Yet another "starter" question

[Teigyr]

I searched older threads to see if I could find anything that was suited for me. I didn't see it right off and I apologize if this topic has been done to death.

I played piano, cello, and bass (upright and fretless electric). It has been a long time and I have always been intrigued by mandolins. I also like the fact it's somewhat portable vs. being more of a production to idly play it. I want one so I am going to get one. I can read music but not guitar type music, I played classical. I was in a bluegrass band briefly many years ago but that was playing bass so unless I was doing something creative, I generally played one string at a time. I am completely ok with teaching myself what I need to know.

And in that, I need an instrument. I like F holes, am not so much of a fan of the round hole (though I suppose all have sound posts?) and I think I have expensive taste just in what I think looks pretty. I know quality is important - cheap/cheaply made instruments can be torture to play. I also know that since I am new and since I have NO idea how far I will go with this, I'd like to stay under $500 if possible.

With that then, where do I look and what do I look for? I've been looking into used and then cross referencing reviews but I figured you all would know better. Good quality wood and build is important. Pretty is desired but I guess I'd take quality over pretty. Am not so much of a teardrop kind of person - I like the ones that look more classical. I would MUCH rather buy a decent non-vintage used instrument than a new not-so-decent one.

Thank you for any and all advice :)

[Charles E.]

Here is what looks like a good deal in the classifieds........

https://www.mandolincafe.com/ads/125147#125147

Dennis at The Mandolin Store is well thought of here.

The mandolin family does not have sound posts, they are for bowed instruments only.

Good luck with your search and enjoy the mandolin journey.

[Gelsenbury]

Do you have any music shops or festivals near you, where you could try out a few mandolins? As a former bass player, you'll be able to tell quickly what feels right in terms of action, fretboard, size, shape, and so on. If getting a good first mandolin is important to you, this kind of research beats anything you can find on the internet.

The classifieds on this site here can give you an idea of what you can afford on your budget. But I really recommend trying before you buy.

[Chuck Leyda]

F holes or F style?

If it's f holes, I think a Kentucky 250 or 252 would do the job. The Mandolin Store and Elderly Instruments both stock them.

[George R. Lane]

Here are two versions of the Kentucky 253 A style, F hole. These are very good starter instruments and the come with a standard set up. I would suggest you contact Rob Meldrum for his set up instructions. He is a member here on the Café.

https://www.mandolincafe.com/ads/123740#123740

https://www.mandolincafe.com/ads/125343#125343

[Randi Gormley]

There's always the strad-o-lin, which come in various woods at various price points (all used, they don't make them any more) mostly under $400. they have (usually) a pretty chunky neck for a mandolin.

The mandolin has a number of shapes but the major ones are F-style, with a swirl piece on the body top and a couple of points often favored by bluegrass players; A-style, the same instrument without the swirl and points often favored by ITM and old time musicians; 2-points, which have two points on the top of the body; bandolims which don't have swirls or points but do have more depth, generally, in the body than the others already mentioned; solid-body electrics and bowlbacks -- the ones usually featured in old paintings and usually identified by the uninitiated as what Italian music is played on. Bowlbacks and bandolims normally feature oval or circular holes, the rest (barring solid-body emandos) come both as oval hole and f-hole. You can mix and match, generally. some come with truss rods, some don't.

I always figured the true classic mandolin shape is the bowlback because it's oldest. The thinner bodied flattish-backed versions were created in the early 1900s, generally. Generally speaking, you want something out of carved wood as opposed to pressed laminate, but the laminate ones are cheaper and you can get a feel for the instrument with something like the $49 Rogue you can order from Musician's Friend as long as you are willing to get it set up (or do the setup yourself).

Best is being able to play different mandolins before you buy but a lot of times that's not possible. The Cafe sponsors are really good about talking to you on the phone and can play various instruments they have in the shop if they have the time and you have the inclination. Or you can give us an idea where you live and you might be able to talk with a cafe member who can help out as well.

It's a great instrument and you're in for a great time! welcome to the cafe and the mandolin!

[LastMohican]

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[Louise NM]

Actually, no mandolin has a soundpost. They're built more like a guitar than a violin. Instruments with f holes tend to have a more cutting sound, and oval holes have more sustain and a mellower sound.

I bought a Kentucky 272 (oval hole) from The Mandolin Store a month or so ago. The 252 would be the F hole equivalent. $499, including setup, case, and shipping. The instrument is solid wood, nicely made, very clean workmanship. Nice tone, too. A great deal for the price.

[George R. Lane]

<Removed by Moderator>

This getting close to be shut down. No advertising, except in the classifieds.

[multidon]

+1 George! What’s wrong, has everyone forgotten how to send a private message?

Perhaps the moderators will take pity on a newbie who is just trying to learn something here and simply remove the offending post without shutting down the entire thread. That would be throwing out the baby with the bath water, so to speak.

[LastMohican]

This getting close to be shut down. No advertising, except in the classifieds.

Sorry. Didn't realize. I removed the content myself.

[Teigyr]

Hey thank you, all! I'm sorry, I wasn't notified of responses and I came back to check just in case. I didn't know the rules about advertising but I appreciate links and prices just to get a feel for what to expect. I did learn the difference between f hole and f style, I like the f hole, I don't really need the whole f style experience. I guess, too, I need to learn the difference between what I want visually and how it plays/sounds.

That is good to know about sound posts, for whatever reason I guess I just assumed hollow instruments would have them. (fwiw not having them is a selling point, I have an inop cello due to a sound post falling and I haven't gotten around to getting it fixed.)

There are some stores that have them around here, I'll go check around. I just wanted to be armed with as much knowledge as possible. I'm not used to frets, the last time I tried to play an instrument with frets there was a lot of unpleasant amp noise. I'm used to on the note, not before the note! But with a new instrument I'm sure I can relearn that habit. It was my understanding that it is tuned in 5ths but is it ever tuned in 4ths? I am seeing some talk about that.

It seems to be a very complex instrument just due to all the variations, I think this will be a fun learning experience. Thank you all again, onwards to research!

[Charles E.]

Mandolins are most always tuned in fifths unless one chooses an open tuning as would be used for old time music. An example of an open tuning would be G-D-G-D. I have never heard of a mandolin being tuned in fourths.

Since you have played cello, the mandola is tuned C-G-D-A and is comparable to the viola in the classical world.

[Br1ck]

Be advised you can get a better mandolin in an A style. There is no sonic difference that can be attributed to one or the other. Also if you've read more than two or three threads or gone on a dealer's website, you know you are shopping the lower range of price, but the good news is that lower priced mandolins have never been better.

An often recommended mandolin is the Kentucky KM 150. The higher the number from there the better the cosmetics. Eastman and Loar are good too, the salient point is to buy one with all solid wood. I will always recommend buying a first instrument from a dealer who sets them up for you. Most cafe sponsors do. An ill fitting bridge will rob tone.

[LadysSolo]

As a musician already, you will (probably) quickly decide you want a better instrument than your starter mandolin. Then you will get to have the delightful experience of MAS (Mandolin Acquisition Syndrome.) But you DO need to experience a starter mandolin to help you decide what you want in your more advanced mandolin. Enjoy your journey, just never expect any of us to discourage you from getting another mandolin!

[allenhopkins]

...I did learn the difference between f hole and f style, I like the f hole, I don't really need the whole f style experience. I guess, too, I need to learn the difference between what I want visually and how it plays/sounds....There are some stores that have them around here, I'll go check around. I just wanted to be armed with as much knowledge as possible. I'm not used to frets, the last time I tried to play an instrument with frets there was a lot of unpleasant amp noise. I'm used to on the note, not before the note! But with a new instrument I'm sure I can relearn that habit. It was my understanding that it is tuned in 5ths but is it ever tuned in 4ths? I am seeing some talk about that. It seems to be a very complex instrument just due to all the variations, I think this will be a fun learning experience. Thank you all again, onwards to research!

Playing cello, you know about fifths tuning. Frets do take getting used to; as you say, you stop the string just "above" the fret, not actually on the note you want to play, as you would on a fretless instrument.

Some suggestions:

Make sure you get solid wood, not plywood, especially for the instrument's top
Carved top and back are better than heat-pressed. Read the instrument's specifications; if they don't say "solid top, back and sides," assume plywood. If they don't say "carved" ("hand-carved" is even better), assume heat-pressed.
You don't have to get a carved-top instrument, but if you're looking for f-holes, almost all f-hole instruments have an arched top, preferably carved.
The A-model ("teardrop") body shape gives you more acoustic "bang for your buck," since the body points and scroll of the F-model add cost to production, without significant benefit in terms of sound.

If you tell us where you're located, we perhaps could suggest some dealers with which some of us have experience.