Kentucky mandolin?

[micall5]

So I have had a Mid Missouri M-4 mandolin for about 5 years. I didn't really start playing it until 2 years ago and now I can just about keep up in some circles at festivals. I play all by ear and really need some work on actual songs and not just playing along with my cd player.
My question is... this weekend I went to Northwest String Summit ( a hippie bluegrass festival ) that was a lot of fun. I play my Mid Missouri and it's just not bluegrass material. Not only do I get strange looks sometimes but its small, oval holed A style, and just doesn't have the tone I would like. It does sound nice in certain situations, but the chop alone makes me want to switch it.
So while at this festival I was with many other pickers (band members of the loose digits in seattle) and I played several well made and expensive mando's. Then I played a used $350.00 Kentucy F style and was amazed. The action was perfect and it made my playing seem to fly through songs. Anyway, it was great. My buddy who had it said he got it used for that price and I was wondering if it was the action that made it so great to play. It had a great chop tone and picked well. Overall, if I could get that for 350, I would love it.
If I bought a higher quality mando, would I be able to get this effect by simply lowering the action to imitate what he had, or was it really the mandolin? Does Kentucky usually produce good quality instruments?
I would appreciate any comments and enjoy hearing your ideas.
Thanks
Michael

[JEStanek]

If you look back through the General Info and Looking for Info sections for Kentucky you'll see that over the past year folks have reported a couple of notch improvements in Kentucky's quality and workmanship (I believe they are after Eastman's market). With any mass produced instrument you'll get variations between instruments to some degree even with the same set-up and strings. If possible try and play one before you buy or buy from a reputable dealer who will work with you to choose one and set it up how you would like. You would likely get the tone you are after with more money spent but just because you spend more doesn't mean you'll end up with one exactly like the one you played and liked so much.

Don't be hasty, try and play one until you find "the one" you can afford regardless of headstock name or body shape.

Jamie

[Truckadero]

Michael,

Jamie stated it well above. Kentucky does make some nice instruments. However, like most mandolins you will find a wide variance in sound and playability among them. For example, I just purhased a new 07 Kentucky KM-630 from a reputable dealer. They had a higher end model available too. But this one sounded and played so much better it was ridiculous. So for hundreds less, I got a much better sounding and playing instrument. Set up is key. As are strings and other factors. I'll echo Jamies advice and say "play before you pay". You will find the one for you in the process.

[earthsave]

I'd say the Kentucky, Fender, Michael Kelly, Morgan Monroe, Johnson, etc. would be considered budget/starter mandolins. Not saying they cannot be made to play well and sound ok, but you will have a hard time getting the woody full range volume you get with a more expensive mandolin. Those mentioned above are hit or miss and definitely a try and compare before you buy.

You mid-Mo is going to sound different because it is a flat top oval hole.

[micall5]

Thanks for the the comments.
I figured that play before I buy was the best way to go. Also, finding a good variety to play can also be the problem. There are only so many music shops around here (bellingham wa) that have mando's to play. I sometimes wish I lived in Austin or similar place.
The set up on an instrument is a bit of a mystery to me. Can anyone explain how the set up can change that much of a mandolin?
If I some what liked the sound and playability of a mandolin but planed on getting some set up work, maybe a better bridge, or other work done... can I safely say this would improve a mandolin that is not thousands of dollars?
Thanks again,
Michael

[micall5]

Sorry... PS. What does lower action have on the sound? Pros and cons?
Thanks agian

[JEStanek]

Michael,
Some people feel higher action = more volume... wether this is b/c there is more downward pressure on the bridge to give more volume or just because you can strum harder without buzzing is not conclusively known.

I'm a big baby, I like a low action myself. Thile plays a really low action and his sound is good to my ears. Bill Monroe routinely had it skyscarper high.

Your other questions... set up is more along the lines of adjusting the nut so the strings fit properly and aren't so high that it hurts/cuts your fingers when you fret in first position (frets 1-5). Also, a good set up ensures the bridge is properly seated (no gaps underneath) and slotted to allow for perfect intonation up the neck. Changing the nut and bridge aren't considered part of a set-up, rather they are "modifications". On many inexpensive mandos, the nut is cheap plastic and the bridge not particularly hard. Swapping those things out will improve the tone from somewhat to a good deal depending on how bad they were originally. Having everything properly adjusted will have a greater impact than changing those things out on an improperly adjusted one.

Your Mid-mo is a great instrument (better than these other brands you're considering) but just not so suited for what/where you're playing. Many folks would consider the Mid Mo an upgrade from those but it is a flat top oval hole rather than an arch top with ff holes. The Café sponsors are good sources to get a well set up inexpensive model mandolin if you can't play before you buy. Just ask about return policies, how much set up work is done etc. Interview them for your business.

Jamie

[micall5]

Jamie,
Thanks for answering the questions well. I do realize that the Mid Mo is great quality. Especially since the original Mid Mo factory had a fire and now they are Big Muddy Mandolins. Same construction but just different name.
I love the tone of the Mid Mo just ready for a change. And I am starting to play in more bluegrass circles.
Thanks for clarifying the set up for me. I could see how switching the nut and bridge on an instrument could improve the tone of a lower end instrument.
Thanks,
Michael

[earthsave]

One thing to consider if you do not have any good mando shops nearby. My nearest one is about a 2:30 hour drive.

THere are dealers/sponsors on here that will sell you a playable mandolin and I would consider it the next best thing to try before you buy.

http://www.fqms.com

http://www.elderly.com

http://www.janetdavismusic.com

[mandroid]

Saga musical imports has a brand name of kentucky, and had a number of different
suppliers on the Asian side of the pacific.
they have changed the 'Who' of the production contract side of the business over the years.

Eastman came thru contracting with some China based violin companys, and
their labor force does a lot more handcarved work, even though CNC-CAM
turns out tops, backs and necks for a lower cost.

the variable nature of wood , bought in large a quantity for mass production,
does have identical parts, though,
when put together , sound different.

always best to go where there are several in stock, and try a bunch,
even of the same model.

http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/coffee.gif

[MandoChop]

I purchased a Kentucky 254 '07 model (A-style w/ F holes). After a few months, I'm extremely pleased. The factory setup was fair, but I'm picky about very low action (as low as it goes without buzz except with fairly harsh attack). The fingers can tell the slightest of variations with must a couple .100's of an inch. With about an hour of extra setup (between my picky dad and I) and J74's D'Addario strings the mando sounds sweet w/ a good chop. I replaced the tailpiece and wove a two inch strip of leather lace through the strings just distal to tailpiece to cut out the aftertone vibration of tailpiece. I love it. I consider mine to be a good deal. After close scrutiny, I discovered the neck was very slightly humped over the frets close to the body - a little fret leveling, and it was sweet. So I guess I could say there were some minor issues in the pursuit of perfection, but in the end, with a little effort in perfecting the setup, the mando was well worth it. Good luck. Rich.

[pager]

Eastman came thru contracting with some China based violin companys, and #
their labor force does a lot more handcarved work, even though CNC-CAM
turns out tops, backs and necks for a lower cost.


Eastman does not contract their mandolins out. #They have their own shop under the direction of Eastman Strings. #It is a small shop, they are not a very big company. #They only turn out about 500 mandolins total, a year. #There are NO CNC-CAM machines at Eastman. #The tops, backs and necks are all handcarved.