My beloved mandolin was DECAPITATED last night - what now?

[Witz]

Sorry for the drama. Just posting here as an ode to my beautiful instrument, for some catharsis really, and hopefully a few words of advice from anyone who has been there.

Jam at our house last night, set mando on the couch where I'd been sitting while I ran to the bathroom, came back to witness my fiddle player plop himself down in the wrong spot - you know where this is going. That sound.... oh the horror. Headstock snapped completely off just above the nut. I could post a picture but will spare you all the gruesome and gory images. Just sickening, really. Feel free to admonish me if you think I deserve it, but in all honesty who puts their instrument back in the case EVERY TIME they get up for a half a second, it's just not realistic. Sh** happens right?

ANYWAY. Life goes on. As much as I'd like to wallow in self-pity, I have gigs Friday and Saturday, and Wintergrass jamming to do very soon. Thankfully my fiddle playing friend owns a mandolin that I can use in the interim.

So this is the advice part - took the dismembered mando into Dusty Strings today (best acoustic shop in Seattle) and their professional assessment was they are not entirely comfortable/confident in the epoxy-heavy surgery required to bring it back to life. Which I guess means sending back to Weber for a full neck replacement (yes it's a Weber, yes I know this makes it worse). No idea what this would cost me. I'm aware of the Weber operations relocation currently underway, not aware if they're up and running yet and when they would even be able to take a look. Any opinions on how different my instrument could be after a full neck replacement? Body is intact, so it should still pretty much sound as I'm used to?

Other option would be to take the insurance money and run. Have yet to talk to my insurance company, but I expect this to be covered under my personal property insurance. Anyone have experience filing an insurance claim for damaged instrument property, if they are likely to cover repairs or full original value of the mandolin? The fact that my instruments are insured is my one comforting saving grace in this whole debacle. That means I could be looking in the 2K-3K range for a new or used mando... I love my Weber and would lean that way, but I'd be interested to hear other makes and models to consider. Probably a pointless and exasperating question, I know it's all about what sounds and feels good to you. But if anyone has a good place to start I'd love to hear about it.

For God's sake people take care of your instruments and always look behind you when you sit down!


p.s. - The damaged mandolin is an Absaroka A-style, as far as I can tell Weber doesn't actually make this model anymore but it looks pretty similar to the Yellowstone. Anybody have any idea what the difference is in my particular model, why it was discontinued, etc?

[Wolfmanbob]

Shouldn't the fiddle player pay for this...not the insurance company?

[sgarrity]

Ouch......I'd check with your insurance company first. Not sure what they'll say about this. Do you have a rider for your instruments? I know more than one person who has experienced heartache trying to get instrument claims paid. Heritage and Clarion are the way to go when you're insuring instruments.

If you can get the claim paid, you'd be much further ahead. A used Absoroka would probably sell for $1200-1400. Not really worth a full neck replacement IMHO.

[mrmando]

Yeah, you might be out of luck with insurance unless the mandolin is specifically scheduled on your policy. If the insurance company won't come through, you may have to consider leaning on your fiddler. These things can get complicated between friends.

I came within microseconds of having someone sit on my viola at a party, and I've tried to avoid leaving instruments on the couch since then.

[Jim]

Wow, sorry to hear about that. Good luck with whatever repair/ replacement direction you choose.

[GTison]

My insurance only covers instruments that are not in ANY professional use. ( being paid for music) Your insurance may be different. Check with your agent before you send it back to Weber. But Weber should be able to give a good estimate needed for insurance etc. as well. Good luck. I have seen pictures of repairs on Frets.com and other places maybe that looked good.

[Austin Bob]

We all know the story of one very famous mandolin that was brought back to life after getting smashed. Hard to imagine it would be the same. If I were in your shoes, I would swallow hard and move on.

A couch is a place to sit, and that's what the fiddle player did. Now if he sat on your case and busted your mando while it was inside, I would agree that he is to blame. But we've all sat down on something we weren't supposed to, just ask my cat.

But that really sucks. I hope your insurance helps to cover some of the loss.

[mandolirius]

"Feel free to admonish me if you think I deserve it, but in all honesty who puts their instrument back in the case EVERY TIME they get up for a half a second, it's just not realistic. Sh** happens right?"

It does indeed. However, in my years of observation of jams I've noticed that the couch seems to be a bit of flytrap. Big, stuffed chairs the same. I sure don't put my instrument in the case every time either but I have learned to avoid leaving it on a sofa or a chair.

Fortunately, I didn't have to learn it the hard way. My condolences. If it makes you feel any better, I know of a few mandolins that have been re-necked with no appreciable change in sound.

[Bill Baldridge]

I prefer to lean mine against something so that it can be kicked over, but it has yet to be sat upon.

[Stephen Perry]

I don't understand why a repair would be epoxy heavy. If all the splinters can be put back in place, couldn't hide glue and jigging do the realignment of parts, followed by cutting channels to inlay reinforcements? I really do not like epoxy.

But I'm a violin guy, so maybe mandolins are different.

[belbein]

I don't understand why a repair would be epoxy heavy. If all the splinters can be put back in place, couldn't hide glue and jigging do the realignment of parts, followed by cutting channels to inlay reinforcements? I really do not like epoxy.

But I'm a violin guy, so maybe mandolins are different.

Not like epoxy? That's like not liking Oxygen! Epoxy is the glue that holds the world together! You are welcome to my Chapel of the Holy Epoxy any time you're in Atlanta. Come and be converted!

[belbein]

... came back to witness my fiddle player plop himself down in the wrong spot - you know where this is going. That sound.... oh the horror. Headstock snapped completely off just above the nut. I could post a picture but will spare you all the gruesome and gory images. Just sickening, really.

Wait, wait, I've read this story already. So in a fit of rage, you grabbed the banjo player's banjo and beat the ever loving . . .

Sorry. That was in bad taste.

Or not.

[John McCoy]

First, my sympathies.

Second, a practicality:

All the mentions here of insurance miss something very important. Most homeowner's policies, which would include renter's (tenant's) policies and condo owner's policies, contain a personal liability clause that covers damage negligently done by the policy owner. I don't know anything about Washington insurance law, but in some states the fiddle player's policy would cover the damage he did. Depending upon applicable law and policy terms, the coverage could be for full replacement cost--up to the limit of liability clause. And there's virtually nowhere that the claim would cause the policy premium to increase. (But, FWIW, and this is important: it could lead to policy cancellation.) So, you might be able to be reimbursed by the fiddle player's policy. But he has to initiate the claim; unlike with auto insurance, you can pursue the claim with his insurance company once he's opened it, but until then you have no standing to approach them. (This last element varies by state law, but it's the general practice.)

[mrmando]

Most homeowner's policies, which would include renter's (tenant's) policies and condo owner's policies, contain a personal liability clause that covers damage negligently done by the policy owner. I don't know anything about Washington insurance law, but in some states the fiddle player's policy would cover the damage he did.

Well, the damage took place at Witz's home, not the fiddler's, so would the fiddler's insurance still apply?

[allenhopkins]

1. Not to argue with repair specialists, but epoxy's not the most preferred method of headstock reattachment. Check out this thread. Hot hide glue would be better, if the luthiers among us are to be believed, and if the glue surface doesn't seem adequate, splines or dowels can be inserted to strengthen the joint.

2. Leaving aside the intricacies of insurance coverage, I'd say that your fiddle-playing friend should pay at least part of the repair cost. You were partially negligent for setting the instrument down on a couch, but he was even more negligent in not looking where he parked his butt, in an "instrument-rich environment." Probably would be best to keep the whole matter out of the insurance realm, if at all possible; not talking about thousands of dollars here, in all probability.

3. Weber has the best of reputations on the Cafe for customer service. Seems likely that they'll do everything possible to make the situation right. Give them a call or e-mail ASAP and discuss it. And, if you go for the repair before the "raw" wood at the break has the chance to accumulate any dirt, finger oil etc., it may be fixable with less trauma than you think. I had an F-2 headstock broken off "back in the day" when a drunk college kid punched me at a coffeehouse (whole 'nother story), and it was almost invisibly reattached, with the repair holding up for years afterwards.

[Pete Jenner]

Get John Hamlett's advice on repair. I'm sure he will say "Get it done as soon as possible with hot hide glue." Maybe repost in Builders and repair.

[Tom Cherubini]

About taking care of treasured instruments, I have a friend, Harry Allen, who today is a top tenor sax man, and through the years when I've seen him playing in clubs around the New York area, he always brought his sax off stage with him when he came to sit at people's tables in between sets. He simply didn't trust people who might go up on the stand for some reason and crash it down.
I don't blame him a bit. I lent my best guitar to a musician friend one time because his had been stolen and his bass player drank too much and while getting off the stand knocked the guitar off its stand and stepped right through it with her high heels, utterly destroying it. So I can commiserate. Bad luck!


Strings/Thomas

[rico mando]

Glue it . if the glue does not work then replace the neck

[Marty Jacobson]

If it was a clean break, then it should be a pretty straightforward repair. A full neck replacement isn't that horrible, either. I don't think we're talking thousands of dollars here.... maybe you can split the cost with the fiddle player and be back in business.

[Bill Clements]

Very sorry to read about your accident. I have a rider that includes full replacement on my mandolin, but only for non-professional use. (the rider is is for $8500 and only costs $10 a year) I had to provide an appraisal written by the luthier. You might have to pay your deductible in the very least under a typical homeowners plan, so it may not be worth submitting. Did the fiddle player offer to pay anything? Seems like the decent thing to do under the circumstances.
For future reference, check out Heritage Insurance: http://www.musicins.com/
Best of luck.

[Jim Ferguson]

Sorry for your decapitation...IMHO it really is not the fiddle players fault & I would not be holding him/her liable in any way/shape/form........really a tragic accident & I can feel your pain.
I hope the insurance can come through for you but either way my advice is to move on to a new or used mando.
Good luck.
Peace

[John McCoy]

Well, the damage took place at Witz's home, not the fiddler's, so would the fiddler's insurance still apply?

The coverage goes with the insured, no matter where he is, unless a superior liability policy is in force (e.g., automobile liability, professional liability). But there are limits, and, again, they vary by policy provisions and state law, and I know nothing about Washington State insurance laws. But checking into it is free.

[Jordan Ramsey]

First off, my apologies... I know exactly how you feel. The Gibson mandolin in my signature was a competition prize, one of the best mandolins you could win in 2008 (retailed for $10,000), and my first good mandolin. It got ran over by a car in a TKL case two months after I won it.

Same deal as yours, broken neck. Could have been much worse, I got very lucky that it wasn't totaled. My crack was pretty clean right behind the nut.... and today, it truly sounds better than it ever has, and you can barely see the cosmetic unless you're looking real close. Jackie Miller at Gibson did a fantastic job, I think he said he used epoxy (remember him saying that it would be stronger than it was before the break). No clue on that end. I'm sure Weber will fix you up for a price if your insurance doesn't come through. Like you, I was half at fault-- I didn't load out the instrument, and didn't have a pro insurance policy at the time (which I've been told you need if you make one penny with that mandolin outside of your home). I ended up taking the hit because it was my (now ex ) girlfriend who left it behind the vehicle, and my fault for letting her load it (new rule was made that night). I always tell people... for two months, I had the best $15 dollar mandolin on the planet. Now I have the best $815 dollar mandolin on the planet.

[Bertram Henze]

Feel free to admonish me if you think I deserve it...

Well, since you said it

I took this thread as an admonition to myself to at last order that pub prop I have seen fellow musicians use so often.

[Ivan Kelsall]

I'm really sorry to hear your story.I know i'd be just as sickened as you if anything happened to either of mine - it nearly did. I use my PC a lot as a music source for practicing.I put my mandolin case on top of a book case & take my mandolin out & if i need to do something else,99.9% of the time i put it back in it's case.One time i didn't. I put the mandolin on my swivel chair instead of the case.When i came back into the room,forgetting that my mandolin was on the chair,i almost sat on it. I was a split second away from your scenario. It now goes back into the case every time, & i also lock it just in case one of my 2 cats should ever jump onto it & knock it off ,it only takes a few seconds to make it safe(er).
Re.what to do - take as many good pics. as you can of the damage, & send them to Bruce Weber - let him have first shot at recommending what should be done. As Allen Hopkins says,Weber have one of the very finest reputations going.However,they are in the process of moving from Montana to Oregon.How that will affect what they can do for you right now would be for Bruce Weber to say. If it is repairable,there are many excellent luthiers on here who might take the job on for you - good luck,
Ivan