First (sort of) mandolin suggestions?

[architectx]

Hi folks,

New to the board here, so please forgive my ignorance. Here's the deal: I've played guitar since I was about 8 years old (36 now). Music includes a little bluegrass, lots of solo fingerstyle, folk stuff, and I play in church pretty much at least once a week. So anyways, I bought my oldest son a little Kentucky A style mando about a year ago (pretty much a base model). He's played with it on and off, but his real interest seems to lie in all things bass, so I've picked up his mando a bit lately and have taken something of a liking to it.

Anyways, I'm contemplating getting myself a slightly nicer instrument at this point. I play a custom built Collings OM (among other guitars), so I'm drawn to the Collings mandos too. At the same time, I really shouldn't spend quite that much right now. So, if my price range were say, $650 to maybe $1000 (tops), what would you guys recommend I look at? I know I get more bang for my buck with A style instruments, but yes, like others, I'm drawn to the aesthetic the scrolls offer. I've picked up a few Eastmans and Michael Kellys, but other than basic setup issues I don't really know what to be looking for in a mandolin. I'd love some pointers on how to shop (what to listen and look for) in addition to specific brand / model suggestions.

Thanks!

Trey

Definitely Eastman, You will get a splendid 515 for the lower end of your price scale.

[John Flynn]

If you ask 10 mando players that question, you will likely get 11 different answers! I think the best advice, especially for an experienced musician, is play as many as you can and buy the one that really speaks to you. I know that sounds kind of "touchy-feely," but that really will be the one you will be most satisfied with. If you really have to have an F, I would be looking at the Eastmans. You can get a baseline F from them under $1,000 and they make a very decent instrument. Other possibilities are the higher end Kentuckys and Alvarez. Some people swear by MKs. I am not wild about the the tone on them, but they look and play great.

[ab4usa]

I don't mean to blow the budget but the Glenn in the classifieds at $1250 is a good deal if you need a scroll.

[fatt-dad]

ditto to Johnny. I have also played a few new Epiphone mandolins that weren't half-bad (for pac-rim f-models). If I were in your hunt, I'd look for a used Gibson A9 or Flatiron A (Performer, Festival, Artist, etc.). Good luck.

f-d

[red7flag]

I also ditto to Johnny. Were I you, I would go on a mando searching exploration. That includes going to as many stores, picking parties and music get togethers until you find that one instrument that rocks your socks. Think about how you will use it. A f hole will be more percussive and able to "chop" for bluegrass. An oval will tend to sing more, more oriented to celtic, folk, fiddle tunes. I played a mandovoodooed (special set up by Steve Perry, you will find more information with a site search) 505 Eastman that my cousin had. For the $, that was about the best I have played. I think the total price including mandovoodoo, shipping was 600 and change. Like many on the cafe will tell you, with a limited budget you will get a lot more instrument when buying and A style (no scroll) for the same money (this is from a scoll addict). For another option, you also might check the classifieds here. If you do decide to buy here, talk with the seller and get a feel. You don't want to buy another person's mistake. Make sure that you can return it for full price if not satisfied. Mostly, have fun.
Tony

[architectx]

Hey folks,

Thanks for all the good input here. Just got back from the only good local mandolin shop in town. I played several of the Eastmans and a couple of MKs. I was particularly drawn to an Eastman A body with an oval hole. I loved the woody warmer tone. Now, I'm not necessarily a "bluegrasser", but I do like to play bluegrass and old gospel stuff (in addition to folky & Celtic tunes). So, my new question - is it "okay" to play bluegrass on an oval hole mando? I know you can play most anything on most any type of instrument (ala Bela Fleck, etc.), but what can an oval hole mando not do that an F hole can?

Thanks!

[GBG]

I've never had an oval hole mandolin that I could get a half-way decent chop chord out of;however, a friend of mine has an old Gibson F-2 that can chop with the best of them.

I have two ovals and one f style, but if I had only one mandolin for everything, it will be an f style.

[architectx]

Thanks. I sort of suspected that might be the case, that the f holes would be somewhat more versatile.

Okay - another question - is there generally thought to be any perceptable tonal difference between A and F body styles? Is the F body style generally more desirable strictly from an aesthetic point of view or is there more to it?

Thanks for everyone's patience, I'm learning a lot.

~Trey

Judging by the styles of music you are interested in playing I would think that the oval hole/carved top type of thing would be a pretty good compromise.
Trevor Moyle who owns the Acoustic Music Company (Brighton, England) has his grubby hands on hundreds of Eastman/Gibson/Capek etc, he recons that the oval hole mandos dont loose that much chop AND have more sustain and mid.
A darker sound.
Its worth considering.

Disclaimer:~ Trevors words, not mine.

[MandoSquirrel]

Hey folks,

Thanks for all the good input here. Just got back from the only good local mandolin shop in town. I played several of the Eastmans and a couple of MKs. I was particularly drawn to an Eastman A body with an oval hole. I loved the woody warmer tone. Now, I'm not necessarily a "bluegrasser", but I do like to play bluegrass and old gospel stuff (in addition to folky & Celtic tunes). So, my new question - is it "okay" to play bluegrass on an oval hole mando? I know you can play most anything on most any type of instrument (ala Bela Fleck, etc.), but what can an oval hole mando not do that an F hole can?

Thanks!
Check out Red Rector & Andy Statman. the answer is YES with a capital "S. No, it won't sound like an "F", but it'll have TONE.
I'd suggest you look into a Breedlove "Quartz" model in your price range, but I'm biased.

Actually, many consider oval holers to be more versatile, because of that "tone" factor I mentioned above; you get sustain when you want it, & when you want that Bluegrass sound you pick closer to the bridge, with a sharper attack.

[sgarrity]

If you're used to a Collings guitar, I'm not sure I'd be looking at an Eastman. I don't think you'd wind up keeping it very long. Something like a Gibson A-9 or a Flatiron A style would be much more in line with the quality you're used to. This is your first mandolin, do yourself a favor and forget about the scroll. You get SOOOO much more for your money in an A style. But if you just have to have a scroll an Eastman 815 would work and you can get a used one for about a grand.

Shaun

[Michael H Geimer]

If your new mandolin doesn't hold up to your Colling OM, you are not going to happy with it because you will not have solved the current problem ... that your mandolin isn't good enough when compared to your OM.

Used Gibson A9 gets my vote as the lowest price for the tone and volume you'll need to compliment such a fine guitar.

Bring your OM along when you shop, and have someone play it while you try out the mandolins. That way you can eliminate the one's that just don't measure up.

Mandolins and Guitars are different instruments,
What a player would look for in a Mandolin as opposed to a guitar would be quite different i would think? (appart from a decent set up of course).

[bush-man]

Hey folks,

Thanks for all the good input here. Just got back from the only good local mandolin shop in town. I played several of the Eastmans and a couple of MKs. I was particularly drawn to an Eastman A body with an oval hole. I loved the woody warmer tone. Now, I'm not necessarily a "bluegrasser", but I do like to play bluegrass and old gospel stuff (in addition to folky & Celtic tunes). So, my new question - is it "okay" to play bluegrass on an oval hole mando? I know you can play most anything on most any type of instrument (ala Bela Fleck, etc.), but what can an oval hole mando not do that an F hole can?

Thanks!
I played a Gibson F-2 in a bunch of bluegrass bands. It definetly barked with the best of them. Oval hole models tend to have a "warmer" sound and definetly have more sustain then F hole models. Good ones can bark as well. Try one out. A/B it to a F hole model. If it's a well built instrument I think it will fit your needs.

russell

[architectx]

Hey folks,

Thanks so much for all of the input. I played many different instruments over the past couple of weeks. I happened to be down in Birmingham over the latter part of the holidays and stopped in to see my buddy Herb at Fretted Instruments late last week. Well, sure enough, he had a sweet little Collings MT with a gloss top. It was used (but looked brand new). The price was pretty reasonable, so that little gem followed me home.

I don't know why I was so surprised at the difference between that instrument and the better Eastmans. I should have known, I went through the same thing with guitars years ago. Anyways, there is no comparison to the other instruments I tried. It may be a lot of instrument for someone that doesn't really know how to play it well yet, but I suppose the good news is that it will hold its value better than the import models.

Funny part was I also played a much more expensive Collings MF something or another with a black top and liked the MT much more. The MF was certainly eye catching, but the tonal differences were extreme, and the MT suits me much more.

Thanks again for all the help. Now all I need is for someone to clue me in as to how to use this thing!

Best,

Trey

[bush-man]

Congrats on your purchase! Enjoy!

russell

[first string]

Funny part was I also played a much more expensive Collings MF something or another with a black top and liked the MT much more. #The MF was certainly eye catching, but the tonal differences were extreme, and the MT suits me much more.
Maybe—like me—you prefer Engelmann spruce, which the MT has, to the red spruce which is used on all the more upscale Collings mandos.

[JeffD]

I sort of suspected that might be the case, that the f holes would be somewhat more versatile.
Not to be contentious, but lets discuss that one a little. I am not sure you would get universal agreement on that point.

I agree that f holes give you the BG chop better than a round hole, all things being equal, but that would be the only thing, I would think, that an F hole can do that a round hole can't.

In terms of switching between harmony, melodic lead, chord or arpeggio background, or switching between classical, blues, gypsie jazz, Celtic, folk, ole-timey - the round hole could be argued to be more versatile.

The thing is that all thigns are not equal (great sentence that). In a particular player's hands the f hole will sound magnificent in all types of playing and music.

I bring this up not to start a fight or two hijack the thread, but just to put it on record that things are more complicated than they might seem.

Jeff

[dochardee]

Trey, glad to hear you went with the MT. Once you were spoiled by the Collings OM, an MT pretty much became "the" entry level mandolin for you.