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View Full Version : Who would buy a loar if they had the money



Rick Schmidlin
Aug-01-2008, 12:32am
Me I would keep my MF5 and buy a little cabin in the country. http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/sleepy.gif

Chris Biorkman
Aug-01-2008, 12:35am
I wouldn't. I'd get a Gil or Nugget and spend the rest on candy.

birdman98
Aug-01-2008, 12:47am
Quarter of a mill. on a mandolin???

Nah...not for me. Don't know WHAT I'd buy, but it'd be something else.

Tom Gibson
Aug-01-2008, 12:58am
Assuming I had limitless amounts of money, and could buy one without even noticing the dent in my bank account, I hope I still wouldn't.

John Hill
Aug-01-2008, 1:00am
Never. If I had that much I might splurge on a fancy Monte Grande Artist and pay off the house.

Dave Hanson
Aug-01-2008, 1:11am
Nah, a Jaguar or a Porshe maybe.

Dave H

mandolirius
Aug-01-2008, 1:19am
Not a chance. My mind boggles at $25,000 for a mandolin.

Jordan Ramsey
Aug-01-2008, 1:46am
I've only played one that I could say was worth it...Reischman's. It was exquisite in every way. This is contingent on me having an endless bankroll of course, but I would definitely consider anything to acquire a mandolin of that caliber.


Jordan Ramsey
myspace.com/crosspicker (http://www.myspace.com/crosspicker)

--------
'07 Gibson Sam Bush

man dough nollij
Aug-01-2008, 1:54am
If I won $25million after taxes, I still wouldn't buy a Loar. I would probably think about a $25K Gilchrist. I'd move somewhere nice where I could take lessons, and buy an airplane. I'd learn to fly and play, and probably get a PhD in Philosophy. I'll leave the Loars to collectors.

In my ear, the Loar tone isn't worth a quarter million dollars. Besides, it would be a crime to have such a rank noob wasting such a nice instrument.

I might buy one as investment, with an eye toward selling it to a Grisman, Thile, or Marshall type. No sense having it in my safe-- it needs to be with someone who can increase the mojo. Yep.

http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/mandosmiley.gif

Joel Spaulding
Aug-01-2008, 1:54am
$200K To spend on my hobbies (granted it's a passion), hmmm..... #http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif

Probably not... and I can be about as frivolous as one could be.

Pretending I had that much cash right now - NO. Probably buy 6-10 Mando-family instruments in the $6-12K range. Possibilities might include Smart Mandola, 1924 Snakehead, Mix A w/ f-holes, Mix F-4, Gilchrist A, Brentrup A4c(God,that is GORGEOUS), #Gibby Mandocello, Old Wave OM,any variety of other Old Waves, Mann double cut electric.

I would throw a bunch of cash to Geoff at iii Mandolins and tell him to indulge both of us on a couple ultra-custom instruments,(Geoff, I'll call you when that 200 large is in pocket!) etc. Whatever remained would outfit a studio with various gadgets, amps & other instruments.
All of the above would assume I had another $200K to indulge my better half and daughter (and any future progeny).

Suspect when I have that much to play with the Loars will be 300-400 K so it won't be much of an issue. http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

Ivan Kelsall
Aug-01-2008, 2:13am
If it was John Reischman's Loar & i had unlimited amounts of cash,YEP !!!. Other than that,i'd possibly order a Mandolin from each of the top 6 builders & just enjoy the differences in each - i'd definitely order a 'Blue' Mandolin from Dale Ludewig & a 'Stealth' from Hans & a Heiden & a ....................,
Saska

John Flynn
Aug-01-2008, 4:25am
No. I'm sure Loars are really great, but because they are a collector's item, the price is way out of kilter with the value for me. I'd be thinking more along the lines of a Nugget A, a Gilchrist Model One and a few others, plus some really high-end lessons and the biggest indulgence: the TIME to play as much as I wanted.

LateBloomer
Aug-01-2008, 4:57am
I would! I had the great pleasure of hearing a friends Loar in my living room. The tone was so incredible it still haunts me (in a good way) three years later.

Rick Cadger
Aug-01-2008, 5:32am
Nope.

Rob Powell
Aug-01-2008, 5:35am
That depends on what "if you had the money" means http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif If it means I have a $225K windfall (enough to buy this one at Greg Boyd's (http://gregboyd.com/instrument_detail.html?instrument_key=513) I would have to say no. I would however consider having Bruce Weber build me a Distressed Custom Elite http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

If it means I'm sittin' on $25M I probably wouldn't hesitate and I'd still have Bruce Weber build me Distressed Custom Elite. http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

I'd also have Lynn Dudenbostel build me a D-28!

sunburst
Aug-01-2008, 6:35am
I take "if I had the money" to mean I've already got everything I need and enough of what I want to be able to spare the price of a Loar. In that case, I'd buy one.
As a builder of F5 style mandolins, the Loar is the basis of what I do when I build a mandolin. I'm not building Loar clones, or even following the Loar model particularly closely, but the original F5 is still the foundation of the modern carved mandolin in a way similar to the music of Bill Monroe being the foundation of modern Bluegrass music. Understanding how the Loars were made is important for understanding how to follow the design successfully as well as how to depart from the design successfully. I have drawings of Loars, photos of Loars, I've studied quite a few of them up close, but having one around as a reference would sure be nice.
Furthermore, it sure would be fun to have one!

mando_dan
Aug-01-2008, 6:42am
No, the Loars are great, but not worth what they go for in my opinion. #Seems as though most people want one ultimately b/c Monroe had one or for collectability. #I could never play up to the level of a Loar and would feel bad about keeping it out of the hands of someone who could really make it sound as should, and the idea of mothballing it while watching its value increase is abhorrent. #Bottom line, they're plenty of great mandos out there and only a few hundred of them are Loars.

Brandon Flynn
Aug-01-2008, 6:56am
Not me, I would get a few killer mandos (Gilch, Nugget, Dude, some smaller builders) and a lot of other mando family instruments that I hope to acquire someday:
Tenor Guitar, resonator Tenor, Tenor Banjo, Mandocello, Mandola, Bouzouki, electric Mandolin, etc.

Timbofood
Aug-01-2008, 7:33am
I suppose if, as so many have said, the financial picture was so bright for me that was wearing shades and had NO other concerns, maybe. #I think I would be far more likely to chat up some of the builders on a "face to face mandolin tour" and place a few orders with the 3-4 that I had the most fun with. #I'd start in Maine since my wife has never been there, then....

Steve L
Aug-01-2008, 7:59am
I was just looking at the Mandolin Brothers website and they've got a '59 Fender Stratocaster up for $42,500. When I was in junior high school (admittedly a looooong time ago) that was about a $300 used guitar. A great guitar...absolutely. 140 times better than they were in 69-70 or that much better than a contemporary guitar? Not to me. Nothing against those who can and would pay for that, but there are so many good instruments out there a relatively good prices I couldn't buy a Loar. I'd find myself a Sobell and use the left over cash to start a folk music venue. Now that's a great way to blow thousands and thousands of dollars.

JEStanek
Aug-01-2008, 8:08am
Like some others, if I had the money, and I had already what I felt were more important things with it (secured my kids education, set up foundations to provide for other kids educations, and otherwise spread the $$ around, supported many of my still living favorite builders) sure. #I wouldn't mind being the custodian of a Loar.

But this scenario is as likely to happen as whirled peas, a cure for the common cold, and me writing the great American novel #http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif .

Jamie

tree
Aug-01-2008, 8:13am
I'd buy one, play it to my heart's content so I'd know what it was all about, and then see if I could trade it to John for his personal Hamlett. That way it would do more good for the mando world, and I'd have a mandolin with a scroll I like better.

kudzugypsy
Aug-01-2008, 8:30am
there are PLENTY of people on the cafe with the money to buy a loar, believe it or not - i mean, i have the money to buy a loar (barely, but it could be done), but its not really worth that to me to part with that much money for a mandolin, regardless of *market value* (which is a whole different value than what the item may be *worth*) - really, i hope i NEVER get to the point where i think i *need* a $200k+ mandolin. if i had to do it all over again, i would still be playing the Kentucky KM-1500 i started out on instead of chasing MAS all the way up the food chain. i've come to realize after 20 some years of playing and being around really good mandolins that its STILL in the player and ALWAYS will be.
now, back when i started playing mandolin, you could buy a nice Loar for $25k - that was different -(i think they are overvalued today by $100k personally - with $125K being a fair market price) - today's market prices are just speculation imo - ie - people pay $200k with the mindset they can sell it in 10 years for $350k+ - its as simple as that #- have your Loar and make a $100k - not a bad deal IF thats how it plays out.

this may rub some Loar owners the wrong way, and just mine (and many others opinion) but i think Gilchrist is building mandolins today that can equally stand on the level of most Loars - they only need that seasoning and playing in for 10-20 years.

Celtic Saguaro
Aug-01-2008, 8:30am
I wouldn't. #Each of them deserves a home with someone who can play much better than I ever will be able to. http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

red7flag
Aug-01-2008, 8:34am
Personally, if I had money to burn, I would not buy a Loar. They are too few and too precious and me and my dogs are too tough on instruments. The Loar could not be replaced. I think I might get Don MacRostie to make make me a crusher "Replica" or maybe a MM and allow me and my dogs to distress it, which is sure to happen, the distress that is.
Tony

Denny Gies
Aug-01-2008, 8:40am
Me neither; I'd keep my Randy Wood and get a Ferrari.

F5GRun
Aug-01-2008, 8:43am
In theory I probably would...but only as investment. So probably not. #Cabin in the woods, New Jeep, Collings MF5V Deluxe, Prewar Martin D-28, and that should do it. Wait, maybe a dude or nugget, or Gil, or Brentrup...or...or...or. Who am I kidding I cant decide. oh yea, and a snakehead

The real question is. #If you found a Loar in your Attic would you keep it??

pager
Aug-01-2008, 9:10am
I have never bought into the idea that 'old' is better. Besides, spending that much on a mandolin is insane.

Capt. E
Aug-01-2008, 9:13am
Naw, it would be like giving a Stradivarius to a kid learning to play violin. That kind of money could go many other places: like a second home in the mountains of Mexico.

mandopete
Aug-01-2008, 9:14am
I'd buy Yahoo.com instead. #What, it's not for sale? #Hmmmm.

JeffD
Aug-01-2008, 9:40am
Ahhh but you are all thinking about for personal use.

If I had about twice that amount of discretionary money, I would buy the Loar, and spend the balance on what ever insurance and security and maintenance issues I need. Then I would make the Loar available to the great players. I would rent it out, as it were. Carefully of course, but I am sure there are players all over that would love to record with a Loar, but can't justify owning one.

That way I would get to meet lots of great players, and keep the Loar in the hands of those who appreciate it.

Seriously, this seems like the best solution.

I could never justify that kind of money on a personal use mandolin, but something to keep in circulation, it might make sense.

Jkf_Alone
Aug-01-2008, 9:56am
nah, I'd pay off the house, buy a nice f4 style and a nice zook. After that, i guess I'd go back to school and take weekly mandolin lessons. to be honest, i can't see how a loar can be 200k more better than anything else. http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

Jkf_Alone
Aug-01-2008, 10:01am
now, if i could buy talent, i would do that in a heartbeat. who wouldnt want to buy the talent of Grisman, or Thile?

lovethemf5s
Aug-01-2008, 10:03am
The best mandolins being made today are under 15M. I'd buy one of those and spend the rest on anything else.

jasona
Aug-01-2008, 10:08am
No.

Brady Smith
Aug-01-2008, 10:13am
Nah....only me and other mandolin players would even know what it is. If playing for an audience etc....they would be clueless and could care less if it's a Loar or anything else.

Jack Roberts
Aug-01-2008, 10:47am
My grandmother used to say: "never acquire things, because you don't own them, they own you." She was the original old-lady hippy chick.

Rocky Top
Aug-01-2008, 11:33am
Definitely, no question about it.

Greenmando
Aug-01-2008, 11:51am
I would if my playing was better, hard to make the ones I have sound good.

Bill Van Liere
Aug-01-2008, 11:51am
If I had the money to buy a Loar I would just buy a mandolin signed by Charlie Derrington and play Bluegrass til all the money was gone.

UnityGain
Aug-01-2008, 12:42pm
Sure I'd buy it! Spend the mere $200K.

I could admire it, and play it and feel like I was king of the world, though I would still not be any good. Keep it in a nice climate controlled glass case. Sniff the f holes, ponder how each and every scratch and ding got there.

And then in a few years sell it for $300K

Seiously, does anyone thing the price on these is going anyware but up?

Even more seriously, I probably wouldn't buy it.

Paul Kotapish
Aug-01-2008, 1:26pm
I have somehow managed to avoid being tempted by the cult of the Loar.

I have no interest in a Loar as a player's instrument, and I don't really want the hassle of owning, insuring, and protecting one as an investment, so I'd pass, too. It might be a great way to park one's money, but I dislike the fact that so much of the instrument market is driven by collectors and speculators, and I wouldn't want to contribute to that.

Some of the best mandolins I've ever heard or played were Loars, and there is no question that some of them are among the finest-sounding, most powerful instruments made to date.

But I've also played and heard quite a few that were less exceptional and offered no improvement--to my ears or in my hands--over any number of fine contemporary mandolins by current makers, and I'm much more interested in instruments being made right now than I am in Loar lore.

If I stumbled on that much money, I'd work with a financial planner to scheme for an earlier retirement so that I had more time to play the mandolins I have.

uncle ken
Aug-01-2008, 1:30pm
I'm depressed about the one's I passed on, starting back when they were under 10k. I got a call on one for 17k around 1990 and passed on that one too. I should have just maxed out a credit card for that one. I guess the lesson is, if you see an opportunity don't sit on your ###.

Jim Garber
Aug-01-2008, 1:32pm
As some wise man (or woman) said many years ago, we never really own these things, we really only rent them. if all was said and done tho and i had the bucks to spare I would buy one 1) for the joy of having it in my lowly presence and 2) to (likely) ensure myself and my heirs for times to come. Unless the world of mandolins changes much, I doubt these will go down in price. Like fine old violins, they can't make them any more.

As far as the ultimate playing instrument tho, I concur with those who say Gilchrist, Dude, Monteleone, etc. for much less money. In the bowlback world, a fine Embergher 5bis, for sure.

Mattg
Aug-01-2008, 2:20pm
I would spend the $200k going to music festivals for as long as the money lasted. A loar would be wasted on me. I played a great old Flatiron A last night at a jam. Now that has my attention. I could feel the sound from the top F hole on my arm as I chopped chords.

goose 2
Aug-01-2008, 3:31pm
I have thought long a hard about it several times over the past few years but have not yet pulled the trigger. I really love my current mandolin ('04 DMM) and I think that as an investment it is not a very good one short term. Long term may be a different story. I am probably wrong because I nearly pulled the trigger when they were 40k and that was not too long ago. They are definitely the best mandolin there is my mind.

evanreilly
Aug-01-2008, 3:42pm
"Having the Money" is a relative thing.
The first Lloyd Loar F-5 I saw for sale was in Locker's window in New York. $800.00. #Waaay back. I didn't have the money then.
Next I had a chance at one for $1,900.00. Didn't have the money then.
Then tried to borrow $2,500.00 for one. No one was going to lend it to me.
When I did finally decided to borrow the $$$ to buy one, in this lifetime. It took me maybe three years to pay off the loan.
Was it the best mandolin I have ever played or owned? Very possibly yes. And, since I am sure all are interested, I have a Dude now, so I don't have to play the Loar. #Just the opposite of Chris Thile, who got the Loar so he didn't have to play the Dude. I think???? #Maybe??? #Or did he succumb to the Lure of the Loar, like Ronnie??? #Both of them had the other 'top shelf' mandolin brands, but what did they really, really want?? #Neither of them found their Lloyd Loar mandolins under a bed somewhere, either.

Rick Schmidlin
Aug-01-2008, 3:49pm
I've only played one that I could say was worth it...Reischman's. It was exquisite in every way. This is contingent on me having an endless bankroll of course, but I would definitely consider anything to acquire a mandolin of that caliber.


Jordan Ramsey
myspace.com/crosspicker (http://www.myspace.com/crosspicker)

--------
'07 Gibson Sam Bush
I have played John's and he has played my MF5, I have also recorded this. John really like my MF5 and I loved the Loar.But I have to say the MF5 became a keeper after that lesson http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

Hallmark498
Aug-01-2008, 4:08pm
Id buy two if I could. Play the heck out of em and in a few years sell one for $500,000 and then the other a few years later for a million. Why should they not bring a mill?

Robert Moreau
Aug-01-2008, 4:14pm
If I had that kind of cash I'd get one of the builders here at the cafe to make me something REALLY REALLY nice...

And maybe spend the rest on 5-6000 mandolin lessons. http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

Rob

lovethemf5s
Aug-01-2008, 4:15pm
I played a Loar once and have heard them many times as an audience member. I think they sound very good but I still don't understand the mystique. http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/rock.gif

Perry Babasin
Aug-01-2008, 5:04pm
I am so glad you posted this musing. With so many excellent modern builders and wonderful instruments out there, priced way below these classic Gibsons (even $20,000), the price that an original Loar mandolin has risen to is almost obscene. So far beyond the average player it is nearly unimaginable. I honestly don't care if I had the money, I could not, with a clear conscience, spend that much on a mandolin.

Apparently back in the late 60's DG bought his first Loar for $550 (Fretboard Journal). There has certainly been general inflation since then but gas was maybe $.30 or $.40 a gallon and is now topping $4; but $550 to over $200,000 is a little absurd.

I wonder how much this is artificially ramped up by the participation of collectors that don't even play. You know, the guys that invest like buying artwork and locking it in a vault. Some not even appreciating the aesthetics of anything, but just investing basically to make or protect money.

I mean, I'd be afraid to even play it! I wonder how Chris Thile is going to feel when he snaps the scroll off his. AAaaaaarrrgggghhhh! I heard he was pretty tore up over the Dude breakage.

Thanks........ Perry

allenhopkins
Aug-01-2008, 7:49pm
I would buy a Loar if I had a large amount of disposable cash. #It's the Holy Grail of mandolins, and it would be great to get some idea of what all the fuss is about.

Interestingly, I could probably raise enough money to buy one, if I sold some stock, cleaned out a few dozen higher-end instruments and realized the cash from them, cashed in a couple of CD's, maybe worried less about the rest of my retirement and what I'm passing along to my sons. #(I mean, the younger one's a software engineer at Google and could buy and sell me several times over -- not that I'm envious!) #I don't feel the motivation to go questing for that Holy Grail, I guess, not to the extent of sacrificing in another area.

But I have no ethical qualms about paying market price for what has become a very scarce, in-demand instrument. #After all, Loars are only worth what someone's willing to pay for them. #The fact that you used to #be able to pick them up for a few hundred bucks is irrelevant. #Sunburst Les Pauls were reasonable in the late '50's, Van Gogh couldn't market his paintings during his lifetime, Stradivarius probably sold his fiddles for about what his competitors charged. #So what? #Today's market is today's market.

But, were something to occur that led me to think a quarter million or a bit less was no object, sure, why not? #Buy a Loar. #Makes me think: what if Alex Rodriguez decided to take up mandolin? #What's he getting paid over his contract with the Rangers and now the Yankees -- a quarter billion? #Or how about the guy Tsumura in Japan who accumulated over a thousand banjos? #Not all these decisions -- maybe none of them -- are made on purely rational grounds, it seems.

Ken Berner
Aug-01-2008, 9:14pm
I'd probably go for one of those ultra-rare 1996 Gibson F5-X mandolins that Bruce Weber built in Montana. I don't think more than just a few were built and I only heard of one A5-X.

morristownmando
Aug-01-2008, 10:38pm
I would have to play a ghilchrist f a dudenbostel f and all the other out of my price range mandos and if the loar totally kicked all their A#@E'S i would.

tango_grass
Aug-01-2008, 10:55pm
Sure! What the he http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/mad.gif # #http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

Patrick Sylvest
Aug-01-2008, 11:03pm
Nah. Let people who can appreciate them and make good use of them have 'em. I could do with a prewar Martin, maybe a nice 0018 or somethin' like that.

Ken Olmstead
Aug-01-2008, 11:03pm
Well...a week ago I would have conclusively said no. But recently I was given a 1930 Vega Vox III Plectrum banjo (pretty much the "Loar" if you are a plectrum player) which was in a bad state of repair. Well, this last week I got it up and running and I am pretty smittin' with it! I had planned to sell it. I have a Plectrum that I like real well already and frankly, I am not a generally a big fan of old instruments. The instruments made today sound quite good and generally the sound of the old ones do NOTHING for me. Now this is a $5k item not $.25 million but if I would not miss the cash, I can no longer say that I would not buy one! Now how am I going to fund that family vacation in February! http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

Ivan Kelsall
Aug-02-2008, 4:00am
I just had a listen to the sound clips of the Loar at Greg' Boyd's store & i think that it sounds awesome !. Working on the principal that you only get one chance at this life,if i had the cash i'd be speeding towards Greg's shop right now in my private plane to be picked up at the airport by my chauffer & whisked away to drop the cash on Greg's lap.I say this totally unashamedly AND i wouldn't hestiate to take it 'out to play'.
Very few of us can afford such wonderful instruments & to those who can & genuinely appreciate them for what they are & can use then well - ENJOY !!!. It's no use sitting back late in the day saying " i wish i'd done this or that or the other" - go for it,DO IT. If i hadn't bought my wonderful Weber Fern 18 months back,i'd probably be doing exactly that saying " i wish.............. etc.". I was fortunate to be able to afford it & i've never had so much pleasure from an instrument in my life. Saska

Tim
Aug-02-2008, 5:10am
Since had the money means different things to different people...

If I "had the money" to buy one without giving up anything else I value more I would buy it.

If I "had the moeny" but would have to give up anything on the long list of things more important to me than a better mandolin I wouldn't even consider it.

bryankimsey
Aug-02-2008, 9:05am
Since had the money means different things to different people...
Agree there. If I could afford it w/out sacrificing more important things, sure, I'd have one! But since that's about as likely as pigs flying, the realistic answer is "no". My mind boggles at $20,000 mandolins. I mean, I have worked on some of those $20k mandolins and A/B'ed them to my Krishot F5 and no one in the house thought they were worth $17,000 more. Actually, no one here thought they were worth even $3,000 more.

As for Loars, I've played 7-8 of them, a couple of them for hours. They're a lot of fun, but it's more from a historical than a sonic viewpoint for me.

Well, gotta go....

http://www.polov8.co.uk/images/flying_pig.jpg

Bernie Daniel
Aug-02-2008, 11:03am
With all due respect probably not. #

I don't like to doing the conventional usually and I do not like to pay for "image or mystique" that is not "realy real".

Yes, the Gibson Loar is the icon of the American mandolin world. But it was made by human beings and today many outstanding mandolins are being made by other human beings. #

Its great that Bill Monroe played a Loar, and I respect him, his memory (and that of Lloyd Loar and Orville Gibson as well). #But I really don't much care what Monroe played or anyone else for that matter. #No disrespect I just don't care -- I just like his music and it would have sounded nearly the same on his old F7.

The "average" Gibson Loar might be better than say the "average" Gibson DMM -- but by no possible measure can it be 10 - 12 times better. #That is absolutely impossibe to believe. #

So buying a Loar your money (no matter how much $$$ you have at you disposal) about 80 - 90% would be exhausted on image not tone. #I don't want to pay for that.

I would be more inclined to find the best DMM out there and buy that. #http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

Jim Hilburn
Aug-02-2008, 11:16am
I think I've started writing and then deleted about 5 times on this subject, but what I want to get across is just how important the creation of the Loar mandolin was and it's something that is often taken for granted. I guess most realize this but it has changed how a mandolin could be used in music profoundly.
I don't think there would be any chance that so many talented custom builders would have sprung up to make F-4 copies. I also think acoustic music would be totally different. There probably wouldn't even be a Mandolin Cafe.
I guess you could say the same about Martin dreads, Mastertone banjo's or Les Paul's but we only care about mandolin's here.

sunburst
Aug-02-2008, 11:29am
Yeah, what Jim said!
A Loar is a piece of history the significance of which is difficult to imagine. No, they're not 10 times better than the best hand built mandolins of today, but they've stood the test of time, so far, as a successful design, and regardless of their idiosyncrasies and imperfections, the good ones are capable of standing at least toe to toe with the best of modern mandolins when it comes to producing music. Their history and their rarity make their market value arguable much higher than their intrinsic value as an instrument, but are they overpriced as a piece of American musical history?

Alex of the North
Aug-02-2008, 12:51pm
I know that each person will have his or her own take on this, but the question that interests me is whether it's ethical/moral to spend that much on a mandolin when that much money could provide health insurance for a family for 10-30 years, provide life-improving infrastructure to a village in Mali, pay for college for 5-10 kids, etc. It's probably obvious what I think, but what do you think? My own thought is that the ethical line is situated at an unfixed point where expense outstrips value. Personally, being an amateur and not a great player by any standard, I couldn't really find value in having a mandolin worth much more or much better than what I have. So, no, I would not buy a Loar. If I had $200,000 to spare I'd find ways to make my family more secure by saving or investing in my business, and also to give to others in a meaningful way.

Jim
Aug-02-2008, 1:19pm
I want other things more. It's not that I wouldn't love to have one but it's way down my list. There are even Mandolins that are higher up on the list. If I had an extra 200k + or - I would have paid My mortgage and helped my kids with education and then somewhere there's a Bluewatere cruising sailboat with my name on it and maybe a NewMad A or F style to take with me on my voyage.

Bernie Daniel
Aug-02-2008, 3:22pm
Alex of the North: I know that each person will have his or her own take on this, but the question that interests me is whether it's ethical/moral to spend that much on a mandolin when that much money could provide health insurance for a family for 10-30 years, provide life-improving infrastructure to a village in Mali, pay for college for 5-10 kids, etc. It's probably obvious what I think, but what do you think?

The original question was would you buy a Loar? #Not -- Is it ethical to buy a Loar? #

But since you asked....I think your sentiments are noble but in a free society people make their own decisions about their money based on their own values, experiences, and "personal code of ethics". #

These ARE personal and individual thus not subject to community approval. #Thus, I can speak only for myself on the matter.

I would not buy a Loar (money no object) because the thrill of owning a Loar would not begin to be worth it to me.

But if I did buy one I would not feel guilty in the least. #My house, my cars, and most things I own cost more than the average person in the USA -- but they were not given to me, I did not steal or cheat to get them, and I did not trash anyone along the way -- so no guilt. #

That does not mean I feel comfortable see those who are truly needy suffer for want. #But the world will not change if I decided to buy a Loar or decide not to.

woodwizard
Aug-02-2008, 3:34pm
I would without a doubt buy one and I would play the heck out of it too. It is only the holy grail of mandolins. This was a no brainer for me. http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

f5loar
Aug-02-2008, 4:06pm
I would buy every one that came up for sale and after eventually buying all 250 of them pick out the best 3 (one for each year) and sell the rest at profit and retire picking on the 3 best Loars in the world. $250,000 to someone with a lot of money is not a lot of money. When they are use to buying $3,000,000 homes and $1,000,000 yatchts with $500,000 cars what would $250,000 be for the best mandolin money could buy.

woodwizard
Aug-02-2008, 4:46pm
Hey f5loar .... That's what I'm talking about!!!!!!!

TomTyrrell
Aug-02-2008, 5:12pm
Mandolins really aren't that expensive. $200,000 violins are on the CHEAP end. No serious concert violinist would be happy for long with such a low-end instrument. For that money a mandolin player has his choice of almost every mandolin ever made.

For me "if I had the money" means it is just laying around and there isn't anything else I would rather do with that money. I am a rational consumer, if there was something else I really wanted then I wouldn't have the money - I would have that thing I really wanted. There are no ethics involved.

So, yes. If I had the money I would buy a Loar-signed Gibson mandolin. It would have to be one that originally had the Virzi and still has it. Lloyd Loar did not make mandolins for bluegrass music and I would want one that sounds the way Loar thought it should.

JeffD
Aug-02-2008, 5:13pm
but the question that interests me is whether it's ethical/moral to spend that much on a mandolin when that much money could provide health insurance for a family for 10-30 years, provide life-improving infrastructure to a village in Mali, pay for college for 5-10 kids, etc.
Had a similar discussion the other day - I think that it is not only ethical, but extremely moral.

I think it immoral for society to limit how the person can spend his or her legally acquired money - (excepting of course if the money is to be spent on illegal activities, hiring hitmen etc.)

But I think this side bar thread has great potential for getting way out of hand, and is outside the limits of the cafe rules, so I will say no more.

JeffD
Aug-02-2008, 5:17pm
but what I want to get across is just how important the creation of the Loar mandolin was and it's something that is often taken for granted. I guess most realize this but it has changed how a mandolin could be used in music profoundly.
Here here.

Its not just owning a mandolin, or even owning a great mandolin, its owning a piece of history.

Jim
Aug-02-2008, 5:30pm
Mandolins really aren't that expensive. $200,000 violins are on the CHEAP end. No serious concert violinist would be happy for long with such a low-end instrument.
There must be alot of unhappy violinists!

fishdawg40
Aug-02-2008, 5:32pm
I know that each person will have his or her own take on this, but the question that interests me is whether it's ethical/moral to spend that much on a mandolin when that much money could provide health insurance for a family for 10-30 years, provide life-improving infrastructure to a village in Mali, pay for college for 5-10 kids, etc. It's probably obvious what I think, but what do you think? My own thought is that the ethical line is situated at an unfixed point where expense outstrips value. Personally, being an amateur and not a great player by any standard, I couldn't really find value in having a mandolin worth much more or much better than what I have. So, no, I would not buy a Loar. If I had $200,000 to spare I'd find ways to make my family more secure by saving or investing in my business, and also to give to others in a meaningful way.
Wonderfully put, my sentiments indeed. Couldn't spend that much on a couple of pieces of wood unless I could live in it. Not to say that it is art but it is what it is. It's hard for me to fork over $2k for a mando. Other people thinks that's crazy too. I guess it's all relative.

phiddlepicker
Aug-02-2008, 5:41pm
If money were no object and my obligations to my family were met, heck I'd buy two.
I couldn't care less how somebody else perceives the morality of how I was spending my own money.

Jim Garber
Aug-02-2008, 5:49pm
I think I've started writing and then deleted about 5 times on this subject, but what I want to get across is just how important the creation of the Loar mandolin was and it's something that is often taken for granted. I guess most realize this but it has changed how a mandolin could be used in music profoundly.
I don't think there would be any chance that so many talented custom builders would have sprung up to make F-4 copies. I also think acoustic music would be totally different. There probably wouldn't even be a Mandolin Cafe.
I guess you could say the same about Martin dreads, Mastertone banjo's or Les Paul's but we only care about mandolin's here.
I agree up to a point, but coming from a non-bluegrass, even non American-centered perspective... yes the Loar F5 is an important development, but there are other mandolin worlds out there. Yes the mandolin world might have been different if there were only F4s but there was a mandolin world even before Orville Gibson. I think there might not have been a Mandolin Cafe that looks exactly like this one but there most likley would have been some site where mandolinists gather to discuss mandolin playing. Mandolins did exist way before Loar. In fact there was quite a craze in the 1880s both in the US and in Europe and Japan for the instrument.

Now... back to the program already in progress... sorry for the hijack...

phiddlepicker
Aug-02-2008, 6:04pm
yes indeed, the mandolin was an icon, but was supplanted by of all things the banjo orchestra...in this day and age it seems surreal.

JeffD
Aug-02-2008, 9:13pm
but was supplanted by of all things the banjo orchestra...
Some of the history buffs would know better than I, but I thought it was just the reverse, the end of the banjo craze roughly corresponded with earlier parts of the mandolin craze, and the mandolin orchestra culture outlasted the banjo culture, and was killed by ... radio and television.

I should check some of the other threads on this.

Kip Welty
Aug-02-2008, 9:21pm
maybe if there was lefty..............

re simmers
Aug-02-2008, 9:28pm
If it was one of the top 2 that Herschel Sizemore has, I would. Those 2 that are consecutive numbers are unbelievable. I've heard some that weren't so great, but those 2 are great.

Bernie Daniel
Aug-02-2008, 10:28pm
JeffD: Its not just owning a mandolin, or even owning a great mandolin, its owning a piece of history.

Owning a 1919 F2 is owning "a piece of history" too. You do not need a Loar for that.

Alex Fields
Aug-02-2008, 10:35pm
I would buy a Gil, some high end mandola, a hardanger fiddle, a huge supply of strings, and use the rest to pay for all of my college tuition and graduate debt free.

In my experience the best luthiers working today build better instruments than Gibson ever did, even if the Loar instruments have the advantage of age. #I would also be reluctant to play anything that said "The Gibson" on the headstock, Loar or not...

EDIT: I also have to agree with the people who raise ethical concerns, but this is not the place to argue with the other posters. Threads always get dirty when people try. http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

Joel Spaulding
Aug-02-2008, 10:53pm
Okay my tune has changed as this thread has developed.

Using Tom T's definition of "if I had the Money", (which probably is how this should be interpreted) - Yes, I Would buy one. If I had the money- why not? I agree with earlier posts that state this is not a moral issue.

Mojo !

Plus, I might get invited to a "Loarfest" if I actually #owned one. Then again...maybe not. http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

JEStanek
Aug-02-2008, 10:54pm
Perhaps it would be like owning a Frank Lloyd Wright house. Consider Falling Water. The place leaks, but lots of people into American architecture dream of visiting, much less owning it. That's my motivation for if there was enough money would I caretake a Loar. My answer stands as a yes but, there's lots I would do with the money first.

Jamie

h2o-X
Aug-02-2008, 11:01pm
It would be fun to caretake a Loar, but it would be wasted on me. A better option for me would be to subsidize my income with the $250,000, quite teaching elementary school for 4 years, and pick the guts out of my Newell while taking lessons from my teacher, John Daughtry. Then, once I won the respect of the Newell, I'd buy a Hester varnish F2, a varnish Weber Bridger F, a varnish Daley F, and a Cohen mandocello and head back to the classroom with a big smile on my face.

I lived across the street from a Frank Lloyd Wright house in college and visited several others where I grew up in southern Wisconsin. Many of them were quite beautiful. I wouldn't mind caretaking one of those either!

Mikey G
Aug-02-2008, 11:59pm
If I had a quarter of a million dollars, and "just" a quarter million, would I spend the whole $250k on a $250k Loar, and still maintain my current standard of living? Nope. Now if I had $250 million dollars, I'd buy'em all.

Ivan Kelsall
Aug-03-2008, 3:18am
I think that for most of us "if i had the money" means "if i had the money to spare without sacrificing the most important things & providing my family & relatives were as well off & looked after as they should be".That is certainly what i meant personally. There are folk out there who wouldn't hesitate to purchase high end cars at Ł180,000 UK plus,($360,000 US).By the time they drive it out of the showroom,they just lost 25% of the value.They know it,but it doesn't deter them from their purchase.The same goes for all of us that buy ANY new car,we make an immediate loss & some folk do it over & over again.
# I'm sure that many players on here,if they had the good fortune,would indeed purchase such a rare instrument as a Loar,given the chance. Of course it is all down to personal preference & attitude re.what is 'right & proper & morally correct". To some people,the purchase of such an expensive instrument would be morally wrong - i say Amen to their stance,that is right for them,but not for some of the rest of us. We may have other reasons for not wishing to buy a Loar - perceived value being one of them.
# #We can only speak of our 'personal' reasons for anything we choose to do. Personally,i've missed some great opportunities in life by being indecisive. Nearly 40 years ago,i could have had a job as a highly paid engineer with any of the USA Aircraft makers. They were recruiting like crazy over here,& as my father was a USA citizen,obtaining a visa/permit was no problem. I let the opportunity go & i've regretted it ever since. I had an opportunity back in 1992 of buying the most wonderful pre-war Gibson Mastertone Banjo i've ever come across,at the IBMA festival - a 1926 Gibson TB-6 conversion for $3,500. It was COLLOSAL in terms of tone - i could have afforded it at the time,but let it go,another mistake.
# #The whole point of my rambling on here is - if an opportunity comes along which will not adversely affect your personal well being or that of your family or friends,but which
all things being equal,is constructive in terms of personal enjoyment & endeavour,then go for it. At age 63,i'm too old to let ANY opportunity regarding my personal musical ambition & pleasure slide away from me. So,in the previously outlined context of "if i had the money" i'd buy a Loar if i had the chance,not to 'pose with',most people wouldn't know what it was unless you told them anyway,but to enjoy the experience of playing - NOT OWNING - such a wonderful instrument. Having to OWN IT,comes as a pre-requisite,
# # # # #Saska

danb
Aug-03-2008, 4:52am
The experience of having one is something everybody here would want, whether they know it or not. The question of "how much is that worth in dollars" is a question that is interesting in that it shows how people place value on things.

They're quite valuable things to be sure. But what's the value of the experience? Not describable in terms of dollars would be my answer. Price and Value are two very separate things, that have almost nothing to do with each other. The value of a Loar has a tangible/price side (which is describable in terms of condition, originality, etc as other collectibles), and an intangible "what you can do with it" or "how it makes you feel" side, which has nothing to do with the cash.

The answer to "how does it make you feel" question is, to me, equally impressive to the "how much money would one cost" question. I found that borrowing one for a while was a huge eye-opener. I'd simply never played anything that sounded that good, which in turn taught me techniques and subtleties that weren't giving enough bang on lesser instruments that I'd keep at them.

Ivan Kelsall
Aug-03-2008, 5:52am
Very well put Dan. There comes a time (i'm not there yet for certain), when the limitations of an instrument limit the players ability to express the sublties of the music they play. I watched a most wonderful performance of the Bruch Violin concerto last night,payed by the young Dutch violinist Janine Jansen. Her performance was incredible to say the least & it did raise the question in my mind while i listened - would it have sounded as good on a lesser instrument,as the instrument that she was playing was the Stradivarius Violin known as the "Barrere" Strad.The instrument isn't owned by her,but by a foundation,from which she loaned it. I'm sure that Miss Jansen could coax #music out of a buiscuit tin fiddle if she had to,but to the ultimate detriment of her performance. I'm also sure that being behind a Violin of the stature of that Strad.,did wonders for her confidence.
# #I've never been fortunate enough to have played a Loar,or even(knowingly) been in the same room as one. Given the opportunity to play a good Loar Mandolin,for example the one owned by Mr Reichsman,i'd probably weep at having to hand it back.
# There are other magnificent instruments out there,but the Loars have achieved a 'status' equaled by none. Not ALL the people who eulogise about the qualities of the Loars can be wrong. I agree with Dan when he says that (if we are truthful)that everybody would want one. Why else are players paying high prices for the mandolins that sound as close to the Loars as the makers can get them to sound & why have so many makers studied the construction of the Loars ?. It's not just out of curiosity,that's for certain.
# I'm just going to have another listen to the sound clips on Greg's site,to make certain that while i'm robbing a bank tomorrow,i'll know it's for a good cause (ONLY JOKING !!!)but not about having a listen though,
# # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # #Saska

TomTyrrell
Aug-03-2008, 8:05am
<Comment removed. Sorry, but straying into hotbutton issues is not consistent with this thread, or this site, and will not be tolerated.>

Hans
Aug-03-2008, 10:15am
Bruch violin concerto! http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

Scott Tichenor
Aug-03-2008, 10:36am
I think I've started writing and then deleted about 5 times on this subject, but what I want to get across is just how important the creation of the Loar mandolin was and it's something that is often taken for granted. I guess most realize this but it has changed how a mandolin could be used in music profoundly.
I don't think there would be any chance that so many talented custom builders would have sprung up to make F-4 copies. I also think acoustic music would be totally different. There probably wouldn't even be a Mandolin Cafe.
I guess you could say the same about Martin dreads, Mastertone banjo's or Les Paul's but we only care about mandolin's here.
I agree up to a point, but coming from a non-bluegrass, even non American-centered perspective... yes the Loar F5 is an important development, but there are other mandolin worlds out there. Yes the mandolin world might have been different if there were only F4s but there was a mandolin world even before Orville Gibson. I think there might not have been a Mandolin Cafe that looks exactly like this one but there most likley would have been some site where mandolinists gather to discuss mandolin playing. Mandolins did exist way before Loar. In fact there was quite a craze in the 1880s both in the US and in Europe and Japan for the instrument.

Now... back to the program already in progress... sorry for the hijack...
You read it here folks. Had there been no Loar, the Mandolin Cafe would not exist. Someone should have told me that back in 1995 when I started dreaming this place up. Wow!

http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif

Kbone
Aug-03-2008, 10:54am
I've played one and the answer is *no* - nice, but not $150 grand nice.

chip
Aug-03-2008, 10:56am
Absolutely. Owning a a piece of history like a Loar is a good thing.

jasona
Aug-03-2008, 11:12am
You read it here folks. Had there been no Loar, the Mandolin Cafe would not exist. Someone should have told me that back in 1995 when I started dreaming this place up. Wow!

http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif
Yes, and you have been responsible for driving up their price (and all other mandolins as a consequence) ever since. Such a symbiotic relationship! http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif

Dave Schimming
Aug-04-2008, 8:22am
I'll let the Loars go to those that can do them justice when played.

Gerard Dick
Aug-04-2008, 9:13am
Lotsa folks driving around in Ferraris and other high end sports/racing cars that are incapable of realizing even close to the full potential of their ride. They just appreciate nice things and have money. If having the money is defined as having enough that cutting a 250G check would not adversely affect the bank account Yes I'd buy one and a high end sports car too.

Timbofood
Aug-04-2008, 9:19am
But Jasona, by that reckoning the cafe has also driven up the price of electricity, milk, gasoline and toilet paper. The cafe has not DRIVEN the price, merely been a platform for that price increase to be seen. I think that the rarity has driven price, just as it does in the precious metal or gem stone (diamond) market. OMIGOD is the cafe the DeBeers of the instrument world?!http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

Capt. E
Aug-04-2008, 9:36am
"In my experience the best luthiers working today build better instruments than Gibson ever did..."

I have heard many times comments that the "best" string instruments ever are being lovingly carved today, be it guitars, mandolins, violins, etc. I know it is true of accordions...builders in Louisiana, Quebec, France, Italy, Australia...are making fabulous instruments. Give a top luthier the same wood that was available in 18th century Italy (old growth from the "little ice age" that had very special densities and structure) and he/she could make violin every bit the equal of the best Stradivarius. Even all Stradivarius' are not equal. As with Gibson, there was a "golden" period. Perhaps we are in one now in regards the finest hand-made guitars, mandolins, violins, etc. Time will tell.
I still would love to have a Loar F5, but it would be wasted on me. I suspect there may be Loars also owned by foundations and loaned out at some time. Give that some time also.

jasona
Aug-04-2008, 11:13am
But Jasona, by that reckoning the cafe has also driven up the price of electricity, milk, gasoline and toilet paper.
Oh, but it HAS!

(Its a joking reference to a long ago thread)

lespaul_79
Aug-04-2008, 11:22am
I'm with the original post by Rick, the Tone Monster. I'd get a nice Collings F and get "little cabin on the hill". With that much money I'd take 6 months off and go to music school and learn music theory and jazz on guitar and mando. And invest in something so I wouldnt have to work so hard and I could have more time to play music...

fatt-dad
Aug-04-2008, 11:40am
If I had $2M in the bank, I wouldn't do it. If I had $20M in the bank I wouldn't do it. If I had $200M in the bank, I'd likely do it.

f-d

Darryl Wolfe
Aug-04-2008, 11:47am
I'm glad I've been away from the computer since Thursday http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/mandosmiley.gif

JimRichter
Aug-04-2008, 11:59am
It's an interesting discussion. Can't recall one quite like it before, though other threads have touched on it.

If I had a lot (and I mean a lot) of disposable income, I would consider a Loar. I wouldn't sell all my stuff to buy one.

That's not to say I wouldn't do so for the right mandolin or a historical mandolin that meant something to me. I've wanted the Dave Apollon electric mandola they've had at Bernunzio's for awhile (and I think there's a comparable one at Elderly). I would snatch something like that up. A curiosity like an old F7, or a pristine F4 or snakehead A4 with virzi.

I definitely appreciate the aura and mystique of a Loar F5, but not enough to deprive myself a varied choice of instruments.

Plus, as a multi-instrumentalist, I would also be thinking of the vintage Strat, ES335, Martin D18, Byrdland, flathead Gibson banjo, etc. It's too much to tie up in one instrument. And, if I did have the cash, there's so much more I'd want.

Jim

Jonathan Peck
Aug-04-2008, 12:23pm
Even if I had a Loar, I think people would still walk over to me and ask..."is that a ukelele?"

Keith Erickson
Aug-04-2008, 5:02pm
Right now I can't comprehend that type of wealth in my life....

...but I'll play the game since these 5 page have got me hooked.

No I don't believe I would be worthy enough to play a Loar. Love the Loar and its sound but that's not where my passion lies.

If my family and I were to become independently wealthy, my first priority would be to pay off our house and invest our money and make that money grow for us.

Set up a college 529 plan for mini 8_String. He isn't going to be a trust fund baby for free. He's going to have to earn his money.

Then our next plan would be to talk with our church choir director and parish priest and ask them what can we do to help them out (i.e. sound system, new organ, piano's, funds for construction).

Then my wife and I would talk to the local historical society to see how we would be able to assist them.

After we check off the above, we then move on to the El Paso Symphony Orchestra and talk with the director on how we could support them.

After than is all done, I would ask Dale Ludewig if he could make me a matching Emory Lestor Mandola and an Emory Lester Mandocello to match my beautiful Emory Lester Mandolin http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

twaaang
Aug-04-2008, 5:07pm
I think $200,000 couldn't fix the quintessentially lame sensation I'd have if I was playing out with "my" Loar, and someone came along who knew what it was. My MAS aspires to the very very nice, but not the legendary! -- Paul

Links
Aug-05-2008, 10:00am
Heck, I'm always trying to figure out how I can get one! #It's not like you are throwing money down a rat hole. #Hopefully, you have not put you or your family in financial jeopardy to buy it, so look at it as a very enjoyable Certificate of Deposit. #How much fun is it to bring your friends in your house and show them your CD from a local bank? #How much fun is it to go to a local jam and have someone say, "hey, what's that folded sheet of paper sticking out of your pocket"? #- #"oh, just a $200,000 CD #- wanna see it"? #"Wow, I'd love to have one of those one day"! "Yeah, it's nice and it's in it's original manila envelope". #"You're kidding"! #"Nope"! "She's a beaut"! #"Where did you get it"? #"First Federal"! #"Gee, thanks for the info"!

PS: Fattdad - you are an engineer and are thinking way to logically!

f5loar
Aug-05-2008, 10:14am
It's a good thing the majority of you say you would not want a Loar because there ain't enough to go around as it is.

fatt-dad
Aug-05-2008, 11:48am
PS: #Fattdad #- you are an engineer and are thinking way to logically!
Oops, what I meant was, "If I had $2,000.00 wouldn't do it, if I had $20,000.00 wouldn't do it, if I had $200,000.00 would likely do it!"

What's a few zeros, eh?

Now back to my guitar worries. . .

f-d

Rick Schmidlin
Aug-05-2008, 5:00pm
I was walking the Vancouver Bay yesterday and though that my MF5 and a $200,000.00 could sale the world. A Loar would never make me never leave the couch,with my ocean view.

grassrootphilosopher
Aug-08-2008, 6:01am
This is a really funny thread. Only on page 3 of this thread did people dig a different angle of the "if I had..." concept.

And yes, if I had 250.000 USD IŽd buy me a Loar F 5. With some of my other cash IŽd buy me a 1936 Martin D 28, a 1938 Gibson Advanced Jumbo and quite possibly a 00-45 from the 20ies for fingerpicking. Though I would start my spending spree only after completely remodeling my motherŽs house, hiring a nurse and a doctor for her fulltime, a chaufeur for her little trips here and there and a secretary/companion; IŽd do it with locals that could use employment without much work and good pay, IŽd move closer to my mother, spend dough on my parents in law, my wife, my son. Well and then - apart from picking the heck out of my instruments with picking buddies - IŽd spend my time in the ever honorable cause of saving the earth. Boy, that would feel good. Since I donŽt have this kind of money, I do the best I can for my family, pick the heck out of my instruments (with or without my picking buddies) and try to do good with my limited means.

Peace brothers.

Alex of the North
Aug-08-2008, 3:47pm
I think it immoral for society to limit how the person can spend his or her legally acquired money - (excepting of course if the money is to be spent on illegal activities, hiring hitmen etc.)

I would also find it immoral for society to limit how a person can spend his or her legally acquired money. I'm not a communist, I am, in fact, a small business owner and I'm very happy with capitalism (for the most part). I meant my question in purely personal terms. Personally, I could not spend 250,000 (or even 2000) on a mandolin when on one hand I haven't yet secured my family's financial future (still working on it), and on the other hand there are so many people in so much need. So, would I buy a Loar if I had the money? No. I don't think I could ever be happy owning it when I knew how much its monetary value could change lives. You won't find me in a Ferrari or a $1,000,000 yacht either. I'm not going to stand in your way should you choose differently. I just believe that since we live in a global society that is deeply inter-connected that virtually every decision that we make has an ethical dimension to it. A Loar in addition to an astronomical monetary cost, represents an enormous opportunity cost. Just wanted to toss that in there, perhaps I didn't express my viewpoint clearly enough.

Steve Ostrander
Aug-08-2008, 3:59pm
I'd be a nervous wreck with a Loar in the house. What if the house burned down? What if somebody stole it? Nah. I'd buy a Gil and keep the change.

mandopete
Aug-08-2008, 4:14pm
Look like there's one for measly $225,000 in classifieds as we speak.

Dave Greenspoon
Aug-08-2008, 4:25pm
$225K seems to be the going ask-rate these days. I remember shortly after I joined the Cafe prices started breaking 100K. Would I sink $225 into a Loar thinking that one day I'd see much more than the rate of inflation back even if not the current 125% ROI if I could? The investment value of a Loar has far outpaced my retirement accounts, PLUS I'd have a tonal monster to play. Who knows...I'm such a heretic I might even just have the back painted with some Parrothead motif (just kidding!). So in a word...Yes!

Chris Wofford
Aug-09-2008, 11:22am
To me the key part of the question is "if you had the money." I enjoy playing, but playing is not like needing to eat. I believe to some people playing the mandolin is necessary for them to enjoy the life. That is how they are wired. For those folks, the ability to borrow $225k and pay it back may be "having the money".

I would have to be wealthy enough to spend $225k like I spend $50 right now to feel like I "had the money". So, if I had the money, absolutely. At that point I would also have enough money to have Bill Gates be my tech support. http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif

sprucetop1
Aug-09-2008, 11:41am
In 1965, I saw a Loar for $150. I couldn't afford it, so I didn't buy it......

jimbob
Aug-09-2008, 11:45am
If I had the means, I'd buy all I could get my hands on. I'm a materialistic pig....not quite that bad, but I would love to have the "real deal". I like to collect things I like and a Loar would be nice to own. http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

CES
Aug-09-2008, 11:53am
Not me...at least not at this stage of my life. Even if it weren't a financial issue I think I'd have to buy it and "lend" it to a maestro like some violin players do with their Strads. I just couldn't do it justice.