View Full Version : Stupendous
Of special note:
- Looks like The Antique
- Sam on an A
- Courtney on banjer
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Mark Wilson
Apr-09-2014, 7:38am
Thx, that was fun to watch those kids play. Do you know the year?
UsuallyPickin
Apr-10-2014, 7:36am
Thanks Alan....nice look back .. Bluegrass Hotel days ....... Do you know the particulars on the mandolin young Sam is playing? Nugget or Givens maybe ...... R/
Yes, pre-Hoss, certainly. Doubt a Nugget, could be a Givens, or a converted A-50 them boys sported back then, Doyle had one, I think.
There is some chatter going on what year this is, I say 1970 or 71, but the fact that T has The Antique, this does not jive with what he says in Still Inside, that he obtained the '34 in '74 or '75. And further thought: Clarence died in 1973, so the fact that Tony has this here spells '73 or later for this video.
Curiouser and curiouser...
Further thought: Clarence pawned the '34 at some point, so could very well be pre-1973 for that video with Tony playing it...
What's really interesting to me is Sam's playing. It's not his classic, know it anywhere chop. It's very busy compared to what I think of as Sam's chop today. Also, no pinky plant on the top. He mentioned someplace he started doing that after he broke his arm or wrist? It's a great vid and it's great to hear Tony in full voice. The harmonies are wonderful too. Thanks for that vid Alan.
Mike Bunting
Apr-10-2014, 10:57am
Lonnie Peerce on the fiddle. That seems to be one edition of the Bluegrass Alliance.
brent1308
Apr-10-2014, 12:54pm
Lonnie Peerce on the fiddle. That seems to be one edition of the Bluegrass Alliance.
Definitely. And Bush and Rice left in 71.
Then again, Tony is not playing the Clarence White D-28 in this vid from 71
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f_Q_fkvCLnY&feature=share&list=FLAo3nVNNYb-SmlRw14afJ4A&index=29
Well, straight from the horse's mouth:
"Sam hasn't seen it before either.... he sez it was the summer of 1971, but doesn't recognize the stage. Great video!"
Is that in Bb? See the capos. I thought that was a jazz key. Anything else ever in bluegrass in a flat key signature? Maybe it was A #? Whatever, all praise to the great Tony Rice!
lonestar_shawn
Apr-10-2014, 3:16pm
I don't think that's the Antique. Tony played another guitar with the enlarged soundhole before he got Clarence's guitar. Note that the guitar in the video still has the Martin logo on the headstock. Also, that looks like a rosewood bridge vs. the ebony bridge on the 'bone.
Phil Goodson
Apr-10-2014, 8:23pm
117918Different times, not apples to apples, but comparison pic.
lukmanohnz
Apr-10-2014, 11:25pm
That is beyond stupendous. That is fan-#######'-TASTIC.
Mike Bunting
Apr-11-2014, 12:22am
Anything else ever in bluegrass in a flat key signature?
Ever hear of Bill Monroe?
Mike Bunting
Apr-11-2014, 12:23am
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Uno mas, from the same set. Sam changed mandolins, but not clothing :mandosmiley:
Cue Zephyr
Apr-13-2014, 11:19am
Sweet! Thanks for sharing.
Herbm55
Apr-18-2014, 11:54am
According to some folks on Facebook that are more knowledgeable than I am, that was a newer off the shelf D28 that TR's Dad likely bought for him in FLA. They didn't say if "newer" necessarily means it was IRW or BRW. Anyway, the braces were then scalloped and the top started sinking and supposedly there was a "sound post" wedged under the bridge and back in an attempt to keep the top from sinking further. They were trying to contact TR to get verification, but that was the general consensus. Great videos regardless.
Pete Martin
Apr-18-2014, 2:23pm
Cool vids guys!
lenf12
Apr-21-2014, 10:02am
Nice to see a more pristine (pre-hippy sanding) Ol' Hoss in the "One Tin Soldier" video. What is the 2nd F style Sam is using in "500 Miles"? It sounds better to me than Ol' Hoss. Thanks for sharing these AlanN and brent1308!!
Len B.
Clearwater, FL
brent1308
Apr-22-2014, 10:17am
Nice to see a more pristine (pre-hippy sanding) Ol' Hoss in the "One Tin Soldier" video. What is the 2nd F style Sam is using in "500 Miles"? It sounds better to me than Ol' Hoss. Thanks for sharing these AlanN and brent1308!!
Len B.
Clearwater, FL
That's a different mandolin. I think I heard he played another 37 gibson on one of the Bush/Munde recordings. Perhaps that's it but I'm not so sure the one in the video is a Gibson. He got Hoss two years later in 73.
mikeyes
Apr-23-2014, 4:03pm
That's the same A model shown with Sam in Tottle's mandolin book. I think that it is a Randy Wood conversion of an A-50. I have one of those dated 1973 (#13 in the series) and I spoke to Randy about it. His recollection is a little fuzzy but he thinks that Sam may have gotten one from him. He was working for Tut Taylor at the time that mine was made and while he didn't have it in hand, Tut owned the Loar A-5 around that time too.
The one I have belonged to Larry Sledge and was originally an A-50 that he inherited. The workmanship is clearly Randy Wood - this is the time he made Randy Wood #1 - and the sound very similar to the video. Maybe Sam remembers.
Mike Keyes
ralph johansson
Apr-24-2014, 12:55am
What's really interesting to me is Sam's playing. It's not his classic, know it anywhere chop. It's very busy compared to what I think of as Sam's chop today. Also, no pinky plant on the top. He mentioned someplace he started doing that after he broke his arm or wrist? It's a great vid and it's great to hear Tony in full voice. The harmonies are wonderful too. Thanks for that vid Alan.
I wouldn't describe his present technique as planting, although there's certainly contact between his right hand and the top. But there's a lot of forearm motion.
ralph johansson
Apr-24-2014, 1:00am
Is that in Bb? See the capos. I thought that was a jazz key. Anything else ever in bluegrass in a flat key signature? Maybe it was A #? Whatever, all praise to the great Tony Rice!
Bb is a very natural and versatile key on mandolin and violin. It's not as common in Bluegrass as, e.g., B natural, for some reason. Citing Bill Monroe alone, among his recorded songs in Bb are the Columbia version of Blue Moon of Kentucky, Cheyenne,
and I'm on my Way to the Old Home. IIRC further examples are The Sunset Trail and Life's Railway to Heaven.
And the key of F is very common in Bluegrass.
When Frank Wakefield composed New Camptown Races in 1953, he chose the key of Bb. Why? Can't really know for sure, but I would hazard:
1) Set himself apart from the herd
2) Very mandolinistic relative minor
3) Because he could
I will even go out on a limb and state that NCR legitimized Bb in bluegrass. As ralph says, it's a wonderful key for the mandolin because it has the low to high, has open strings (major 3rd and 6th, neighbor tone in the open A string) and it falls within that middle-of-the-neck area of Bb to B to C, where that lovely chop shape rings like a bell to get the High Lonesome sound. I love the key.
I picked with a lady banjo picker one time who said "I hate Bb and B." That ain't right.
I wouldn't describe his present technique as planting, although there's certainly contact between his right hand and the top. But there's a lot of forearm motion.
um, I beg to differ. Check out https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1AYl8VBfzH4 about 1:20 or so. He plants the little finger and uses his arm. Lots of times the little finger is planted underneath his hand and you can't see. Been doing this for a long time. He mentioned in an old lesson vid. he's picking in the vid how he wants us to pick(pinky not planted, and picking from the wrist, not arms), not like he does now. It works wonderfully for him now, but I use my wrist and don't plant. I'd never actually seen him play without planting and with his wrist until the vid AlanN posted.