jamgrass bands

[Justus True Waldron]

I'm not familiar with either version enough to make a call here, but I know this happens with a lot of tunes with roots that go back before bluegrass. People passed things down by ear, things changed, and eventually two almost completely different tunes exist with the same name. Chinquapin hunting is a good example of this. Here is another humorous article that deals with that exact issue, this one written by Greg Liszt of Crooked Still and the Deadly Gentlemen.

And from the same source a funny article dealing with jamgrass...

[Markus]

Not so funny article, if you ask me. I read no respect for the subject of the joke in the jamgrass one, only mockery.

I have heard enough of the same tired jokes about bluegrass stereotypes for years too. Neither tickle my funny bone.

[Goodin]

I think that "Jamgrass" is responsible for many younger generations to get into bluegrass. When I was in my teens and early twenties in the 1990's I was a huge fan of Phish, Grateful Dead, and String Cheese. Then through these bands I discovered Old & In The Way, Seldom Scene, and Yonder, and the like which led me to discover more traditional bluegrass. Speaking for myself and practically all of my friends my age who listen to bluegrass music, it wouldn't have happened if we hadn't discovered "Jamgrass".

[FLATROCK HILL]

Re the two articles linked by Justus T.W., I got a kick out of both.

I love and respect the old, (what I would call) Traditional Bluegrass/Fiddletunes. That fact didn't stop me from recognizing a cleverly written and (to me) humorous article.

Finding humor in the 'Jamgrass' artcle was even easier!

[Justus True Waldron]

Not so funny article, if you ask me. I read no respect for the subject of the joke, only mockery.

Well to each their own I guess. While Greg's bands have not always been all that "traditional" I know for a fact from talking to him that he knows very much what bluegrass and old time are and can play them and has a deep respect for them. Not really sure what you've taken offence to here, but perhaps you just haven't been in enough old time jams to have that happen. That particular joke article was about old time specifically, and I've definitely had that very problem at old time jams - having to play the first four bars of a tune because the name alone isn't specific enough. To me it's funny because I've seen it happen, and that's just another thing that proves to me that the author clearly has played in old time jams and experienced the same thing. I'm guessing he wouldn't be playing in old time jams in the first place if all he wanted to do was mock them...

Oh and if your issue was instead with the way he "quoted" other professional musicians - I'm pretty certain he only does that with people he knows to a certain extent. Again, to each their own, and perhaps you need to know Greg a little bit, but I find that whole site pretty hilarious...

[catmandu2]

I think that "Jamgrass" is responsible for many younger generations to get into bluegrass. When I was in my teens and early twenties in the 1990's I was a huge fan of Phish, Grateful Dead, and String Cheese. Then through these bands I discovered Old & In The Way, Seldom Scene, and Yonder, and the like which led me to discover more traditional bluegrass. Speaking for myself and practically all of my friends my age who listen to bluegrass music, it wouldn't have happened if we hadn't discovered "Jamgrass".

That's an important point: while many folks gain entree into various folk/trad forms through the distal perimeters, many eventually do swim back upstream to purer waters. For those who like to see its "purity" maintained continuously, it may be frustrating to see young folks swimming so far downstream--but the wider dispersion also provides benefits: mandolin and its trad forms are probably more popular now than ever--thanks to Jerry, Dawg, et al. And the fact is--many of these folks who started with Jerry are now into Bill (I did too...actually, I started with Jimmy Page)

[Markus]

Goodin, that's the case for me too. Eventually one sobers up, cuts the hair shorter, and starts on the path to family - in my opinion, an `open tent' attitude can gain a lot of young families who appreciate acoustic, handmade music.

To be honest, my family goes to the traditional music [multigenre] festival around here as the whole official bluegrass/IBMA world contains all sorts of stuff that I'm not a big fan of. I have seen plenty of `bluegrass' that played what I would call country and gospel. Given my wife is not at all a fan of modern country music or gospel, it took only a few shows of such for her to no longer be pulling for any larger bluegrass festival as anything beyond known bands that play what Bill, Lester, and Earl played.

I really like Mandolin Mick's `Traditional Bluegrass' labeling as well - a specific category for people who play fairly strictly in the style of the old greats. Once you can specify that `old sound' music then you allow the tradition to keep moving on and leave arguing about exactly who is allowed into the tent to the bluegrass cops.

As someone with a spouse who wasn't into bluegrass when we met ... a big tent encompasses our family, a smaller tent [as currently defined] only brings myself in.

[Markus]

Well to each their own I guess. While Greg's bands have not always been all that "traditional" I know for a fact from talking to him that he knows very much what bluegrass and old time are and can play them and has a deep respect for them.

Sure, but his lack of respect for jam type music is quite apparent.

I read that article first, so the old-time article did not come off as self-deprecating humor.

[Laird]

Goodin, that's the case for me too. Eventually one sobers up, cuts the hair shorter, and starts on the path to family - in my opinion, an `open tent' attitude can gain a lot of young families who appreciate acoustic, handmade music.

Describes my situation, too. As someone who grew up hating the Country and Western music I heard in my dad's pickup as a kid--and that would have been the over-produced, big-haired, rhinestone crap that came out in the 60s--I had no interest in any music that seemed to fit anywhere in that general social-political spectrum. It wasn't till I heard Captain Trips and a bunch of other longhairs playing bluegrass in Old and in the Way that I was even willing to give it a chance.

'Course, once I gave it a chance, I loved it. I found my soul music! That opened me up to other strains of country-inflected rock, and eventually, by way of Gram Parsons and Chris Hillman, I even listen these days to some Buck Owens or George Jones--stuff that would have made me retch as a youngster. (Still can't handle the Conway Twitty brand, though.)

The current permutations of Americana music (and the absence of the kind of clear social divide that kept longhairs and rednecks at odds throughout the Vietnam era) make it a lot easier for kids to find their way to traditional music. The "gateway drugs" for kids at the college where I teach tend to be acts like Gillian Welch and Old Crow Medicine Show (though they're still listening to Phish and the Dead, too). Sooner or later they end up playing the Stanley Brothers at the open jam before they're through here, and that's a good argument for keeping the tent as large as possible.

That said, these days I'd just as soon go to small regional festivals that don't lure the big acts anyhow. As for what happens at the larger festivals, I don't much care.

[catmandu2]

I really like Mandolin Mick's `Traditional Bluegrass' labeling as well - a specific category for people who play fairly strictly in the style of the old greats.

Absolutely. As in "jazz," for example--possibly the broadest category of music ever, as it commonly provides the container in which to stow every kind of music people can't dig...and typically is the representation for everything from "art music" to Kenny G--this type of breakdown is necessary

[AlanN]

I like that label, too. Back then, bg was bg. Now, not so much.

When I talk to folks and say I like jazz, I have a very specific grouping in mind. There used to be a radio station out of Trenton, NJ WYRS which hosted a weekly show 'Jazz The Way You Like It (jazz from the 40's, 50's, 60's). My kinda music...

[Justus True Waldron]

Sure, but his lack of respect for jam type music is quite apparent.

I read that article first, so the old-time article did not come off as self-deprecating humor.

Oh ok you were mostly referring to the other article... well not to keep this going too much longer but I think it's once again a case of I guess you have to know the guy to get it... I know Steve Roy (mandolin player mentioned in the article) a little bit as he's a staple of the festival scene up here in the Northeast. Great picker, we were at a lot of the same jams over the summer. Plays bass with Joe Walsh a lot too... and being that he's from the Northeast/Boston scene as is Greg (the author) I know they are both in the same circle of friends and more then likely they are both good friends. I also know that Greg is no stranger to jamming (or Bill Kieth's Tipi, I suspect...) So I'd be wildly surprised if that article was in anything but good fun of something both the author and the subject could appreciate. But again, to each their own. I didn't mean to pull the conversation off topic, just wanted to add a couple of laughs loosely based off the subject...

Oh for the record, I like the labels Traditional Bluegrass and Progressive Bluegrass quite a bit and have been using them for some time... still doesn't solve the "what is bluegrass?" Debate. For the music I generally listen to and am around it covers the bases though. Pretty much every genre needs sub-genres at some point. I love jazz, ranging from Dixieland to Swing to Be-bop and post-bop and Jazz Fusion both 70's and modern. I even like some progressive rock, though mostly older prog. Most of everything I just mentioned can be fit under the heading "jazz", but so can things like Frank Sinatra and Kenny G, who I can't dig. I'm fine with that though... I'm not so against sub genres in bluegrass either, and it seems they already exist to a certain extent.