Working methods of the early Grisman bands?

[SincereCorgi]

A friend hooked me up with a couple really early Grisman records a few days ago. I'd never really listened to his early catalogue, and I was surprised that they were more complicated than subsequent records, very detailed ensemble work with lots of tricky unison passages and interesting arrangements. Does anybody know how they were working back then? Like, were there actual written charts for portions, or did they just rehearse for a thousand hours a day, or was this more studio-based approach with tons of overdubs and retakes?

[Fretbear]

Nine minutes or so of pretty much the original Quintet, post Rice.
Great that this exists.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jAZ7f2uy3ZY

[SternART]

All of the above.........and that is a nice example in the video.....they were very well rehearsed with evolving arrangements as Grisman refined the sound........but always with room for improvising, in fact some of the tunes have whole sections of chord changes for soloists. They played for months before ever performing, and then gigged for awhile before recording the first DGQ album adding tightness to the arrangements. I was David's archivist in those years, recording live shows, and they would listen to and critique the performances afterwards, refining the sound. And they worked really hard in the studio getting it just right, but by that time they sounded pretty much like the record at live performances, but with more excitement...... in the moment kind of solos. They were just a really great band in that era, geeze Tony Rice, Todd Phillips, Darol Anger, and then Mike Marshall by the time they recorded "Hot Dawg".

I've gone to the Mandolin Symposium and played in the Dawg Ensemble........you get to experience how he works, he takes a bunch of students, has a tune in mind, hands out mandolas & mandocellos to round out the sound, as well as two or three mandolin parts, puts us into sections and as the week progresses he keeps changing the arrangement refining right up till the performance concert. Not only does David Grisman write some great music, but he is masterful at arranging for his band.

In recent years the DGQ recording style has changed and they often record live in the studio, with no overdubs. These guys in Grisman's bands are incredible musicians.......as the lineup has evolved over the years.......in fact he is currently breaking in two new members, with George Cole on guitar and Chad Manning on fiddle.......which make an opportunity for Grisman to create new arrangements for his current band and breathe new life into his music. I get to see the DGQ Thursday in Napa.......really looking forward to it!

[Atlanta Mando Mike]

There were written parts. John Carlini, a more formally trained musician with a jazz background, arranged the first record. I got to play a show with him last year where we recreated the first DGQ record and he brought the original charts for the album which I have copies of. They are very cool!!!!

[Spruce]

....or was this more studio-based approach with tons of overdubs and retakes?

Go listen to that first DGQ LP, and keep your ears open for tape edits...(i.e., the first section of Take 1, bridge from Take 6, etc. etc.).

Takes were indeed live, but piecing things together with razor blades and splicing tape was pretty rampant on that recording...

[AlanN]

There were written parts. John Carlini, a more formally trained musician with a jazz background, arranged the first record. I got to play a show with him last year where we recreated the first DGQ record and he brought the original charts for the album which I have copies of. They are very cool!!!!

Wow!

[Perry Babasin]

This is the era I started really listening to acoustic mandolin music. We always considered Dawg music to be way more like Gypsy Jazz than Bluegrass (particularly love the album with Stephane Grapelli). I was always a big fan of Dan Hicks also, but this was so much tighter and musical. It is what got me seriously interested in the mandolin. Here on the west coast they would play in small eclectic venues and it was awesome! Hey - his contortions are semi-Thile-esque! Ha,ha,ha

[allenhopkins]

How about this (http://dla.acaweb.org/cdm/singleitem/collection/Ferrum/id/1768/rec/3) "early Grisman band"?

New York Ramblers, Roanoke BG Festival, 1965.

[Marcus CA]

Nine minutes or so of pretty much the original Quintet, post Rice.
Great that this exists.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jAZ7f2uy3ZY

Decades later, that tune still totally blows me away in its originality and its musical magnificence! That video preserves it all, along with the finish on Mike Marshall's Loar.

[AlanN]

Still marvy after all these years

[tree]

Wow . . . I saw that version of the DGQ at least once, maybe twice, at Memorial Hall at UNC. Those guys are ALL monster musicians. Rock solid rhythm, incredible touch and feel, brilliant soloists, all of 'em. Stephan Grappelli played a gig with them at the same venue a time or two also, IIRC. I still have the old Harmony mandolin I asked Dawg to sign for me, and a t-shirt (now a case rag for my F-5G) from one of those shows!

I doubt they got that tight without rehearsing their butts off. I imagine that represents some serious, concentrated work. I need to remember to use them for inspiration when the mud gets deep and the slogging gets tedious! :mandosmiley:

[Tom Morse]

I put the first DG5 album on my turntable in 1978, put my guitar in the closet, and went out to buy my first mandolin. Thanks for reminding me why!

[tree]

Hah! I put my guitar in the closet too, but it was because I was ashamed to admit I played it after seeing what Tony Rice could do with one!

[SternART]

Just like Chris Thile has inspired a new generation of young mandolin players........for many of us the inspiration was David Grisman.