Collings history

[Br1ck]

Is it true that Collings started building mandolins during the guitar downturn when synths ruled the pop music scene? That they needed the extra instrument output to keep their workers working?

If so, what an interesting course of events.

[Svea]

I never heard that. But I did hear that they started making ukes to keep things going at some point. Someone correct me if that's way off.

Svea

[Mando Mort]

According to the "Our Story" section of their website, they began making mandolins in 1999. That was not a particularly "Synth" period in music. It was not long before the "Brother, Where Art Thou?" era.

[yankees1]

Well, Bill Collings began his Austin building days in the shop of Tom Ellis ! I believe that Tom mentored Bill in the early days and helped him get started and refine his craft ! Tom must have been a great teacher ! :)

[Mandobar]

According to the "Our Story" section of their website, they began making mandolins in 1999. That was not a particularly "Synth" period in music. It was not long before the "Brother, Where Art Thou?" era.

Just as bands like Nickel Creek were emerging. Mandolin began to become more popular, and the choices were abysmal. The same for ukuleles (with Jake and Victoria Vox) although the uke scene seems to have cooled off a bit. Making used allowed Collings to use some nice wood they had or could buy that was too small to make guitars from.

[mcgroup53]

And in one of my interviews with him, Bill Collings told me he had made "dozens of dollars" building ukes.

[Mandolin Cafe]

Is it true that Collings started building mandolins during the guitar downturn when synths ruled the pop music scene? That they needed the extra instrument output to keep their workers working?

If so, what an interesting course of events.


... But I did hear that they started making ukes to keep things going at some point. Someone correct me if that's way off.

Svea

No. And no.

[MikeEdgerton]

Amazingly enough ukes saved the CF Martin Company back in the early 1900's. I'm assuming that's where that came from. Bill seemed to build what interested him (and that apparently wasn't just musical instruments). I don't think he really cared much about what else was happening. We should all live our lives that well.

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/07/28/business/obituary-bill-collings-dead-guitars.html

[Mandobar]

Bill made more than 50 concert-sized ukuleles before putting them into production. The man was relentless in pursuit of making quality and well made instruments, and the company is determined to continue that process.

[Svea]

Yes, I was thinking of Martin's uke story!

Svea

[JEStanek]

See volume 1 issue 3 of the Fretboard Journal.

[ccravens]

Considering Bill's standards and the quality with which they do anything they do, that rumor sounds insulting to me, and should not be repeated.

[Caleb]

I wonder what happened to all the prototype instruments (mandolins, ukes, etc) that were made before the finished products hit the stores? Would be neat to see how they progressed, etc.

[Mandobar]

The prototypes were sold through their dealers.

[Tom Sanderson]

I have some questions for the Collings “experts” here. 1. What is the date of the first Collings mandolin? 2. What were the first mandolins called (MT, MT1) or ? 3. If anyone here has a prototype or an very early production one, will you please post some pictures?
Thanks

[mandroid]

Short?

[Mark Gunter]

I wonder what happened to all the prototype instruments (mandolins, ukes, etc) that were made before the finished products hit the stores? Would be neat to see how they progressed, etc.


If anyone here has a prototype or an very early production one, will you please post some pictures?

This is a fascinating concept, it would be interesting to see prototype instruments that didn't make it to retail outlets.

I met a guy at the Pearl Texas bluegrass jam two years ago who was playing an Ellis, I asked him about it and he let me play it - a well-worn, great sounding instrument. He said that Tom had pulled it out of a closet and given it to him when he needed a mandolin. It was a prototype instrument and one of several that Tom had kept at home and used, evidently. I got to play that instrument, but didn't get a photo and don't remember the guy's name. He told me that he had been Sarah Jarosz' music teacher when she was a child. Just a good old musician from the Austin area.

When you think about it, many of the really good luthiers are bound to have good instruments lying around that for one reason or another they felt were not suitable for the market. There are probably quite a few out there that are serviceable instruments with a quirky history. If anyone has a Collings with a "special" story, would be great to hear it and see it.

[Br1ck]

I can see where someone striving for a signature tone would not want a bunch of development prototypes out in the world. Someone would play one thinking that was the tone of the final product.

[Caleb]

Br1ck,
My thoughts exactly. Makes me wonder if the early efforts don’t often get destroyed or at least not labeled.

[Jim Hilburn]

Things I know about Collings mandolins.
They brought in Mike Kemnitzer as a consultant to help get the details right. Mike said after that experience he had to get one of those CNC machines.
The first year or two of the A models up to about the time the F's were rolled out had the tonebars reversed from what is normal due to a mis-reading of the print. Were you looking at the print from the back or from the top?

[Tom Sanderson]

Things I know about Collings mandolins.
They brought in Mike Kemnitzer as a consultant to help get the details right. Mike said after that experience he had to get one of those CNC machines.
The first year or two of the A models up to about the time the F's were rolled out had the tonebars reversed from what is normal due to a mis-reading of the print. Were you looking at the print from the back or from the top?

I owned #15 for a while and I was told that the tone bars were reversed. Is there an easy way to tell if they are installed correctly, or reversed? How do reversed bars affect tone?

[Mandobar]

Will Kimble spent a lot of time with Bill Collings developing their mandolin line.

[Jim Hilburn]

The bass bar would be closer to the bass f-hole. When I look in the bass side f-hole on mine I can barely see the bar but not on the treble. Or you can stick your finger in your f-hole.

[Tom Sanderson]

Will Kimble spent a lot of time with Bill Collings developing their mandolin line.

What did he contribute? When in the timeline was he involved?

[ColdBeerGoCubs]

What did he contribute? When in the timeline was he involved?

https://www.mandolincafe.com/forum/showthread.php?106768-Collings-love&p=1296914&viewfull=1#post1296914

[Mandobar]

Tom, I think Will was involved around the time Collings started offering varnished mandolins. I owned MT2 #67 for a while, which was lacquer. These early models had very tiny necks. Somewhere around 2004 the neck profiles started filling out. It might be around the time Alex Rueb joined the Collings team. Alex is a very talented mandolin player.

[Will Kimble]

Looks like my contribution to Collings is being exaggerated once again. I loved Bill Collings and was fortunate to talk about instruments with him a couple times - spirited discussions. He was initially skeptical about varnish on mandolins, and the first time I met him we talked about varnish at length. Not in terms of materials, but in terms of sound. This resulted in me ordering a varnish guitar from him - a D1A, the very first one. I had no input in his approach to building mandolins, and my impression was that he was more influenced by Gilchrist and Nugget than anything else. In fact, I distinctly remember saying to Bill "the main difference between me and you is I like Loar mandolins and you don't." We had quite a laugh about that. I did trade one of my two points for the varnish D1A, so perhaps it had some subtle influence over the years - Alex told me it was in the shop somewhere and got played regularly. I also may have had some small influence on how they mount their pickguards, I remember telling Steve they would need them for the varnish models. He said Bill hated pickguards, and I told him the varnish would get tore up from fingernails. Got an email from Steve after a big show (NAMM or IBMA), he said you were right - the varnish got tore up and they were gonna have to put pickguards on the varnish mandolins. He asked me to send pics of how I mount pickguards, and I happily obliged. He said it gave them a "rough" starting point, lol. One final unknown connection - I built a chambered body Les Paul out of mahogany around the time Bill was starting to develop the electrics. They were trying out different pickups and I recommended Jason Lollar to Steve McCreary. Might have happened anyway, but I think I opened the door for that relationship.

[Will Kimble]

I haven't thought of these things in a while, but I had a clear memory a few moments ago. While talking to Bill about varnish, I told him I thought it was essential when you are using the really hard maple for backs. He said they had quit using hard maple for backs, that it was too crunchy and bright. He also told me he had fought for a brighter sound for years with his guitars and he wasn't going to fight that battle with mandolins. I told him part of what he was hearing was the lacquer, and that the softer, less constrictive varnish finish would smooth out and warm up the hard maple. He got what I was saying right away and was really excited about it.

It is important to note that I talked to him about varnish after he had been resistant and skeptical for a while, but he also had been using it and was beginning to hear the differences. In other words, it was on his mind and my opinions were timely in terms of Bill forming his OWN opinions. And Bill had very strong opinions, lol!

[Mandobar]

Will, you downplay your assistance and your influence way too much. There have been a lot of influencing forces at Collings, yourself included.

[Tom Sanderson]

What are the very first Collings mandolins called (MT1?).