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View Full Version : New Eastman Octaves In Stock At The Mandolin Store



EdSherry
Apr-14-2014, 7:46pm
(NFI.)

I haven't seen/heard/played them yet, but they just hit the classifieds (under Mandolins, not under CBOM). $999 delivered in Continental US.

Steve-o
Apr-14-2014, 8:04pm
Hey Ed. I just started a thread on this earlier... maybe the moderators can combine... They look nice, and the scale length very playable. I'd like to hear reviews too.

Pete Braccio
Apr-16-2014, 12:59pm
and... the listings are gone from The Mandolin Store.

multidon
Apr-16-2014, 1:29pm
and... the listings are gone from The Mandolin Store.

Wow... That is just weird! :disbelief:

It's like they never existed. Even if they had sold all 6 of them in 2 days (unlikely) they still would list it as a product they sell but are out of stock on. I would speculate that they found some kind of flaw in them significant enough to send back the whole bunch.

Andrew B. Carlson
Apr-16-2014, 5:23pm
Here's (http://web.archive.org/web/20130822184839/http://www.themandolinstore.com/scripts/prodView.asp?idproduct=9699) the archived link to the Mandolin Store's inventory on these.

Eddie Sheehy
Apr-17-2014, 10:04pm
Maybe they figured they'd be direct competition for The Lafferty in a niche market...

multidon
Apr-17-2014, 10:36pm
Don't buy your reasoning Eddie. Dennis is a smart businessman. He surely saw that coming. If he was afraid of competition why order 6 in the first placr? Plus whether someone chose Eastman or Lafferty he still makes money regardless. Plus some would stick with Lafferty just because they're American made. Octaves are hot right now. You see them more and more. Sierra Hull and The Band Perry. Weber is making a lot of carved top om's right now. I still think something else is goin on.

Steve L
Apr-18-2014, 7:35am
I think that fretboard extension is a big mistake.

Manfred Hacker
Apr-19-2014, 7:31am
I think that fretboard extension is a big mistake.

Didn't they ask for design suggestions here?

This extension would be a reason for me not to buy.

Steve L
Apr-19-2014, 3:24pm
Me too.

bratsche
Apr-19-2014, 3:38pm
I think the whole design is ugly looking, personally.

bratsche

Charlieshafer
Apr-19-2014, 4:02pm
I think the whole design is ugly looking, personally.

bratsche

I have to agree; there's nothing here that isn't already available elsewhere. The market may be growing for octaves, but not these Plain Jane ones. They did ask for input earlier, and it seemed like they listened to no one...

foldedpath
Apr-19-2014, 4:32pm
FWIW, the Eastman product page shows it without the fretboard extension:

http://www.eastmanguitars.com/mandolin-family-instruments/

Barry Wilson
Apr-19-2014, 4:39pm
I read the thread on advice. most didnt like the extension or size of the soundhole. and this has both haha

personally I do like the headstock and scale length would be interesting to try, but guess I will stick with the gold tone for now. I like the sound acoustically. for the price of this eastman I would much rather get a gypsy from walt... this summer I making that jump finally... tax man gets paid first hehe

bratsche
Apr-19-2014, 9:52pm
FWIW, the Eastman product page shows it without the fretboard extension:

http://www.eastmanguitars.com/mandolin-family-instruments/

Well, that one looks okay, not ugly to me. Where did that other picture come from? Obviously not from their website....

bratsche

furuta
Apr-19-2014, 10:13pm
The archived version of the Mandolin Store's web page appears to be from last August, according to the URL. Lots of time for lots to have changed.

Edit: And I just noticed that the image on the archived page is the original Rhino mockup drawing as posted here in June 2012.

multidon
Apr-19-2014, 10:40pm
You are all truly missing the point. On April 14 The Mandolin Store posted a classified ad with a link to their website. They said they were in stock. They had a photograph. Not a mockup but the real thing. Their web site said there were six in stock ready to ship. Then two days later April 16 everything vanished. The ad. The link. The listing on the web site. All traces gone like it never existed. And no explanation. And you all are still argueing about the hole being too large and how you don't like the extension. That's the mock up drawing. Neither of those were in yhe photo. I saw the photo so I know what it looked like. I guess not too many of you saw the actual photograph because it wasn't up long enough. The point here is that something strange is going on with these. If we are to believe TMS they had 6 physically in the store ready and available for sale at 999 with gig bag. And no one has explained what went wrong. Inquiring minds want to know!

Steve L
Apr-19-2014, 11:35pm
I really don't care.

Clement Barrera-Ng
Apr-20-2014, 1:59am
I doubt there is any conspiracy there. And I am sure if anyone ask Dennis he will be happy to share what went down.

In any event seeing the Eastman model only made me want the Lafferty model more. I just can't stand the abalone rosette.

Charlieshafer
Apr-20-2014, 7:03am
You are all truly missing the point. !

As Steve says, I think the point is no one cares. It could be something so simple as the store opening up the shipping boxes and finding they'd sent the wrong models. Most people felt it was a pretty blah offering, and now that there's a mysterious disappearance, it's even less exciting.

multidon
Apr-20-2014, 7:34am
I find it kind of odd that so many folks are put off by the abalone rosette. I kind of liked that. Lots of people think those are da bomb on upper end guitars. The feature I found off putting was the tailpiece. Did any one else notice that? Its this big black thing I suppose its ebony that reminds me of a cross between a cello tailpiece and the black monolith from 2001 a space oddessy.

multidon
Apr-21-2014, 7:18am
_Update- I have been in contact with Dennis at The Mandolin Store regarding the Eastman octaves. What Dennis told me happened is that they posted the pictures as soon as they were in stock. But Dennis did not have a chance to inspect them until a couple of days later. When he did inspect them he discovered a few issues with them and he felt it necessary to return them. So my original guess about what happened turned out to be essentially correct.

Dennis is to be commended I think for being a businessman with principles and integrity. He determined that if he sold the octaves as they were, which is what some other businesses would have done, there would havr customer dissatisfaction. Satisfied customers are very important to Dennis. That he refuses to sell products before he deems them ready for market is just simply the right thing to do.

Dennis and I agreed that if Eastman finally does come through with the product with the issues corrected there would definitely be a market for it. We both hope this will happen.

I have posted this with Dennis's permission. NFI buy a satisfied customer here saying TMS is one of the best businesses to do business with here.

cayuga red
Apr-21-2014, 7:29am
In my experience Dennis is an honorable man. Thanks Multi for posting!

Mandobar
Apr-26-2014, 5:11am
I'm not surprised to hear this. Might be a while before we see another sighting…...

Bernie Daniel
Apr-27-2014, 7:29pm
I wonder what kind of user surveys or market research Eastman conducts before introducing a new product? The 805MDC mandocello had at least two issues that users found problematic. A too-wide nut and fret board and an "explosive" tailpiece.

I suppose we need to wait until the actual octave reaches the retail but already there appears to be possible issues with the new instrument could have been avoided with a little market research up front. Maybe they do their research in China and some of these features are what Chinese buyers said they would like?

Pete Braccio
Apr-28-2014, 5:53pm
The user survey was done here in 2012. (http://www.mandolincafe.com/forum/showthread.php?86159-Octave-Mandolin-Project-from-Eastman-Mandolins&highlight=eastman+octave)

Bernie Daniel
Apr-30-2014, 6:48pm
The user survey was done here in 2012. (http://www.mandolincafe.com/forum/showthread.php?86159-Octave-Mandolin-Project-from-Eastman-Mandolins&highlight=eastman+octave)

Thanks for that link -- I do recall that thread now I think.

Pete Braccio
May-01-2014, 1:29am
Not saying that any of the advice was or wasn't taken though. Kinda thinking that when all six octaves had to go back there were at least a few horrendous design decisions either structurally or on the playability side.

I really wish that I could have seen some actual photos of these.

tkdboyd
May-06-2014, 7:33am
This is an interesting development...Ebay Eastman Octave (http://www.ebay.com/itm/Eastman-MDO-20-Octave-Mandolin-Spruce-Top-Rosewood-B-S-Gig-Bag-NEW-24688-/321398860927?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4ad4dd6c7f)

sgrexa
May-06-2014, 8:28am
This is an interesting development...Ebay Eastman Octave (http://www.ebay.com/itm/Eastman-MDO-20-Octave-Mandolin-Spruce-Top-Rosewood-B-S-Gig-Bag-NEW-24688-/321398860927?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4ad4dd6c7f)

NFI but if the Mandolin Store is still advertising these at $999 this seller claims he will beat or match that price. I purchased an Eastman guitar from this seller last summer and all went well. Interesting that they used rosewood on the backs, I bet these sound pretty and would like to try one.

Sean

Mandobar
May-06-2014, 9:18am
AcousticMusic.Org in Connecticut has at least one of the new octaves. Brian told me he did not see any issues on the one he got and he anticipated getting more shortly. If there are any issues the luthier who is in the same building (he is the landlord also) will be sure to give you his opinion. Having worked on instruments for many professional musicians (CSNY, Warren Haynes, Johnny Winter, John Hiatt, and many more) George will give you an honest assessment whether it's what you want to hear or not. NFI, just like these guys a lot and have been a patron there for more than 15 years now.

multidon
May-06-2014, 1:53pm
As far a "beating" the Mandolin Store price the E bay seller is showing rosewood. Dennis had mahogany in stock. So they are making them two different ways.

When the designer from Eastman ran the suggestions thread referenced above very early on they very clearly promisedthe new octave woukd have a carved back and top. Go back and read it for yourself. Now if they could have delivered an archtop at 999 I think that would have been warmly received. But they did not deliver what they promised. It is clearly a flat top. And to my eye it diesnt look much different from a Trinity College just more expensive. Too bad they didn't deliver what was promised.

GKWilson
May-06-2014, 4:28pm
The E-Bay seller pulled the instrument.
Then put it up for sale again at $1199.
Gary

Pete Braccio
May-08-2014, 3:20pm
At least we finally have some specs: 1.75" nut width (way too wide if true), 21" scale, 14" bout, and 3 1/8" body depth.

Pete

The Mandolin Store
May-16-2014, 11:20pm
Well I've been silent about the issues we found as I did not want to give Eastman a black eye. So many questions that I feel like I need to post my observations and why we pulled them and chose not to offer them for sale. We opened two of the six we got and found the same issues with both so decide to end them all back. My assumption was if two were this way they all would be and that I was doing customers a favor by not offering them for sale. The neck was not 1.75". It was 1 7/16"

1 - The tops were sinking a little - they were down about 1/16" right out of the box. Neither the Trinity College or Lafferty model flat tops we sell have any top sinkage. I felt this was serious.

2 - I felt that the neck extension over the body should have a slight shim to give the correct neck angle for string break angle over the bridge. Both the Trinity College and Lafferty models have this. This is just my opinion.

3 - the body shape was wider than normal. This means there is no hard case on the market available that would fit this instrument. A custom build case is not cost effective. I was not comfortable shipping an instrument with a neck this long in a gig bag around the US or the world for that matter. I think it's a recipe for disaster.

Ive been told Eastman will not make these again once the current stock is gone.

Bill Burch
May-17-2014, 12:57am
Remember the email threads where Eastman asked Cafe members what they wanted in an octave mandolin? Lots of good suggestions were offered and an healthy dialogue ensued. Fast forward to this situation..with this pool of potential buyers, and it seems Eastman really missed the boat on this one. Fail.

Bill

Bertram Henze
May-17-2014, 4:35am
Here's (http://web.archive.org/web/20130822184839/http://www.themandolinstore.com/scripts/prodView.asp?idproduct=9699) the archived link to the Mandolin Store's inventory on these.

That is just a drawing there, no photo. Do they exist?

multidon
May-17-2014, 10:59am
Yes Bertram they do exist. The Mandolin Store had a picture posted for 2 days before the listing was pulled. If you blinked you missed it.

Bill they really did miss the boat. Can you imagine the interest if they had delivered on their original promise of a carved arch top octave in the 1200-1300 dollar range? Stores would not be able to keep them in stock if they were the same quality as their other products. But knowing what we know about them now I absolutely would not consider buying one. I wonder if the folks at Eastman monitor this forum and if they know what is being said. I think very highly of Eastman products in general but this was not one if their finest moments.

Kudos to Dennis for being an honest stand up guy.

foldedpath
May-17-2014, 11:39am
That is just a drawing there, no photo. Do they exist?

Eastman pulled the photos from their site, but Google never forgets (except in Europe now, apparently) so here's the wayback machine page with the photos:

http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:lkhmI-ZWcu8J:www.eastmanguitars.com/mdo-10/+&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us

McCabe's has one in stock with a photo:

http://store.mccabes.com/product.php?printable=Y&productid=17251&cat=280&page=1

Who knows what went into the decisions they made, but it sure is tempting to pin the failure on that one decision to make it a flattop instead of a carved archtop. You'd think at this point, they'd be set up to make archtops efficiently enough to place an OM in the market somewhere below the price of a Weber.

ETA: Yes, and thanks Dennis, for the info. I don't think this will hurt Eastman's rep in the long run. They just didn't hit the mark in this one case.

sgarrity
May-17-2014, 12:02pm
They need to hire someone that knows something about mandolins.

The Mandolin Store
May-18-2014, 1:36am
This was the first time we had an Eastman product that we have been disappointed with. We think they make the best import mandolins that are available today.

Bertram Henze
May-18-2014, 4:39am
Those actual photos look much better than the drawing, design-wise. They still lack a zero fret, but that's my personal preference. Sad story about the quality glitch - takes years to build a reputation but only seconds to tear it down again.

Steve L
May-18-2014, 7:46am
Very few American builders use zero frets.

Charlieshafer
May-22-2014, 5:52pm
I played the one at Acousticmusic.org in Guilford, Ct last weekend. I didn't really look over it carefully to take note of the issues Dennis mentioned. It looked O.K., and sounded, O.K. So I guess my total summation teeters somewhere between "it's O.K." or maybe even, "fine, I guess." But I wouldn't have written a check for one. No magic lost.