Looking for a "beater" to take to a festival/campout

[Mike Rodbell]

I'm planning on going to a music festival next summer, and don't dare bring along any instrument that is either expensive or difficult to replace. Was curious if anyone has used the Rogue-100a? Can't beat the price if its reasonably playable ($60!).

Anyone tinkered with one & have feedback? Similarly, any other recommendations for a playable instrument for no more than $120?

[Taith]

I have a Johnson MA-100 A style.

It is basically a $50 mandolin, its tone is not too deep or resonating. But it can put out some sound if you can pick a bit stiffly. There really is not much too it, I use it for just like what your talking about. Activities that may prove harmful to it, or it is something that I don't care that little kids to play with.

For a mandolin under $120, it is pretty much a take what you can get. Most of the mandolins in that price range are laminated wood, so there won't be too much of a sound difference.

[Clef]

I'm in the market for a beater mandolin as well so I'm curious what other people use. The problem I have with the ultra cheap beater mandolins is I can't play well on them. If you get a good setup on a $60 beater, can they at least play well?

I've considered finding a used and beat up Eastman MD-315, but they don't show up in the used market. It seems that everyone who buys the 315 keeps it and no one beats on it so they can sell it to me for cheap. I don't really want to spend $700 on a new 315 and call it a beater. The reason I mention the 315 is because I like the neck and how well they play.

[Marty Jacobson]

With some tweaking, you can make a basic instrument "play well". But a lot of what we perceive as "playing well" comes from the responsiveness of the instrument, so you will never get that in a super cheap instrument, regardless of how well it's set up.

[bart mcneil]

A Strad-O-Lin found on eBay for roughly $200 to $300 in decent playing shape can be a wonderful player. I have two and am always delighted at their sound. There are always a few on eBay, usually at reasonable prices

Also look for a used Mid-Missouri (AKA Big Muddy). Often found at roughly $300 well used or $400 in decent cosmetic condition. Built in USA they are a quality entry level instrument known for their great sound and moderate cost new. They show up on this site fairly often or on eBay of course.

Of the two I think the Mid-Missouri would be the least problematic as it is fairly new while the Srad is pre or just after WW2. But either can be a great mando.

[Steve VandeWater]

If you get Rob Meldrum's free set up e- book here on the cafe, he goes into great detail about how he tweaked his Rogue and a couple other cheapies to make them sound and play very well. He swears by them if you do the right set up

[Franc Homier Lieu]

You can get a Rover RM-50 for under 120 (here for instance: http://www.instrumentalley.com/Rover-RM-50-Mandolin-All-Solid-A-Model-p/rm-50.htm). It will not be set up and virtually unplayable, but if you get Rob Meldrum's book you should be able to make this all solid wood and allegedly carved top mandolin (according to the specs on the Saga website) quite playable.

[nickster60]

Or get a Kentucky km-150 already setup from Folkmusician for a few hundred dollars.

[fatt-dad]

get insurance and bring your real mandolin. I mean do you really think you'll do several hundred dollars damage playing your mandolin outside the house?

f-d

[Ron McMillan]

get insurance and bring your real mandolin. I mean do you really think you'll do several hundred dollars damage playing your mandolin outside the house?

f-d

FD is right. Your mandolins are made to be played, and with insurance, you have nothing much to worry about.

AND when you get to the festival and find yourself playing a good instrument in among other fine instruments, you won't beat yourself up for turning up with a sixty-buck junker with a muted tone that doesn't cut it in the crowd.

[nickster60]

I have seen some pretty expensive instruments at festivals, lots of 5 figure mandolins. I agree with fatt-dad get your instrument insured. How do you think your would be Rogue will sound next to a Altman, Nugget,Gibson or a Stiver.

Ron beat me to it.

[Steve Zawacki]

If it's the first time going to this festival and wanting to see how things are dne there, the OP's desire to take an instrument which is "expendable" is understandable.

The advice regarding a Rogue, Rover or anything else in the $100 (+$50) range is not bad, but should be coupled with doing one's own set-up using Robster's E-Book. The necessary nut files can be had (NFI) for less than $10 (the Cigar Box Guitar Nut Files) via EBay or other vendors - been using them for a long time on a lot of stringed instruments.

[ald]

I bought an Ibanez M615-OPN from Thomann for about Euro 150 that was quite awful but had it set up and changed the dire strings for another Euro 25 and it doesn't play badly at all now.

[allenhopkins]

Strad-O-Lin -- you can find 'em in the price range, though it's been interesting to watch prices rise over the past five years or so. They are surprisingly good-sounding cheapos from the 1930's-50's era. Mine can hold its own with more expensive mandolins; it's grungy looking and has a very short neck, but I've played the tar out of it for over 20 years. And -- it cost me $25, though I had to drop a couple hundred into getting it repaired and set up.

Strad-O-Lins are the kind of "beaters" that cause other mandolinists to ask "What kinda mand'lin is that?" On the other hand, though, I don't generally subscribe to leaving my "good" instruments home when I go to a festival, music camp, jam etc. But I have no hesitation in taking the Strad-O-Lin anywhere; it's a good mandolin that just happens to be no-frills cheap.

[kkmm]

In my experience, Rogue and Johnson mandolins do not hold tune very well, and they sound thin, not loud enough for outdoor.
However, they look really beautiful and their neck is easy to play, my wife praised them for the look and hated my beat up mandolin, an old pancake Kentucky, which has much much better quality / sound and playability, it sounds loud too which is good for outdoor.
A good way to get a beat up mandolin is to search on your local CraigList, hopefully there are quite a few, low cost (100$ or less), to choose from. In my area CL, there are a few like that but I already have too many mandolins, so I will skip them.

[darrylicshon]

i have a ovation i use as my beater . the plastic back helps i go fishing with it alot . they make a cheaper one under applause , but if i go where i am not fishing i do take a better one, just try to take good care of it

[Richard J]

CraigList, CraigList, CraigList, A great place to find a better used Rogue but still very cheap.

[Rob Meldrum]

It's always fun sifting through the various words of wisdom here. My big issue with taking a nice instrument to a music festival is dealing with the what-ifs: what if I leave it in a car on a hot day and ruin it? What if someone sits on it? What if someone steals it? What if someone spills beer in it? And on and on and on.

If you're going to be jamming with strangers a Rogue won't bring you street cred. Lots of people's ears are influenced by labels. On the other hand, if you want a relaible, low-cost campfire instrument that you don't have to worry about, the Rogue is a surprising value. Get the Rogue, new strings, and follow my ebook and you will have a decent playable mandolin. Email me at rob.meldrum@gmail.com.

My favorite deal is the musciansfriend.com "two-fer." It's their RA 100-D guitar and the mandolin. Both, shipped, for $99.00 plus sales tax. A friend just bought the RA 100-D for her son for Christmas, and it needed a very minor tweak on my part to become a nice, playable guitar. NFI on my part!

[mandroid]

Mix Carbon Fiber Mandolins would be Ideal ..

I'd take mine, if any place was affordable to get to, from here.

Eastman Fiberglass cases with back pack straps eliminate the need to set the case down anywhere ..
that reduces the grab and run theft potential a huge amount. a white one will not get hot, so much.

[red7flag]

Red Line Traveler is an awesome (NFI) pancake mandolin made by Steve Smith and Cumberland Acoustics. Here is the link: http://redlineresophonics.com/mandolins/traveler This is a great campfire instrument.

[Caleb]

I agree with fatt-dad. I never understand the idea of having nice instruments and not taking them along when it's time to play? Life's just too short to fuss over things like that.

.02

[yankees1]

get insurance and bring your real mandolin. I mean do you really think you'll do several hundred dollars damage playing your mandolin outside the house?

f-d Yep, I agree !

[Mark Wilson]

TBh if everyone showed up to jams with 'beaters' it take way one of the things I like about going.

Live more and worry less.

[Mike Rodbell]

Not a chance. I'm there primarily as a spectator, planning on having some fun jamming in the evenings. My main mandolin is custom made and would be difficult to replace. I'd rather bring something that I wouldn't miss if swiped or damaged.

[Clef]

A question to those of you who say, "no beaters"... What do you do with your expensive, lifetime keeper mandolin when you're not playing it at a festival?

When I went to the Pagosa Springs Bluegrass fest in CO, I stayed in a hotel. I would never leave my mandolin/hoffee case sitting next to my luggage when the hotel room cleaning people were there. Not that hotel cleaning people would steal it, but what if someone did? I also wouldn't have been able to leave my mandolin in my car because it was pushing 100F so it was very hot outside.

Aside from lugging around my mandolin everywhere I went, I don't know what I would do with it if I brought it with me. If I had it with me I would have jammed for a few hours, then lugged it around with me for an entire weekend while I did other things in town.

Regarding insurance... Insurance could cover the cost of the instrument, but it could never replace it.

This is why I want to get a beater.

[Ron McMillan]

A question to those of you who say, "no beaters"... What do you do with your expensive, lifetime keeper mandolin when you're not playing it at a festival?

When I went to the Pagosa Springs Bluegrass fest in CO, I stayed in a hotel. I would never leave my mandolin/hoffee case sitting next to my luggage when the hotel room cleaning people were there. Not that hotel cleaning people would steal it, but what if someone did? I also wouldn't have been able to leave my mandolin in my car because it was pushing 100F so it was very hot outside.

Aside from lugging around my mandolin everywhere I went, I don't know what I would do with it if I brought it with me. If I had it with me I would have jammed for a few hours, then lugged it around with me for an entire weekend while I did other things in town.

Regarding insurance... Insurance could cover the cost of the instrument, but it could never replace it.

This is why I want to get a beater.

Wow, with that many worries, do you only get to take it out the case when you find yourself in a climate-controlled bank vault?

[nickster60]

Their are very few instruments that you cant replace. I really like my Weber but it could easily be replace by another Weber or with a better instrument. Unless it is a Stradivarius or a Loar you can most likely find a equivalent or better instrument. Insurance is just peace of mind and a avenue to replace the instrument you lost. It is admirable to cherish your instrument but it can be replaced, so enjoy it.

[Steve Zawacki]

A question to those of you who say, "no beaters"... What do you do with your expensive, lifetime keeper mandolin when you're not playing it at a festival?

When I went to the Pagosa Springs Bluegrass fest in CO, I stayed in a hotel. I would never leave my mandolin/hoffee case sitting next to my luggage when the hotel room cleaning people were there. Not that hotel cleaning people would steal it, but what if someone did? I also wouldn't have been able to leave my mandolin in my car because it was pushing 100F so it was very hot outside.

Aside from lugging around my mandolin everywhere I went, I don't know what I would do with it if I brought it with me. If I had it with me I would have jammed for a few hours, then lugged it around with me for an entire weekend while I did other things in town.

Regarding insurance... Insurance could cover the cost of the instrument, but it could never replace it.

This is why I want to get a beater.

All good points.

There are folk who have been going to festivals for ages. They have developed a circle of friends there, jam mainly with them, and they all form a de facto "security team", watching each other's instruments when folk want to wander for a while. As a result, their concern about instrument safety is significantly diminished because they have developed a support system to alleviate worry.

For folk without such support systems, the idea of the expendable beater does have logic. It may not make musical sense, but it does provide peace of mind. Taking the beater will probably last until one goes to a festival with a pre-arranged agenda . In other words, it's a repeat experience which has become a gathering of friends who meet at certain times, at specific places, and see it as a reunion rather than a ticketed event.

After a time or two going to a specific festival, the feeling about which instrument(s) to take may change, based on comfort and familiarity.

[Mark Wilson]

A question to those of you who say, "no beaters"... What do you do with your expensive, lifetime keeper mandolin when you're not playing it at a festival? If my main axe was a museum piece I'm guessing my beater would be something really nice.

[Tobin]

When I went to the Pagosa Springs Bluegrass fest in CO, I stayed in a hotel. I would never leave my mandolin/hoffee case sitting next to my luggage when the hotel room cleaning people were there. Not that hotel cleaning people would steal it, but what if someone did? I also wouldn't have been able to leave my mandolin in my car because it was pushing 100F so it was very hot outside.
I certainly understand these concerns, and I find myself doing the same thing when I take my good mandolins on the road. I won't leave them in a hotel room unattended, and I won't leave them in a vehicle. They can be a bit of an albatross when traveling, especially when I'm not playing them (like when I go to a restaurant, etc.). I basically take them everywhere I go, unless I can leave them in an indoor environment with family or friends who I trust.

But honestly, would you take these risks with a beater? Even if it's only a couple-hundred dollar mandolin, would you leave it in a car when the temperature is over 100 degrees F, knowing that it might be ruined when you get back? Would you leave it where someone could steal it? Does having a beater mean that you don't care at all if it gets ruined or stolen? I guess the question here is whether "beater" means "disposable", with the intent to not come home with it.

I would obviously agree that having a $300 mandolin ruined in a hot car is less painful/traumatic than having a $12,000 mandolin ruined in a hot car. But that doesn't mean I would want to intentionally risk ruining or losing even a $300 mandolin. I'd likely still end up toting it around just like I would have with my good mandolin, which sort of defeats the purpose. But if you are willing to risk losing or ruining your beater by leaving it unattended or in a hot/cold vehicle just to avoid the inconvenience, then go for it. I suppose that's really what having a beater is all about, though I could never really find it within myself to take such risks with any of my property.

[jaycat]

I think if you get to the point where you feel you have to keep an eagle eye on something 24/7, then that mandolin owns you, and not the other way around.

[allenhopkins]

I love stringed instruments, which is why I've accumulated six dozen of them. And I do appreciate them as works of art, examples of superb crafts-person-ship, and also as historical artifacts, representing the technology, musical environment, and popular songs and tunes of the periods when they were created.

But I also look upon them as tools for making music, which is why a shlep them around to gigs, sing-arounds, jams, camps, festivals etc. Were I a carpenter (I'm surely not!), would I buy a very expensive hammer, and then not take it to my carpentry jobs because it's too beautiful and valuable -- even though it drives nails better than any other hammer I might own? Would I have an inferior "beater" (hah! -- a pun) hammer, that I took out and used, just so no other carpenter would be tempted to steal my "good one?"

There is risk every time you pull an instrument out of its case -- hell, there's risk when it's still in the case! My goal, for what it's worth, is not to pass on mint-condition instruments to my heirs, or to whomever I may sell them to. It's to get the max music and enjoyment out of each of them while it's in my possession.

Just my 2¢.

[jclover]

I would not take a $120 mando to jam on at festivals. But with that said, I do have a beater, and if I had to jam with it I could. I take it on road trips, fishing trips, and just have it sitting out around the house so it is handy - no digging it out of the closet, no fiddling with a case, just pick it up and play for the spare 10 mins I might have. I would leave it in a hotel room, in my car, around my ornery dogs, leaned against a rock next to a smokey camp fire, and the like. I would not be happy if it was lost, stolen or destroyed - but I would get over it mighty quick and just go buy another one. Mine cost about $300 new, and while that is not as cheap as they come, it is also good enough that I truly enjoy playing it. No reason to have a cheap mando if you dont want to actually play it, but also no reason to take a pro-level mando to entertain squirrels.

[Tobin]

I think if you get to the point where you feel you have to keep an eagle eye on something 24/7, then that mandolin owns you, and not the other way around.
That's kind of a negative way of looking at it, even though it's a fairly accurate statement. I rather tend to look at it like I'm extremely honored and privileged to own such a nice thing that was made by such a craftsman, and it is my responsibility to be a good caretaker of my investment (it's not only a monetary investment but an emotional one as well). I don't own very many things that I treat with the same level of care as my mandolin. There's a sense of satisfaction in owning something that's really nice, and using it as it was meant to be used, while also guarding it and protecting it against harm.

What's the alternative, honestly? Is it better to only own junk that one doesn't care about, just to avoid being "owned" by one's possessions? I'd say that if it's so burdensome that it doesn't seem worth the trouble, then yeah, get rid of it. But if being a good caretaker of an expensive instrument is a labor of love, and enriches one's life, then being "owned" by it doesn't seem like a bad thing at all.

[jaycat]

What's the alternative, honestly? Is it better to only own junk that one doesn't care about, just to avoid being "owned" by one's possessions? I'd say that if it's so burdensome that it doesn't seem worth the trouble, then yeah, get rid of it. But if being a good caretaker of an expensive instrument is a labor of love, and enriches one's life, then being "owned" by it doesn't seem like a bad thing at all.

No, I agree, take good care of a good instrument. I am flying to DC next week and am not taking my 1915 Gibson A on a plane, I will take my Rover instead. I am just saying: bear in mind that we are talking about material possessions here, to keep a perspective on that. They are not (believe it or not) the most important things in life. "Security is a false god; worship it and you are lost." -- Paul Bowles.

[Tom Sanderson]

I have seen some pretty expensive instruments at festivals, lots of 5 figure mandolins. I agree with fatt-dad get your instrument insured. How do you think your would be Rogue will sound next to a Altman, Nugget,Gibson or a Stiver.

Ron beat me to it.
I've owned Nuggets for almost 25 years. I always take them to festivals or wherever I go. I have good insurance on them (Heritage).I keep an eye on them and I put them away if I drink too much. I don't usually let anyone else play them

[fatt-dad]

Returning for a few more words. . .

My '84 Flatiron has been to Costa Rica, Honduras and Panama. It goes to the sandy beaches of North Carolina for a week at the beach every year. It actually goes to the beach and lives in a black gig bag below the umbrella when I'm not playing it.

My Cohen just completed a trip from Richmond to Denver to California, back to Denver and returned home. I played it at every stop. My Cohen also just went to the mountains where I played and had fun with other folks. I cherish both of these instruments, because I have so many stories - life events - where these instruments have been with me.

127820127821127822

I hated my Hondo! Sort of lost it. . . Don't care either.

f-d

[Petrus]

And in a pinch it can double as a canoe paddle when you find yourself exploring the dark upper reaches of the Amazon!

[Dale Pauline]

I have a Rogue RM101-A I'd let go for $45 plus shipping. Needs new strings. PM for details.

[Spencer]

I have taken my good mandolins to festivals for years. I have a hardshell case with backstraps. When I'm not playing it, it's on my back, and it doesn't get left in hot cars. It is stashed under my cot, or locked in a car overnight. It's pretty frustrating to play in a jam and not be able to make yourself heard. I find this to be a pretty secure arrangement, but of course there is no 100% insurance for anything.

Spencer

[Clef]

All good points.

There are folk who have been going to festivals for ages. They have developed a circle of friends there, jam mainly with them, and they all form a de facto "security team", watching each other's instruments when folk want to wander for a while. As a result, their concern about instrument safety is significantly diminished because they have developed a support system to alleviate worry.

For folk without such support systems, the idea of the expendable beater does have logic. It may not make musical sense, but it does provide peace of mind. Taking the beater will probably last until one goes to a festival with a pre-arranged agenda . In other words, it's a repeat experience which has become a gathering of friends who meet at certain times, at specific places, and see it as a reunion rather than a ticketed event.

After a time or two going to a specific festival, the feeling about which instrument(s) to take may change, based on comfort and familiarity.

Thanks for this info. This makes a lot of sense how people are comfortable bringing expensive instruments to fests. I haven't been going to fests long enough.

I may not have brought my mandolin to a fest yet, but I travel with it outside of my house several times a week. I'm an active player in ABQ and I jam all over town with people. In the past few months I've brought my mandolin to work about four times a week so I can attend jams, lessons and play in two live performances. I've also been on a few airplanes traveling with my mandolin recently. I've just been afraid to bring it to bluegrass fests in the summertime when I'm staying in a hotel.

Instead of getting a true beater mandolin, maybe I'll get a nice Eastman or Kentucky as a travel, festival mandolin. I really would like to jam at fests.

[Josh Levine]

I started going to festivals before I started playing and my primary objectives were to listen to music and to party. I still like to do that so I would hate to leave an expensive mando in a car or tent or have to have it by my side at all times. It would not be enjoyable to have the anxiety of a really nice mando in unfavorable conditions. So I have some good cheaper mandos that are totally pleasant to play, a flatiron pancake for camping and a flatiron a5 that a cafe member was kind enough to give me a really great price for. Neither will blow the doors off a jam but either are easy enough to play, sound good enough, and are easy to leave around my car or campsite without worry.

[almeriastrings]

A question to those of you who say, "no beaters"... What do you do with your expensive, lifetime keeper mandolin when you're not playing it at a festival?




The way I see it, if I did not play it out and about, and actually use it to make music where others can hear it, there would not be a lot of point in having it. Why would I want to have really nice instruments (or an instrument) and then play a rough sounding $100 mando? Unfortunately, you can't get a super cheapo 'beater' that will stand up to a really fine instrument. You can get some very good instruments in the $1K range and if going somewhere seriously risky, that might be the best option. KM-900 or a nice Flatiron or something similar....

[yankees1]

Awaiting my "beater" that I will take to festivals next year, my new Ellis F5 to be delivered next week ! :)

[Steve Zawacki]

Looking at most of the responses, the OP's original question is is a good one, since it goes to the heart of the "festival" matter. Is the festival a place for musically like-minded folk to mingle, jam, discuss and overall enjoy each other's company regardless of what the price tag is of their instrument, or is the festival a "class" event based more on the attendees' instrument's headstock logo than the music itself?

I used to see a "class" situation at certain motorcycle events (back in my serious riding days). There were the bikers who rode anything with two wheels and there were the logo-conscious "pseudo-bikers" who rated whom was worthy of socialization by the person's bike pricetag and if a designer wardrobe was worn. Whether folk show up at an outdoor musicthon with a $50 special or a $15K museum piece should be immaterial. It's what they do with the instrument, rather than the instrument itself, that should be the central factor of any music event. Otherwise, the event is really no more than an "instrument show" rather than gathering of musicians. Now, there's nothing wrong with instrument shows (as there's nothing wrong with car, dog or flower shows). It only takes going to the particular "festival" once to see who is the target audience and what's the real intent of the event.

An old guitarist I knew used to go to weekend "folk festivals" with two guitars - an old knockaround he got in a pawn shop and a truly beautiful Gibson (the model escapes me). On the first day he'd go around with the beater to see where he fit in socially and musically, and the next day (if he thought the situation was right) he'd go with the beauty. He was more people-and-music centric and wanted to be around folk who only saw the instrument as a conduit to the music rather than as a badge to attract or be with a specifcic instrument-class crowd.

Taking a beater to a festival can have more than one purpose, and if the OP thinks it's something he wants to do, he's right in doing so.

[John Duncan]

I'd love to take the Daley standard in the classifieds to a festival and beat on it. Or a jam. Or a show.

[Mark Wilson]

Thats deeper than I was thinking. TBH, all I was considering was having the most enjoyment possible.

[nickster60]

I really don't think the recommendations are about class, status or instrument snobbery. I have played the mention Rogue mandolins and they didn't do a thing for me. There are so many inexpensive decent mandolins today, for a few hundred dollars you have a pretty good instrument. Having been in a few jamming circles with really nice Martins, Nugget and a Stiver you can get lost pretty quickly. You at least need a reasonably good sounding instrument and today that doesn't equate to being expensive.

As for the motorcycle analogy, being a pretty hardcore and longtime rider I am no sure it applies. The guys who dress up in their head to toe biker clothes and bring the wife in her stripper wear are playing make believe. They spend more time standing around trying to look good than riding. Their only participation is drinking and acting like they are on the Sons of Anarchy.

I guess it would apply if you just stood there with your expensive mandolin and looked good, but that isnt the case.

[Steve Zawacki]

I really don't think the recommendations are about class, status or instrument snobbery. I have played the mention Rogue mandolins and they didn't do a thing for me. There are so many inexpensive decent mandolins today, for a few hundred dollars you have a pretty good instrument. Having been in a few jamming circles with really nice Martins, Nugget and a Stiver you can get lost pretty quickly. You at least need a reasonably good sounding instrument and today that doesn't equate to being expensive.

As for the motorcycle analogy, being a pretty hardcore and longtime rider I am no sure it applies. The guys who dress up in their head to toe biker clothes and bring the wife in her stripper wear are playing make believe. They spend more time standing around trying to look good than riding. Their only participation is drinking and acting like they are on the Sons of Anarchy.

I guess it would apply if you just stood there with your expensive mandolin and looked good, but that inst the case.

Unless I misunderstood the OP's question (and I am a world-class "misunderstander"), his concern was one of security for the instrument. The underlying basis was being unsure of what was going to happen at some festival and thus not knowing how to go through the event with instrument in tow, left someplace, or whatever. So, the OP was taking the cautious approach - been there, done that, and it would not surprise me if many others also took the cautious approach the first time at any particular event.

Familiarity begets comfort, especially with what to bring, how to secure things and the like. So, going to a new event and taking the cautious approach the first time is logical. The next year (if an annual) may bring a different outlook, planning and such.

To some folk, an instrument worth several hundred dollars is a beater. To others that same instrument represents a lot of work time invested into a thing of artistry to be used but never abused or risked to the elements. Time may make a person more comfortable with a prized instrument to take it anywhere, but it does indeed take time to feel that way, especially if someone is relatively new to the instrument. Folk who have been involved with mandolins for many years are probably much more cavalier with valuable instruments than the guy/gal who has just bought their first over-$500/1000 musical instrument and has been involved with mandolin a relatively short time.

Whatever the OP decides to do, here's hoping the other folk at the festival see him as a fellow enthusiast for himself and are less concerned with instrument he brings.

[Don Grieser]

Hey Clef,

I've been going to Pagosa and camping is fine there. I stash my mando in my truck. Put some shade up in your windows and leave them cracked, cover the case with some stuff and it doesn't get too hot to go see a couple sets of music. There's usually someone in the camp area where I camp (near Gregg). No big deal to bring a good instrument and pick. Lots of good jams late at night--great reason to camp. Stop by and pick one with us.

Don

[CES]

Janet Davis Music has a Rover 25-S and a 50B (both all solid, the latter in black) for 99 and 129 respectively. I've bought a cheap open back Gold Tone banjo from them in the past, and was/am well pleased with their set-up, even on that entry level model. Especially if you call and tell them your preferences, I suspect they'd take good care of you. So, for < 150 bucks you can get a beater than sounds OK and is set up well without elbow grease from you...that's the kind of deal I'd be looking for! NFI, btw, just a satisfied first hand customer. All of the Café sponsors I've played instruments from do a great job at set-ups!

My true beater is a Kentucky 675-S that was my first mandolin and an eBay disaster. I now let people I play music with autograph it Marty Stuart style, and, honestly, only play it in the worst of conditions with the highest risk of damage, which admittedly, doesn't happen terribly often. I have a Flatiron 1N that's my "go to" beater, but it's a little out of your range. Most of the time I take my Silver Angel Econo model. It's my best mandolin, by far, heck, probably my best instrument by far, but I got it used for 900 dollars, so I don't worry a ton about it. I'm very careful with it, and would be very sad if I lost or destroyed it, but it wouldn't be the end of the world.

Rob, I was able to get your e-book from a fellow Café member's post, but have been unsuccessful with probably 3 email attempts and a pm (maybe 2, haven't tried to reach you for several months). It's a very good resource, and, coupled with frets.com, can really help you maximize your mandolin's playability! If you've blocked me for something I've said or done, sorry! Probably didn't mean it (or, if I did mean it, would love to discuss further, pm me!). Or, maybe I was using an old email from an outdated thread. Just letting you know I've had trouble reaching you in the past...and, thanks for the resource!

[Clef]

Hey Clef,

I've been going to Pagosa and camping is fine there. I stash my mando in my truck. Put some shade up in your windows and leave them cracked, cover the case with some stuff and it doesn't get too hot to go see a couple sets of music. There's usually someone in the camp area where I camp (near Gregg). No big deal to bring a good instrument and pick. Lots of good jams late at night--great reason to camp. Stop by and pick one with us.

Don

Thanks Don. Hopefully I'll get a chance to pick with you and Gregg in Pagosa at the next bluegrass fest. I'm still a mandolin student of Gregg's and it's going well. Although I do more group jam classes than private lessons these days. He got me jamming with others more and spending less time practicing alone. I've been eager to start bringing a mandolin to bluegrass fests.

Regarding beater mandolins. I was inquiring about getting one when I was at The Mandolin Store in AZ. They guys there said, "you don't want to do that. Once you play the good stuff, you don't want to play anything else." I had my Gibson with me and they really liked it.

After this thread, I'll look into getting a decent second mandolin as a travel instrument. Once I get comfortable jamming at fests, then maybe I'll bring my Gibson on occasion.

[Caleb]

Was thinking this over while at an annual Christmas party last night. I take along my Larrivee (my good guitar) and lead carols at this party each year. The placeis full of kids and people crammed in everywhere. It just makes me more careful with my old prized guitar.

As I was playing last night the Larrivee sounded absolutely glorious: fresh strings and everything was just going right with my playing too. I started thinking how taking my Takamine (out of fear of harming the Larrivee) would've lessened the experience. I had people tell me afterward how nice the guitar sounded and how it filled up the room.

At least from my perspective, the whole point of having nice instruments is to put them to use and enjoy them. That's the whole reason I bought the thing! Playing a good instrument when it's time to play makes playing better. YMMV.

[Dagger Gordon]

[QUOTE=Caleb;13542
At least from my perspective, the whole point of having nice instruments is to put them to use and enjoy them. That's the whole reason I bought the thing! Playing a good instrument when it's time to play makes playing better. YMMV.[/QUOTE]

Can't argue with that!

I have three mandolins:
A ten-string Sobell (my main stage instrument with a good pick-up) which would be difficult to replace, and anyway I've been playing it for thirty years.
A Collings MT. A good mandolin, but it's not that hard to find a replacement.
An Encore, which is a cheap Korean thing I've had for over twenty years.

I don't have a problem with taking the Sobell to gigs. That's what it's for, and I want to sound my best.
The Collings is great for parties, pub things, travelling.
The Encore is fine for travelling when you're not sure where you're going to find yourself but you want an instrument with you. It plays OK - sounds quite nice actually. It probably wouldn't hold its own in a big bluegrass jam at a festival but if you're planning a trip to Costa Rica and might be white water rafting with it, then it seems a good choice!

[barney 59]

How about an old Gibson A model --a jr or a plain A. $600 might get you one if you enjoy the hunt. That way you have both a replaceable "beater" and a pretty good mandolin in the same package. It's a value thing, to some people a couple of hundred dollars is as high as they are willing to go if they think there is a potential risk by taking their instrument someplace and for others it might be a couple of thousand or more or even a lot more. Someone complained about "lugging" their mandolin. Not that much lugging involved with a mandolin, now if this was the upright base Cafe I could see your point. Banjos can definitely feel like luggage but a mandolin is pretty easy to carry around and you can always get one of those backpack type cases. I had an old Lyon and Healy G model once, it didn't weight much more than my Iphone! We are talking about a music festival here,not a mountain expedition. If I were you--or rather if I was me, I'd take my good instrument.

[Caleb]

Can't argue with that!

I have three mandolins:
A ten-string Sobell (my main stage instrument with a good pick-up) which would be difficult to replace, and anyway I've been playing it for thirty years.
A Collings MT. A good mandolin, but it's not that hard to find a replacement.
An Encore, which is a cheap Korean thing I've had for over twenty years.

I don't have a problem with taking the Sobell to gigs. That's what it's for, and I want to sound my best.
The Collings is great for parties, pub things, travelling.
The Encore is fine for travelling when you're not sure where you're going to find yourself but you want an instrument with you. It plays OK - sounds quite nice actually. It probably wouldn't hold its own in a big bluegrass jam at a festival but if you're planning a trip to Costa Rica and might be white water rafting with it, then it seems a good choice!Dagger, I'm curious, how common is a Collings instrument where you live? Did you buy yours online or play it first? I've never played an MT that didn't impress me, and a few have really blown me away.

[Dagger Gordon]

Hi,
Yes, you can get them.

http://www.themusicroom-online.co.uk/index.php/cPath/537_265_543_640

However I bought mine in person at TAMCO in Brighton. I did not specifically go to the shop to buy a MT. I just liked it and it was in my price range.

Edit: Although you can get them, it is the case that I haven't seen anyone else with one in Scotland. Doesn't mean there aren't any, of course. I have occasionally seen a Collings guitar.

[Jeff Mando]

I guess I like the idea of putting your best foot forward and taking your good mandolin. Just be aware and be careful. Don't let it out of your sight, in other words.

There's always the classic case of oneupmanship, as MAD magazine would have called it years ago. If you bring a beater to a gig, somebody will show up with a brand new Gibson, to show off. If you tell them, but wait, I have a Gibson, too! They will say, oh yeah, where's it at? At home, you reply. Yeah, right! That's what I thought! And walks away. And ya can't really blame 'em, can ya? :crying:

[Jim]

For Jams and Festivals I'd bring my good instruments. I do have a Beater for camping where playing isn't the focus and conditions are worse than most festivals. I might leave it in a tent or the back of the pickup while hiking, fishing ect. That one also has been my main travel instrument and has entertained me in airports and hotel rooms. It's of the Johnson level of quality but has had the action tweaked for 12 years or so and plays quite well. I'd miss it if stolen or broken but would replace it with a low end Rover or Kentucky in a minute.

[trevor]

Dagger, I have Collings in stock now.

[Dagger Gordon]

Dagger, I have Collings in stock now.

Hi Trevor,

Yes, that's good to know. Thanks.

Not exactly a 'beater' but they are replaceable and appear to be very consistent.

Have a good Christmas Trevor.

Dagger

[Ron Cox]

Peavey, comes with a case, looks cool, sounds pretty darn good for $149. Just got one on a lark and was impressed. Mine now comes to work with me so if I forget it at work (not likely) I can wait until next week to pick it up.

[fatt-dad]

The Beater - my essay

I don’t like the concept! I recognize that some mandolins cost $20,000.00 and that’s a lot of coin for a casual stroll through a festival or airport. I also recognize that mandolins are available on the market for less than a hundred bucks and with a good setup can be quite playable.

Most folks that really want to bring a mandolin to a festival have enough experience to showcase a few tunes and chop a few chords along with others. I’d bet that most folks that want to bring a mandolin to a festival or on a trip are in it for the long haul. So, herein lays my overall perspective. Why buy a sub-par mandolin to accompany your journeys?

Ooh, now we have to address, what’s a, “par” mandolin? Well, beyond the setup, it has to have some measure of horsepower and a sound that’s acceptable. I’d seek out solid woods and, for an arch-top, hand-carved gradations, which are available from Eastman, The Loar, Kentucky, J. Bouvier and others. I’ve found my needs in my Flatiron 1N, which is a flat-top mandolin that’s available for about $600 or $700 bucks. It’s not a beater though. It’s an authentic mandolin – a mandolin that I’ve enjoyed for at least a decade. A mandolin that I have and will continue to built stories upon.

So, for the instrument that you take on trips, to festivals, camping and to the campfire, you are building stories. Each of these stories (to me) has greater value then the $50 dollar or the $1,000 dollar initial purchase price. I’d rather build stories with something that’ll I’ll cherish. And, that conflicts with the entire notion of a, “Beater,” which seems like something you’d leave out in the rain. . .

f-d

[trevor]

"“Beater,” which seems like something you’d leave out in the rain. . ." Isn't that the point? Its not a big deal if you do leave it out in the rain, or drop from your canoe or a bear eats it (might be worth it if you can watch).. etc., etc..

[Caleb]

I think fatt-dad nailed it with the idea of "building stories" with an instrument. That's a really great idea and one that sums it up well. I have a lot more stories with my Larrivee guitar than with my mandolin, and those stories are part of what makes it special. It was there for a lot of the memorable moments of my musical (and otherwise) life. All the bumps and bruises are also part of the story. The big idea is living and enjoying life and the things that make up your life while you have them (both life and the things).

[jclover]

I don't disagree with F-D in general - I just don't agree with his definition of beater. No, I would not leave my beater in the rain. But if I did, one of 2 things would happen: 1) the laminate back/sides would help the beater actually survive, or 2) I would have to spend another $300 to replace it. Either way, I would have a story, and it would not be a tragic one. Now, if my favorite instrument, (after 30 years of searching!) was left in the rain, it would be tragic. I hate tragedies, so you can keep those stories.

Even though I do like my beater and find it's tone more than just acceptable, I still would take a better mandolin to a festival if I expected to jam. But I might not take my favorite. Which is kinda funny, because I would likely take a MORE expensive instrument than my favorite, because my fav mandolin is only my third most expensive.

[Marc Ferry]

Your best bet would probably be a used instrument. The Kentucky KM-150 is a playable mando that goes for $230 new, so you could definitely find that for a pretty low price used.

If you're looking for a beater with a bit better quality than that, you could consider a Loar 220 or an Eastman 305, which are both excellent mandolins that go for under $500 new.

[Petrus]

Guitar Center had a used Rogue for $29.99 the other day, but it looks like someone snatched that baby up already. The good ones always go fast.

[multidon]

My beater story: after some catch and release I finally settled down to two great mandolins, a Weber Bitterroot A and a Breedlove FO. Two distinctly different but lovely tones. The Bitterroot sounds woody and the Breedlove brighter and nicely balanced, both loud enough to get the job done. But I had a seemingly innocuous incident at a gig resulted in a wing crack on the top of the Weber. A quickie repair by a luthier left me unsatisfied. The repair was sturdy but very visible. I ended up sending it back to Weber to have the repair done over and they made it invisible. Looks like it never even happened! Also had some upgrades done while it was there. Had the headstock decal replaced with pearl inlay. A detail for sure, but worth every penny. My Bitterroot looks factory fresh now and I try to keep both good mandolins that way. I only take them to gigs that will be indoors, temperature controlled, and spacious.

In conversations with my wife I expressed a desire for a "good beater". An instrument that I could take to outdoor and less than ideal gigs. One that didn't cost much but still looked and sounded good. Last Christmas she surprised me with a used Kentucky KM 600 from The Mandolin Store. It fit the bill perfectly! It has great tone, more akin to my Bitterroot, looks nice, and only cost 400 dollars. It sounds and looks so good a lot of people assume it's my good mandolin! For me it's the perfect beater.

If I'm on a picnic (my family goes on a lot of picnics if weather allows) I throw in my Martin Backpacker. No one mistakes that for my good mandolin, but it sure is fun to have along.

[Timbofood]

I have been reluctant to weigh in on this but, here I go!
I am not one to stockpile a roomful of instruments simply because I have never been able to afford it, I have had two (decent) instruments only twice at the same time. I have always taken what I had. It's not a it what your packin' but, more about how you play at the festivals I have been to.
I started with a 60dollar Harmony, upgraded to a KM 11, sold the Harmony. Upgraded to my Alvarez in 75, sold the KM 11(should have kept it) got a good deal on an A-50, turned that in six months. Bought an A style Stiver, as nice as it was, I never really warmed up to it, sold that in 84. I've played the Alvarez with some very fine musicians, and very fine instruments, it has held it's own and surprised many at jams!
Now, after reading this one mans story of mandolin deprivation, when you feel such pity just send all your money to me and I will upgrade to the Halsey F-5 with matching A-5 in double case and I will carry them with pride everywhere, sharing at any opportunity!:grin:
Jaycat already sent the picture so, you can all just send Bill money and make it a real surprise! I have got to get out of the hospitality suite, I must be less than sober! Hahahahahahahahahahah!
Birthday is in August, just there is some benefactor out there:))

[terzinator]

Looks like this has been beaten to death, but I'll brush away a few flies hovering around the carcass.

I hear ya. I have a Collings MT, so it's not a priceless heirloom, and it could be replaced... but I think it's a really good example, and I'd be bummed as can be if anything happened to it. But I bring it to fests all the time, because it sounds great, and I like playing a good instrument.

I think the idea of going to this fest to get a taste of the place without your expensive mandolin isn't a crazy idea. You might be inclined to bring your good'un next time.

But bring a sub-$100 Mandolin-shaped object? No way.

Assuming you're not broke (you have an expensive custom mando, but that doesn't necessarily mean anything), if you aren't living from week to week, and if you have a few bucks available, here's what I'd do:

I'd find a used Kentucky KM-950. (Probably in the $700 range.) These are really, really nice mandolins for the money, and I don't think i'd be embarrassed to have one at a fest.

My philosophy around buying a used instrument is that they're kinda like a savings account you can enjoy in real time. Assuming you find a good deal, the KM-950 is fairly popular, and you could sell for what you paid for it pretty quickly. Not much risk.

Insure it if it makes you feel better.

Sell it if and when you need the money for something else.

[Charles E.]

Guitar Center had a used Rogue for $29.99 the other day, but it looks like someone snatched that baby up already. The good ones always go fast.

I don't care what you play, that's funny right there.

[ollaimh]

I have an eighties aspen. a Korean A mandolin that was 185 cnd in a pawn shop. solid woods, but Asian woods. great sound for a beater. some of the eighties washburns A's are also great sounding. (you want to find one that doesn't need re frettin g--I re fretted mine but I play it busking, and I busk a lot some years) as was said. craigslist!!!