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ffpizza5
Oct-03-2005, 12:51pm
Playing backup rhythm can sometimes become blah for the for the mandolin player. #Let’s face it—chucking 1,4,5 chords doesn’t leave a lot for artistic expression. #Sure you can alter the beat, but that only goes so far. #Below is a walking chord progression for Soldier’s Joy (in “D” of course). #Using these chords with altered beats can add so much fun. #Especially when the bass is absent. #

Have Fun!!!

|-------------------------|--------------5-----------|
|5-----------5------------|5------------5-----------|
|4-----------4------------|4------------4-----------|
|2-----------4------------|7------------------------|


|-------------------------|--------------------------|
|5-----------5------------|4----4------------7-------|
|4-----------4------------|2----2------------7-------|
|7-----------4------------|2----2------------6-------|


|-------------------------|-------------5------------|
|5-----------5------------|5------------5------------|
|4-----------4------------|4------------4------------|
|2-----------4------------|7-------------------------|


|-------------------------|--------------------------|
|5-----------7------------|5-----------------5-------|
|4-----------7------------|4-----------------4-------|
|7-----------6------------|7-----------------2-------|

|
|-------------------------|
|5-----------5------------|
|4-----------4------------|
|2-----------2------------|


|-------------------------|--------------------------|
|5-----------5------------|5------------5------------|
|5-----------5------------|4------------4------------|
|4-----------4------------|7------------7------------|



|-------------------------|--------------------------|
|7-----------7------------|5------------5------------|
|7-----------7------------|4------------4------------|
|9-----------9------------|7------------7------------|

|
|-------------------------|--------------------------|
|5-----------5------------|5------------7------------|
|5-----------5------------|4------------7------------|
|4-----------4------------|7------------6------------|


|--------------------------|
|5-------------------5-----|
|4-------------------4-----|
|7-------------------2-----|

acousticphd
Oct-03-2005, 1:57pm
Playing backup rhythm can sometimes become blah for the for the mandolin player. #

You've definitely gotta do something to keep it interesting during those 8 minute extended OT jam tunes, I agree.

I tend to use more open 2-finger chords when accompanying OT, a la Norma Blake. #But a variation I like to do every so many repetitions is go to extremely open chord voicings, and try to do something rhythmically similar to the way a celtic-style guitar player plays, sometimes sliding into, or down to the fingering, or sometimes muting the upper strings.

Some examples of chords I like (without trying to notate rhythms)
D tunes
Dmaj/Dmin: # # # #Amaj/Amin: # Amaj: # # # # # # # # G maj:
|----X---- # # # # # # # #|----0---- # # # #|----0---- # # # # # # # |----X----
|----0---- # # # # # # # #|----0---- # # # #|----0---- # # # # # # # |----X----
|----0---- # # # # # # # #|----7---- # # # #|----2---- # # # # # # # |----0----
|----7---- # # # # # # # #|----9---- # # # #|----6---- # # # # # # # |----4----

E, for key of A tunes: # # # # # # G, in A modal/A min tunes:
|----0---- # # # # #|----0---- # # # # # #|----X----
|----0---- # # # # #|----2---- # # # # # #|----0----
|----2---- # # # # #|----6---- # # # # # #|----5----
|----4---- # # # # #|----4---- # # # # # #|----7----

250sc
Oct-04-2005, 7:11am
You could make it swing more like this. It should work over the A and B part.

|x #x #| x #x ##| x #7 #| x #x #|
|5 #9 #| 7 #7 #| 5 #6 #| 7 #7 #|
|7 #7 #| 5 #5 #| 7 #7 #| 6 #5 #|
|4 #8 #| 7 #6 #| 4 #8 #| 7 #6 #|


|x #x #| 3 #2 #| x #x #| x # # |
|5 #5 #| 5 #5 #| 5 #7 #| 5 # # |
|7 #4 #| 2 #3 #| 7 #5 #| 7 # # |
|4 #5 #| 4 #4 #| 4 #6 #| 4 # # |

AlanN
Oct-04-2005, 7:20am
Agree about the need to make it interesting. Voice leading is a good way to do this. I rarley stay on the chop shapes for too long. If you check Dempsey Young, he has a knack for playing non-traditional shapes, yet still keeps the off-beat chop going, driving the band.

Dempsey is cool http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

250sc
Oct-04-2005, 8:04am
I don't really think playing rhythm is boreing or blah. Sometimes playing a chop with no recognizable notes is just what is needed but then when you change that for a verse, chorus or solo you can give the song a real lift. The key is to play the supporting role.

Alan,

Is Dempsey a solo artest or is he with a band?

Tom C
Oct-04-2005, 8:26am
This is a great post. In the TEF files in "Ragtime" field there is one called Ragtime I believe. Great walking stuff for Ragtime Annie.

AlanN
Oct-04-2005, 8:38am
Dempsey is with Lost&Found bg band.

Scotti Adams
Oct-04-2005, 9:51am
..yea..Sammy B. sure looks bored to tears banging out the rhythm http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif Agreed about Dempsey...class act too.

250sc
Oct-04-2005, 11:19am
"..yea..Sammy B. sure looks bored to tears banging out the rhythm "

Yep, it's a real shame he hasn't gotten over that shyness and lack of confidence.

One of the best!

Moose
Oct-04-2005, 1:13pm
I'll tell ya' ONE thing! - I consider myself a decent rhythm guitar player ; but playin' some of those old "reels/jigs" behind a good fiddle player(i.e. "Howdy" Forrester, Paul Warren...& et al.) will DEFINITELY keep you "on-your-toes"!? - AND polish your "chops" - Moose-the-voice-of-experience. http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/mandosmiley.gif http://www.mandolincafe.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

250sc
Oct-04-2005, 1:50pm
Moose,

It's always good to be challanged. Keeps you on your toes and reminds you your still alive.

jim_n_virginia
Oct-06-2005, 6:39am
Might be boring at times but you gotta remember that the mandolin is also the percusion instrument keeping the beat. I have a friend who can jazz up a tune with all kinds of jazz progressions but then sometimes I have trouble keeping to the melody and beat.

When I want to liven things up a little I like to cross pick, but I use it sparingly because I definitely believe the old adage... "less is more"

Pete Martin
Oct-19-2005, 1:34pm
Look under "lessons" in the links at the top of the page for "Texas Style fiddle tune chord progressions".

GBG
Oct-19-2005, 2:01pm
I had the pleasure to meet and hear Jerry Thomasson, Benny's son and Josh Pinkham's grandfather, play backup on tenor guitar at Guthrie this year. Jerry said that he doesn't use that many different chord formations, but he moves them up and down the neck. It seems that same technique could be used for a mandolin. I don't know how it would sound compared to a tenor guitar because I've never heard it and for sure can't play it.

250sc
Oct-19-2005, 2:44pm
GBG,

It's similar on mando. If you learn 4 or so new chord formations you can move them around and play rhythm that swings.

In reality though I find that I use this technique spareingly to spice up a solo or other section of a song. If you do the same thing all the time all the songs tend to sound alike and people tune you out.

If you want to try this, check out the lessons on texas swing here at the cafe.

GBG
Oct-19-2005, 3:44pm
Thanks Greg. I've heard Texas-style backup on 6 string guitars many times and a few times on tenor, but had no idea what they were doing. Some of the old Texas fiddlers actually don't like the the swing-type backup, but most of the big contest fiddlers in Texas use it.

250sc
Oct-20-2005, 10:46am
GBG,

Some bluegrassers don't like it either but I'll toss it in now and then to see what the reaction is. If they don't like it I can play something else. After all it's just one approach to playing.

I have found many mando players kind of intimidated by these 'jazzy' sounding chords but they aren't any harder to play than a chop chord. Worth looking into.