Mandola's and mandocello's

[Soupy1957]

Anyone explored the world of the Mandola or Mandocello in here? I'm sure there are a few of you.

Did you go there FROM mandolin? How was the transition? Are the chording structures a lot different? What's the biggest (if you had to name only one), change from the Mandolin?

-Soupy1957

[jmcgann]

The shapes and intervals are all the same, but in a different place, so if you ignore the new tuning/pitch levels you can play everything you know, but it'll be in a different key (a 5th lower).

Mandola can be fingered like mandolin; mandocello requires more guitar/mando hybrid fingerings unless you are Plastic Man http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

[mandocrucian]

Aside from the fingering stretches (moderate on mandola) and the fingering changes on OM (at least in the open position), the important difference in in the register.

You'll find that some things which sound fine on mandolin don't sound as good on the bigger/lower instruments. How you voice your chords becomes more important - a chord with a root on the bottom is going to be (more) different than one with a 3rd, or 9th on the bottom. The ear hears backup from the bottom upwards. (You can play bass lines on an OM if you like, and it #will sound OK.)

Also, the increased sustain plays into what sounds good and what starts to sound muddy.

Register definitely affects "function".

Niles H

[billkilpatrick]

i've put half-payment down on an M-16 mandola from mike dulak, to be picked up in the states next year. other than waiting anxiously to get it, i hadn't anticipated any problems in the transition. i'm used to - but not expert - in thinking a few steps ahead of "normal" with my charango.

i must admit, the mp3's here sound very different from what i imagine (hope) my mandola will sound like:

http://www.jtallet.co.uk/stringmaker/mandola_page.htm

... and this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TZiBZwPOfPI

... sounds like a cross between an oud and something celtic.

- bill

[Soupy1957]

Mandola's and Mandocello's ARE a tad more expensive than a mandolin obviously (I presume primarily because of the larger amount of material needed to make them), yes?

Any price ranges anyone knows about?

-Soupy1957

[billkilpatrick]

i think these are more than reasonable for price:

http://franklinguitarcompany.com/products_mandolas.php

[twaaang]

I've had a mandola for a bit less than a year and find that it is helping my development on mandolin. My approach has been mostly to work on tunes I already know on mandolin, in the same key -- working them out on mandola gets me playing the tunes either lower in pitch, or at the familiar pitch but higher up the neck. Either way, there's a lot of finger and ear training going on, which is transferable back to the mandolin. Also, much of the exploration is taking place between the 7th and 12th frets, which feels much less pinched on the mandola than on the mandolin, but still the different fretboard experience is "portable" back to the mandolin; plus I'm more comfortable using my pinky.

For all that, I'm still not at a point where I'm comfortable playing the mandola at sessions, because I get too confused. The cure may be to take only the mandola to a session or two and work it through without the nice safe mandolin option to fall back on so easily.

Hoping this helps. -- Paul

[good_ol_al_61]

Talk with Dennis at the Mandolin Store or Steve Perry at Gianna Violins. I have purchased new and used mandolins from both and are top notch in sales and service. I recently bought my Eastman 805MDC Mandocello from Steve and it sounds awesome. Mark Gresham (Famous guitar maker) played the mandocello and made wonderful comments on the workmanship and tone.

As for "relearning", well any instrument is a lifetime of learning. The only problem I have is to split my finite day between several great instruments. Oh, the humanity of it all! Sigh. http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif

[Jim Garber]

The other hangup is if you need to read. Mandola (at least the one that is common in the US) is tuned CGDA but uses the alto clef (middle line is middle C) and the mandocello uses bass clef.

More on this thread on alto clef (http://www.mandolincafe.net/cgi-bin/ikonboard.cgi?act=ST;f=16;t=47805;hl=alto+clef).

[Soupy1957]

All great suggestions, thoughts, insights....thanks much gang.

I did check out the links to the mandola's and I agree that the prices shown for the ones on the page were not over the top.

Billkilpatrick: I subscribed to your videos and noted one that you did with an instrument I can't identify:

BillKilpatrick (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D700k5tI7Oc&feature=related)

What looks like a ukelele (sp?) is not, correct? What IS that instrument?


-Soupy1957

[billkilpatrick]

The other hangup is if you need to read ...

More on this thread on alto clef (http://www.mandolincafe.net/cgi-bin/ikonboard.cgi?act=ST;f=16;t=47805;hl=alto+clef).
considering my reading ... "skills" - this counts as something of a bummer.

[billkilpatrick]

What looks like a ukelele (sp?) is not, correct? #What IS that instrument?
ahhh ... always a pleasure ... - it's a charango from south america. traditionally played with the fingers - picked or strummed - but i use an oud plectrum. they're fabulous little instruments and if you're interested, please check out the early music charango blog listed below.

[Big Joe]

I have played both quite a bit. I don't find any problems since the intervals between the strings is the same on all of the mandolin family. It will give you a different key if you play in the same place on all of them, but the transition will be pretty easy for that issue.

The bigger issue is you have to think a bit differently becuase the scales are bigger. On the mandola I don't have a problem, but on the Mandocello I can only play two courses at a time. You cannot think in terms of three of four course chords. The Mandocello is so cool. The bottom string played open sounds like the center of the universe just opened to speak to you!~

I have a mandocello my son (Josh Vest...Gibson Repair) built for me. He is a great builder. He also just finished building me a really cool electric mandolin that has a LP body shape. The tone is incredible and plays like any other mandolin. I have ordered a mandola from Steve Perry (Eastman) and should have it in the next few days. I don't play mandocello very often, but I do like to play mandola. With my large hands the little bigger fretboard stretch is not an issue. It is still smaller than any of my guitars http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif .

I had a Gilchrist mandola (F model) for a few years before I was enticed to sell it. He had more money than needs and I had more needs than money. Funny how that happens when you have a house full of kids. For those of you thinking you will never have anything, wait till you finally get the rug rats gone. All that money you spent on groceries for them will buy you a very nice mandoln in a fairly short time http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif .

[good_ol_al_61]

Humor coming...Oh my goodness, Big Joe is getting an Eastman! http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif

I can just see the threads coming. Scott, fasten your seatbelts.

Big Joe...you have always been a big help to me over the years, thank you and welcome to the fold of Gibson/Eastman owners. I believe you will be pleased with your 'dola.

[entau]

"You cannot think in terms of three of four course chords"

have to disagree - it just takes some calluses and some stretches- painful at times?
yes -but be being raised catholic just prepared me for the suffering
I will admit at times it is easier and cleaner to go to a two tone chord than a 4 tone chord - mea culpa

I do notice my left and right hands are very tired after a mandocello workout

the mandocello is - just BIGGER -

string gages are at least double- that is the biggest issue-and heavier than most guitars.

but I guess for me it is important not to try to play the mandocello like a mandolin

I try to think of it as it's own instrumnet - ( not a large mandolin or mandola) -

I also try not to think like a guitar either on it

I'm pretty sure bowed cello players might get upset if you ask them what it is like to play a "big violin" like that

but I have worked up some arrangments of mandolin tunes on mandocello - fingerings and neck positions are not even close to mandolin

I have grown to prefer the mandocello over the mandolin/or octave

[jmcgann]

Here's a sample of a recording I did (http://www.johnmcgann.com/MP3s/passpiedsample1.mp3) several years ago of Debussy's "Passpied" from Suite Bergamasque (originally for piano) the features mandocello and mandola ( both made by JR Zeidler) on the bottom. The lines were kind of gnarly to play and I used chord positions to get them, although the notes are not sounded as a vertical chord- more arpeggiated.

I'll probably make the whole recording available as a digital download before long...

If the above link doesn't work try here, 2nd tune down (http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewprofile&friendid=150405314)

[JeffD]

For mandola I find that some tenor banjo thinking really helps. The frets being farther, many of the banjo chord fingerings too cramped for the mandolin become easy on the mandola - it becomes almost a different kind of instrument.

[Big Joe]

Jeff...I am just the oposite! I think that thinking in mandola helps me play tenor banjo better http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif .