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grandmainger
Jul-15-2005, 10:42am
I'm currently working on my chop chords, which I've completely neglected for a long time. I find it quite tricky to switch between G and D if I use 4 fingers chords.

I was wondering which chord people here use most to play the D chop in a bluegrass setting. Do you stick to the standard 4 fingers one, or do you use a 3 fingers one?

Germain

PS: great new section

earthsave
Jul-15-2005, 10:49am
It depends on where you are at in a tune and the chord progression of the tune. #I find myself using the 3 finger D chop most often. #But for a tune in G, I will use the 4-finger G and D when the progression goes from G to D, but not from C to D.

Another way to think of it is to say when as tune changes from a I to a V, when the I is the 4 fingered G-shaped chord.

Chip Booth
Jul-15-2005, 11:11am
I sometimes use the four D like Scot mentioned above, but most often use the three finger D: 2cnd course 5th fret, 3rd course 4th fret, 4th course 7th fret. There are others I use as well depending on the song, placement, and sound I want from a particular inversion, but that's the go-to chord for me.

Chip

Mando4Life
Jul-15-2005, 11:18am
I use the 3 finger D using my middle, ring, and pinky fingers. Its a bit tricky to get used to the switches but after some practice, for me, it's the easiest way to move around the I-IV-V in both G and A keys.

WBL

Greg H.
Jul-15-2005, 11:28am
In chop chords I'm not sure how much it matters whether you use a 3 finger D or a 4 finger D as the high E is generally not included in the chop (at least the way I learned to play them). Another (3 finger) alternative would be to voice it with the 5th in the bottom (i.e. 1st finger 2nd fret 4th string, 2nd finger 4th fret 3rd string, 3rd finger 5th fret 2nd string). That gives it a decidedly different tone and can relieve some finger stress by putting them in a different position.

sunburst
Jul-15-2005, 12:41pm
I have no business posting here, because I'm not much of a mandolin player, but I used to be a drummer, so I can keep time with chop chords on the mandolin, even if my breaks are...well...never mind...

I use both positions (three finger or four finger) depending on which one gets me to the D with the least movement of my left hand.
In other words, I can go from the G to the four finger D without moving, and I can go from the C to the three finger D without moving. Of coarse, I have to move my left hand sometime in order to play all the chords in a song or tune, so that isn't a hard and fast rule.

The main reason for this post, though, is about using all four strings in chop chords.
Greg mentioned that he was taught to generally chop only three strings. I find that some mandolins sound better chopped that way, while others sound better chopped using all four strings. I think it has to do with string-to-string balance in the mandolin among other things.
I also think that better mandolins sound better with all four strings chopped. As a builder, I base this opinion on the fact that my earlier mandolins seemed to sound best chopped with only three strings, and my later ones sound better using all four.

Anyone else have similar experiences where different mandolins lead you to different techniques?

AlanN
Jul-15-2005, 1:00pm
There are more D chord shapes than just 7452 and 745

20
2002
245
2452
7752
77910
14,12,9,10

I use 'em all

picksnbits
Jul-15-2005, 1:42pm
I usually do 7452 or maybe 14,12,9,10. Seems like lots of folks get good results with nothing but 3-fingered chop chords, though.

I've been playing around with a hybrid-chop when playing in D. Let the D string ring open and sometimes the A as well and do a little or a lot of vamping on the strings you are fretting. The D string becomes a drone and you can let it ring through the I IV and V chords. That works out to be either 7052, 7002, or sometimes x,0,9,10(G muted with thumb). I think that's the right fretting, I don't have my mando with me so I'm relying on Alan's post above.

A bit more on topic, when switching between 4-fingered G and D I'm pretty sure my pinky stays glued to the fret-board which I think makes it easier.

John S
Jul-15-2005, 1:43pm
Here's a tip that seems to help for switching between G & D chop chords (7-5-2-3 and 7-4-5-2), or any I-V changes using these same chord forms. Keep your pinky down on the G string while switching your other fingers. Your mileage may vary, but it helps me.

OdnamNool
Jul-16-2005, 1:30am
Well, I probably shouldn't post here either, because I don't play bluegrass at all. So, maybe I'm outta line here within the bluegrass etiquette, I really don't know... But the chord progression that I would use would be 7-5-2-3 onto a barred chord in the second fret: 2-4-5-2. At least that's easiest for me...

mandroid
Jul-16-2005, 11:07pm
for movable chord forms; 2455 DMaj > 2355 d-(m) 'cause then A, 2245 [2235 A-] is nextdoor, E, just the 2 frets up.
then <[]> theres , inversions, the tonic note has 3 places to be, bottom, top ,or middle.
but, we were on favorites.

Doug Edwards
Jul-17-2005, 9:42pm
I'm with sunburst. I do like the sound of the 4 finger chop chord but rarely use it from C to D. With the problems I'm starting to have with my hands, it may soon be open tuning and bar chords.

Carlos Gomes SJK-SP
Nov-19-2012, 11:17am
Hello Colleagues

Concerning the chop chord description using the fret number system, D chop chord form (7452 or 7-4-5-2) means: 4th course 7th fret, 3rd course 4th fret, 2cnd course 5th fret, and 1rst course 2cnd fret.

Analogously, it seems correct to assume: 745 = 7-4-5-X (it is 3-string chop chord for D form - without 1rst string course). However I can not understand the following chop chords: 14,12,9,10 and 20?

Could someone help me to understand these chop chords? (.. maybe using chord diagrams..) Thanks in advance !!!

Musical Regards,

Carlos Gomes SJK-SP

AlanN
Nov-19-2012, 11:25am
However I can not understand the following chop chords: 14,12,9,10 and 20?

Dang, that be my post from Ages And Ages Ago...in D, incidentally

the first one is the G chop shape (7523), but go north 7 frets. The second is simply 2-0 (A and D).

Carlos Gomes SJK-SP
Nov-19-2012, 11:58am
Hi ALan, Tks for prompt reply !!

Musical Regards

Carlos Gomes SJK-SP

AlanN
Nov-19-2012, 12:52pm
Seems I may be muddying the waters here:

14-12-9-10 is

fret 14 of G string with pinky
fret 12 of D string with ring finger
fret 9 of A string with index finger
fret 10 of E string with middle finger

and 2-0 is

fret 2 of G string with index finger
open D string
don't play A and E strings

Carlos Gomes SJK-SP
Nov-19-2012, 1:21pm
AlanN,

Thanks very much for your detailed explanation ! Additional information about chop chord variations is available on this website: http://www.freeguitarvideos.com/mandolin/lessons/basic-chop-chords.html

Best Wishes

Carlos Gomes SJK-SP

greg_tsam
Nov-19-2012, 1:54pm
There are more D chord shapes than just 7452 and 745

20
2002
245
2452
7752
77910
14,12,9,10

I use 'em all

I'm with Alan. I try to use different variations depending on mood, song, other's in the circle playing the same thing and where I might have left off during a lead.

SGraham
Nov-19-2012, 9:29pm
I also think that better mandolins sound better with all four strings chopped. As a builder, I base this opinion on the fact that my earlier mandolins seemed to sound best chopped with only three strings, and my later ones sound better using all four.

Anyone else have similar experiences where different mandolins lead you to different techniques?


I've noticed this too. Having recently switched from an Eastman 615 to a '99 Flatiron Festival, the difference is still quite noticeable to me when I'm doing the 4-finger D chop chord. On the 615 (which I really liked) I couldn't hear much difference between the 3 and 4-finger chords. On the Flatiron, however, the 4-finger chop sounds much brighter and more percussive. The 3-finger chop sounds darker. I like them both. Among other variations, I'll use the 3-finger when backing up guitar and switch to the 4-finger when backing up banjo.

mandroid
Nov-20-2012, 7:16pm
Of course RH palm mute at the bridge end, chops anything you can finger with your left, short.

Mike Bunting
Nov-20-2012, 7:31pm
Of course RH palm mute at the bridge end, chops anything you can finger with your left, short.
Disagree.

rico mando
Nov-20-2012, 9:28pm
I use the 245 D also and the 2245 A as well as the other shapes . I never do 523 to 7523 though

ralph johansson
Nov-21-2012, 5:39am
Of course RH palm mute at the bridge end, chops anything you can finger with your left, short.

of course not.

AlanN
Nov-21-2012, 7:20am
Yeah, I don't do that either. When I want to 'chop' a voicing with open strings, I flag down fingers 3 and 4 in tempo as my mute.

kymandolin29
Nov-23-2012, 11:56am
butch bald talked yrs ago at a workshop about 2 finger chop chords ...he was advocating this in a setting of long all nite jamms or extended festival jamming ...when your hands get tired go to the 2 finger chop chords...
i use this a lot before my hands start to tire out so it helps me to jamm longer.... mr

greg_tsam
Nov-24-2012, 5:54am
I have been known to shape the chord and completely mute it and just simply lay my fingers across the strings and play percussion. I don't do that very long though and like to hear some voicing. I switch it up. I like variety. Persona preferences leads to your own style anyway so do what suits you.

Darren Bailey
Nov-24-2012, 7:22am
I tend to go with Burtch's advice. With other instruments going the overall sound is too loud to worry too much about the subtleties of a muted chop chord - and after an hour or so I want to still be able to hold a spoon with my left hand.