The gloss of a surface is measured by angles of incidence and reflection of light. If you can see your reflection in it, it's glossy. If you can only see that it reflects light and shadow differently, it's shiny, not glossy!

Yes, those areas will get shiny because the rough surface of the sprayed lacquer coat will be smoothed by the abrasion of your fingers, shirt, etc. That's why manufacturers use satin finishes in the first place; they don't spend any time having to polish them to a high gloss as they would if they had sprayed gloss lacquer, which equals savings in labour costs. But polishing a satin finish will not increase the amount of light that is reflected back to your eye.

Don't try to confuse shiny and glossy! They are two different things! Next time you're around a grand piano, look straight into the finish. Assuming it's a high-gloss finish, you'll see your reflection. You'll be able to see your lips moving, or on which side you part your hair. Then stare into your satin-finished mandolin. You'll go blind before you can see those things in a shiny satin finsh, no matter how much it's been rubbed or polished!

Ronnie L
Nov-30-2009, 2:38am
Yep! but Its an instrument not an ornament . Play it, scuff it, ding it, Love it!

extramusical.com
Nov-30-2009, 3:36pm
A satin finish will wear the wood while a gloss finished instrument wears the top coat first.

FrDNicholas
Nov-30-2009, 9:45pm
Well this discussion has convinced me: I will leave well enough alone rather than risk damaging the finish. I am also finding the more I play the instrument, the happier I am becoming with the color. At first, I was disappointed in the color. It wasn't as "reddish" a sunburst as I had seen in lots of the MT pictures. It was more brownish. But I was just noticing the other day that I am beginning to like the color more and more. And the sound is getting richer and richer!

Ivan Kelsall
Dec-01-2009, 12:08am
Part of the 'shiny' patch where your finger touches is oil / moisture from your body. Unless you put some form of barrier between your finger tip & the top of your Mandolin,there's nothing you can do about it.Touch a window pane or any piece of glass with your finger tip & see the fingerprint left there. I think that matte finished instruments do look very nice,but the finish won't take the abuse that a gloss finish will for too long without blemishes showing up & even fingermarks don't come off too easily without possible (slight) damage to the finish,
Ivan;)

FrDNicholas
Dec-01-2009, 9:08am
Would this be an issue with varnished finishes? I think they look the most beautiful of all the finishes I've seen.

Sergio Saldivar
Dec-01-2009, 9:31am
Isnīt this what pickguards and armrests are precisely intended to prevent? :)

Sergio

Timbofood
Dec-01-2009, 3:31pm
Thank you Sergio! My thought exactly.

Ivan Kelsall
Dec-02-2009, 1:20am
Daniel - My Lebeda has a varnished finish,a very thin one,but i only have to breathe on it to get any 'wrist marks' off it. It's far easier to clean than the laquer finish on my Weber by a mile.
I don't know if this is true of all builder's varnish finishes,but mine's a breeze to clean,
Ivan

8ch(pl)
Dec-02-2009, 1:54pm
My Mid Missouri got Grubby, it was impossible to clean. I sanded it down and applied a coat of Semi Gloss, from a spray can made by Watco. I put a Cumberland Acoustic Armrest on.