View Full Version : Harmonica Help,.. sorry, NMC
soliver
Oct-14-2016, 12:59pm
Hey gang, my kids have been taking Harmonica lessons from a GREAT teacher who unfortunately is no longer available. He suggested that anyone with any musical experience and a basic understanding of the Harmonica could teach them what he was teaching them. That being said, I am considering teaching them myself.
My father in law being the gracious benefactor that he is is also willing to help with the purchase of a full range of harps as well!
I know only a very very little about the Harmonica but am willing to learn more to keep one step ahead of them so I can teach them. Can anyone recommend some good resources? Books? Online? etc????
Many thanks in advance!
tiltman
Oct-14-2016, 2:21pm
I've just started exploring the harmonica myself - learning and teaching my daughter (9 yrs old) at the same time.
I'm using "Harmonica For The Musically Hopeless" book - comes with a cd. So far I think that it's pretty good - should get us well on our way.
Good luck!
Kirk Miller
Portland, OR
Bruce Cech
Oct-14-2016, 2:36pm
Looking around awhile back, I found several people recommended the Hohner Special 20 as a good starter. Can't remember what I paid for it but it seemed like a mid-range price. Also purchased a book "Harmonica Americana" by Jon Gindick. Gave a little history, how to choose, care and maintenance and got very quickly into making music.
Kris N
Oct-14-2016, 2:47pm
When I started to learn the harmonica last year, I went through a bunch of different websites before settling on one. Each has something to offer.
I ended up working through most of the YouTube videos by a guy named Tom. It's chuck full of lessons. I'd give that a try:
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCaz0ZvY3bqW8vTINyORiYPQ
Are you playing cross harp or straight harp, there is a difference in the two and you use different harps to play in the same key. A G harp to play in G for straight harp and a G harp to play in D for cross harp. Straight harp is 1 blow 4 draw and 5 blow, cross is 1 draw, 4 blow and 5 draw. You can only bend the draw notes so cross is used for blues, straight is more melody oriented so works well for folk styles. Playing along with some one on guitar slowly and experiment, it's fun and you can learn quite a lot. Find your scales with the root straight hole 4 blow is the start of the scale, cross use hole 2 draw to start and don't worry about a scale just improvise.
Hany Hayek
Oct-14-2016, 3:48pm
I suggest you get them a chromatic harmonica. Check with this forum:
http://www.slidemeister.com/forums/
A twelve holes chromatic harmonica should be great.
The disadvantages I found to the harmonica it needs a lot of cleaning and caring. It is also expensive
mandroid
Oct-14-2016, 4:23pm
Yes , The Chromatic means just one for playing all keys Minor and major ,,
http://www.tootsthielemans.com/ Jazz player on these things
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yKnG_9q4crA
mandroid
Oct-14-2016, 5:11pm
Another set :
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rQFvpDptc7c
allenhopkins
Oct-14-2016, 5:15pm
I teach harmonica from time to time; here are my suggestions:
1. The basic harmonica is the ten-hole diatonic, which comes in a variety of keys. "Diatonic" means it doesn't have all the notes of, say, a mandolin or a piano. This is the one I would recommend starting with.
2. There are many acceptable Asian-made harmonicas that are inexpensive. Here, for example, is a "Jambone" (http://www.musiciansfriend.com/folk-traditional-instruments/jambone-harmonica) for seven bucks at Musician's Friend. I have found acceptable student instruments for as low as $2-3.50. The Hohner harmonicas on which I learned -- Marine Band, Blues Harp, Special 20, Golden Melody -- are now all $30 and up; you can spend that much if you want, but it's not necessary.
3. You can download a Harmonica For Dummies e-book (http://www.ebook777.com/harmonica-dummies-2nd-edition/) for free. I've not used this particular teaching method (I think the one I used to use for teaching was something like "Harmonica For the Musically Hopeless"), but from my experience, most methods are pretty similar.
4. Starting to play the harmonica, you usually learn "straight harp" or "first position." This involves playing melodies in the key that's written on the harp: e.g., you buy a ten-hole diatonic harmonica in the key of C, you learn to play Mary Had a Little Lamb (my favorite beginner song), the C major scale, etc., in the key of C.
5. If you progress to playing "blues harp," you learn how to play in the "5 chord" or dominant chord, which in the case of a C harmonica, would be the key of G.
6. Advanced techniques, like tremolo, vibrato, note bending etc., come with further experience and practice.
I've probably played and recorded with harmonica more than any other single instrument, which is weird considering my journeyman level technique. It's a great instrument, not hard to learn, portable and user-friendly. Good luck.
Folkmusician.com
Oct-14-2016, 5:40pm
Allen is right..
The upper range Hohner's and Lee Oskar Harps are great, but many of the lower prices harmonicas are just fine to learn with. Harmonicas need to be replaced now and then as well, making that $30+ even more painful!
If you do decide to get a Chromatic Harmonica, then it is a good idea to get an expensive version. :)
Mark Gunter
Oct-14-2016, 5:57pm
As a teen, I used Hohner Marine Band and Blues Harps in various keys, as well as a nice chromatic. The chromatic harmonica is fine if you intend to use both hands with your harp. I preferred the blues harp around my neck while accompanying with guitar.
That was a good long while ago, and recently I decided to use the harmonica again, and only had a couple harps left from the good old days, so I bought a full set of the plastic Hohner Piedmont Blues harps for about $20.00 from Best Buy. You can get such a set for $20 - $30 around the web, and I would think they'd be fine for beginners to learn with.
150314
Petrus
Oct-14-2016, 6:31pm
I bought one of those multi-sets in the zippered case a while back and found to my disappointment that several of the harmonicas simply would not blow at all. Maybe I just got a bad batch, but overall they just seemed very cheezily constructed. Then again, they're cheap (~$20) so if only 5 out of 7 function you're still getting a good deal.
Luckily, many years ago I inherited a wonderful Hohner Comet from a relative and it's a joy to play around with. Looks fantastic too. I believe it's chromatic but I don't know that much about harmonicas (it doesn't have the little plunger button.) Maybe allenhopkins can opine as to its utility or lack thereof. Not sure if they still make 'em.
150315
soliver
Oct-14-2016, 7:06pm
Thanks everyone!... I'm not as concerned yet about which harps to get. I'm pretty sure I'll end up with a set of Hohners.... I like the Marine Band's but I have a Lee Oskar C harp that I like. I'm mostly wanting to know about good teaching resources, so that I can stay one step ahead of the girls... Allen I really appreciate your in depth response, it was very helpful, as were all of your responses.
I definitely agree in the simplicity, portability etc of the harmonica and think it will be great for the girls. One is already a guitarist and another is a violinist, the third is only playing the harmonica, but I'm thinking of introducing her to the Uke eventually.
Ron McMillan
Oct-14-2016, 11:39pm
Jon Gindick (http://gindick.myshopify.com/) has been at the sharp end of harmonica instruction for decades. I started with his book and cassette tape more than 25 years ago. He has a lot of YouTube clips and a range of books (and instructional camps).
derbex
Oct-15-2016, 5:21am
You might want to look at the Harmonica Club site (http://www.harmonicaclub.com/) or there is slidemeister (http://www.slidemeister.org/) if you want to play chromatic.
I have used the Harmonica for Dummies book and like it. For online I like Tomlin Leckie's lessons (http://tomlinharmonicalessons.com) and Aristworks do a set by Howard Levy.
ferrousgeek
Oct-15-2016, 6:36am
Haven't seen them mentioned so I will do so. The last five harps I have purchase have been Suzuki. The Bluesmaster and Harpmaster are the same pricepoint as the Hohner Special 20. I feel the build quality and consistency of the Suzuki models (hand made and tuned in Japan) surpasses those currently being built by Hohner and certainly Lee Oskar. I've never had to tune a Suzuki out of the box. I gave up on Lee Oskar long ago. Every Lee Oskar I've purchased required excessive work out of the box to make them play and I had one I just could not make playable at all. I still like Hohners, but usually need to do a little tweaking to get them up to spec.
There are several harmonica forums you can Google that have all the info you will ever need.
multidon
Oct-15-2016, 7:58am
Petrus- that Comet is not chromatic. They have doubled rows of holes because they are octave harmonicas. You play them just like a diatonic but each note is doubled on the octave. Like playing 2 harmonicas at the same time, or sort of like a 12 string guitar in a way. The double sided ones like yours can be flipped for 2 different keys in one instrument. C and G are the usual combination I believe, but there may be others I am not aware of. Keys would be stamped into the metal of the top plate. Good score! That is over 200 dollars brand new.
I had a true chromatic many years ago and found mine (a high quality Hohner) very problematic. You see, in order to get two chromatic notes on a single hole, there are little flaps made of very thin plastic attached to the reed plates. When you blow, or draw, the plastic flaps are designed to close against the reed you are not playing. Eventually, from the fatigue caused by the constant flexing, the plastic flaps eventually break and fall out. Then, without the flaps, you get both notes simultaneously, usually a very unpleasant discordant half step apart. I found web sites with directions on how to repair this problem but was not successful and I finally came to the conclusion that it was toast. It's a lot of money to spend on something that is doomed by its very design to self destruct sooner or later.
allenhopkins
Oct-15-2016, 11:34am
...Harmonicas need to be replaced now and then as well, making that $30+ even more painful!...
One reason I now use the Lee Oskars: you can replace the reed plates (http://www.musiciansfriend.com/folk-traditional-instruments/lee-oskar-major-diatonic-reed-plates?rNtt=lee%20oskar%20reed%20plates&index=1) without buying a whole new instrument.
Saves you about 50% of the price.
When I started playing harmonica 50± years ago, Hohner Marine Bands were $3, Blues Harps $3.25. Of course, there's inflation to be figured in, but using the on-line calculator, the Marine Bands should cost $23, not $43. Plus I think Hohner's making them in Asia; you pay extra for a German-made harmonica. Exchange rates, maybe?
The Lee Oskars are also Asian-made, but they seem pretty good quality, and I've got a stock of key-of-D reed plates, since I wear out my D harps on a regular basis.
soliver
Oct-15-2016, 3:00pm
I was looking at the partial sets of Hohners. Amazon has a set of 5 Marine Bands or 5 Special 20's with a case in the $175 range. Obviously it's a savings over buying them piece meal. Any thoughts?
What is the difference in the 2?... I'm not so interested in blues as I am in playing stuff like I do on my mando; a lot of Old time, Irish and some BG. Suggestions?
bassthumper
Oct-15-2016, 4:21pm
Elderly has several Harp tab books that are excellant... I'm currently going through a 'fiddle tunes book... excellant but not for beginners..
I recently pulled the trigger on a Hohner Crossover in A and a Seydel 1847 in C... now I can't wait to wear out my others to justify more 1847s... the initial cost should'nt scare you as they last so much longer but once played in thry sound heavenly..
I still have'nt tried a Special 20 but IMO the Marine Band is THE starting point to work through the basics and the Blues Harp a great next step for that bending...
soliver
Oct-15-2016, 4:57pm
I'm realizing something that may not have been already communicated... My girls have already been taking lessons so all of them already have Harmonicas... each has some versions or another of a Hohner C harp, one of my daughters also has G and F harps as well. I'm not concerned about which harps they get since they already have them... I, myself need a set to learn on in order to teach them, and I would like something decent but not too terribly spendy.
Thanks for all the recommendations on books and such!
allenhopkins
Oct-15-2016, 9:06pm
I was looking at the partial sets of Hohners. Amazon has a set of 5 Marine Bands or 5 Special 20's with a case in the $175 range. Obviously it's a savings over buying them piece meal. Any thoughts? What is the difference in the 2?... I'm not so interested in blues as I am in playing stuff like I do on my mando; a lot of Old time, Irish and some BG. Suggestions?
The main difference between Marine Band and Special 20 is that the "comb," the perforated central part to which the reed plates are attached, then covered with the two outside plates, is made of different materials in each model (at least it was when I was still buying Hohners). In the Marine Band it's wooden, in the Special 20 plastic.
I would recommend plastic (Special 20), because its comb doesn't absorb moisture from your saliva. The moisture can cause the wooden "dividers" between the holes to swell just a bit, which makes corners protrude. This can be uncomfortable as you slide the harmonica back and forth across your lips -- I once likened it to "kissing a wood rasp," which is a bit extreme, but I've experienced some sharp corners against my lips from wooden combs, on the Marine Band and Blues Harp. (Parenthetically, the Lee Oskars I'm using now have plastic combs.)
With regard to your "needing a set to teach [your daughters], something decent but not terribly spendy," the real question is, how serious are you about playing harmonica? Do you need a performance-quality instrument, or just one to give a lesson now and then? You can get a set of seven student-quality Hohner Blues Band harps (http://www.musiciansfriend.com/folk-traditional-instruments/hohner-blues-band-7-piece-harmonica-set-1501?pfm=item_page.rr1?pfm=ac-a) for 40 bucks. If I were just going get a set for occasional play and teaching -- you say you don't yet play yourself, but want to learn in order to teach your kids -- I'd spend the lesser amount, see if I wanted to "get serious" on harmonica, and, if so, start investing in better instruments.
If you want to go with the better-quality Hohners, I'd get the Special 20's, but perhaps just individual instruments in the keys your daughters have, rather than a whole set. Not to discourage you from "going first class," but if you're playing "old time, Irish and BG," you won't get much use out that E harmonica.
soliver
Oct-15-2016, 10:33pm
Thanks Allen, ever since the girls started playing them and I started noodling with one, I've been considering getting more serious about playing them. Given the opportunity to use it as a teaching experience for the girls, it seems like all the more reason to actually GET serious. On top of that, my father in law is offering to foot the expense of the gear. All of that is to say, I think it might be worth my while to "go all out"... but within reason of course. If they are good quality instruments (that will last and stand the tests of time) and the set of 5 for $180 is a decent price that he is ok with spending, it seems all the more reasonable to me.... I am also of course planning to consult with their former teacher.
catmandu2
Oct-15-2016, 11:27pm
I love free reeds - theyre fun and addicting. Fwiw the 10-hole diatonic mouthie is essentially equivalent to the 10-button diatonic squeezebox (albeit minus a few buttons here an there) - the reed mechanisms are essentially the same among harmonicas/boxes (my addiction started with mouthies and went to boxes - great fun). After familiarity with a 'mouthie' you can transfer that right to the box and the hands. Bi-sonoric free reeds impart such bounce to the music - https://youtu.be/fswwgc2ev3U
Spencer, if you plan on teaching them any blues or cross-harp, then there are basically few better resources than Adam Gussow's channel on YouTube. I've played for over 30 years, but have still learned a lot from his lessons. He is relatable, goes step by step and breaks things down.
If there is one problem with my suggestion, it's the volume of his works- can make it a little difficult to find the right stuff.
You can also find him by searching Modern Blues Harmonica.
keithb
Oct-16-2016, 11:05am
I wrote a (very) brief guide to harmonica here: https://medium.com/@keithbarrette/basic-harmonica-for-guitarists-6a8376679b2a - it's rudimentary, but it might help anyone interested in exploring the instrument.
I'm not much of a harp player, but I agree that Adam Gussow is a fantastic resource.
soliver
Oct-20-2016, 7:42pm
Just an update on where I'm at on this:
First of all, thanks so much everyone for all the advice.
So here is the status... I had a nice long chat with the guy who was teaching the girls previously and he gave me some recommendations on direction and teaching strategy etc. He also said that any harmonica that costed in the $20 and under range would not be satisfactory and also like some of you said that harps (like the Marine Bands) with a wooden comb would swell and be uncomfortable to play. He said that anything he spent $30 on up was worthwhile so I decided that it would be best if I tried out a few different kinds of harps to see what I liked rather than buying a whole set of something that I had not tried. Since I already had a Lee Oskar C harp, he recommended also getting G, D, and E harps too. So I have ordered from Amazon a Special 20 In G, a Golden Melody in E (one of my daughters has one of these) and a Big River in D. Also ordered a case to carry all of them plus 3 more to be determined in the future. I also ordered a copy of Harmonica for Dummies as well. I'll do my best to keep you all updated.
Thanks again!
I found out many years ago when I changed from Honer to Lee Oscar that it was different to play. The swell of the cover is much different and feels different in the mouth. When you get your harps check this out and if you continue on try to get all the same brand, or at least brands that feel the same in the mouth. I like to be able to rebuild the Lee Oscar and I also like they have minor harps.
McIrish
Oct-21-2016, 9:20am
We have used harmonica in a number of songs we recorded over the years. Special 20 is pretty good but seem to get over-blown quickly. We found the Blues Harp to last much longer. The set of Lee Oscar harps we got lasted a couple shows and started to give out.