Attic Find

[Will W]

Can't seem to find any info on this.
Belongs to my neighbor's family

Agostinho Silva Mandolin -Fall River, Massachusetts

Any insight would be appreciated

182718

182717

[Bob Visentin]

12 strings! What is the scale length (from nut to bridge)?

[Bob Clark]

Look at the wear marks on the neck. Doesn't it look like it may have been strung in 5 courses, not six? I wish the nut or tailpiece was present so we could see how it was strung.

[MikeEdgerton]

I'd like to see the spacing on the nut as well. It's not a mandolin. I suspect Mr. Silva might have been a retailer selling instruments to a Spanish or Portuguese community. It would be interesting to look back through some city directories at that address. It's old but it looks like the tuners may have been changed at some point. When I blow up the image it looks like it has had some holes filled and new holes drilled. That may be some sort of reflection. It may have been a mix of double and triple courses. One of our world instrument specialists will jump in here, hopefully someone that actually knows what it is. The name on the label doesn't show up in the Mugwumps Encyclopedia of American makers.

There is still a building at that address, age unknown. It looks like a house in the only picture I can find. Fall River was a mill town with several manufacturing companies there. They would have a had a large influx of workers over the years.

[allenhopkins]

Fall River suggests Portuguese rather than Spanish. Perhaps something like this Reverb listing? (https://reverb.com/item/1725092-castanha-antique-portuguese-12-string-mandolin-1800s)

[MikeEdgerton]

The name appears to be Portuguese, there are still people with that last name living in the area and a 60 year old man with the same name living close by in Massachusetts. I'm guessing the instrument is Portugese as well. That should narrow it down a bit.

Alllen beat me to it.

[MikeEdgerton]

I think the Reverb link is a Portuguese guitarra with Preston tuners. I think this might be the same with normal tuners. The nut slots would certainly help us along.

[Will W]

I believe he has the nut and bridge
Will send pictures and measurements

[Joe Dodson]

Man. That poor thing suffered up in that attic.

[DougC]

The neck wear shows 5 worn spots. So it had been played that way (leaving two tuner gears empty) for some time.

[MikeEdgerton]

That's a possibility or maybe there was no money in playing the highest course of strings.

[Cobalt]

Don't the strings protect the fingerboard, leaving the spaces between the strings to become worn? That would indicate all six pairs of strings used, giving five gaps which get worn.

[Graham McDonald]

Without a scale or some measurements it is hard to be sure, but I suspect a guitarra built with standard tuners cause he couldn't get any Preston style tuners in the US.

Cheers

[MikeEdgerton]

Without a scale or some measurements it is hard to be sure, but I suspect a guitarra built with standard tuners cause he couldn't get any Preston style tuners in the US.

Cheers

That's what I think as well. It would make sense.

[Divers]

I happened to be dropping an old mandolin off to be restored this afternoon at Spartan Instruments in Lowell, Massachusetts. While there, our discussion turned to mandolins being made in Massachusetts in the early 1900’s. I brought up this thread, and Chris (of Spartan Instruments) was interested, so I sent him a link and this is what he had to say:


So, this is a Guitara Portuguesa. The tuning machines are not traditional, but it makes sense that the maker working in the USA at the time, probably did not have the traditional machines made in Portugal, but also may have been trying to innovate the instrument, and have it made with standard mandolin tuners.
The work seems to be of good quality, but I am limited by only one photograph. I did not know how to send a message directly to the person inquiring, but feel free to give him my contact information. I would be happy to discuss it with him.

If you would like his contact information, let me know.

[MikeEdgerton]

Well, it looks like that same information was derived earlier as well. :cool:

[pops1]

Man. That poor thing suffered up in that attic.

Looks to me like the string tension broke the top and the neck and block pushed forward. It was most likely sent to the attic because of this, unless it was strung up and sent to the attic and broke there. That is always a possibility, but since it has no strings on I still think that was the reason for banishment to the attic.

[Jim Garber]

You guys beat me to it. Yes, Portuguese guitarra. The only thing I can add is that Fall River had a large population of Portuguese immigrants. I have seen may Portuguese-American luthier labels from that area.