Children in Bluegrass - How young should they start learning?

**sarai** · Jul-24-2012, 11:03am

I have a 5 year old and a 6 year old (both boys) who seem to have some interest in music both. The 6 year old says he wants to play banjo. I would love to get them involved but I am concerned that they are too young. Anyone have experience in bringing their little ones on board with stringed instruments? Did you get lessons for them, or did you teach them the basics?

At so young, I'm nervous about them with the responsibility of an expensive instrument. I don't want to spend to little on instruments that they will be deterred from playing because of their quality either.

**catmandu2** · Jul-24-2012, 11:32am

Fiddle, and/or ukulele. If a child aspires to play banjo, specifically, the rudiments of three-finger picking can be learned on a uke--as well as frailing

I'm highly biased--having started with guitar myself, but: if a child shows some aptitude, you might consider starting on guitar--which can also be "sized" like fiddle; after guitar, it's easy to pick up the other instruments (assuming that fingerpicking is learned as well as flatpicking)

**pjlama** · Jul-24-2012, 11:38am

I have four young sons and let them play my stuff supervised. We have a drum kit they love to play, piano, etc. We do have a cheaper guitar and bass and whatnot that they can use whenever they wish. I did lessons on piano for with the older two now my 6 yr old is starting drum lessons and my 9 yr old bass. My 10 month old loves when I play for him, my 3 yr old is a total maniac so I keep a close eye on him, so far he's more interested in making messes than playing. I'm not pushing very hard only if they want but I do ask what instruments they like and get them lessons at their request. I'm sure some of them will fall in love with playing and I'll support that but I'm not going to be a pusher. I started playing bass at 11 because I just had to, nobody encouraged me and I am so happy that I did. I'll play til I die and in many ways it defines me, elevates me, keeps me centered.

**250sc** · Jul-24-2012, 12:00pm

I'm a fan of having a playable uke around the house for kids. They can play it if and when they want and if it gets banged up it's no big deal to me.

**sarai** · Jul-24-2012, 2:27pm

Originally Posted by 250sc

I'm a fan of having a playable uke around the house for kids. They can play it if and when they want and if it gets banged up it's no big deal to me.

This uke thing is an interesting idea, except I wouldn't have a clue what to help them with on it... WIth the one son specifically asking to try Banjo I'm leaning on letting him get one. Unless there is some specific advise that says it os super difficult. I dunno.

**palosfv3** · Jul-24-2012, 3:03pm

I believe that starting a child out in music should be done as early as possible. A number of years ago The Chicago Tribune did a series of articles on the development of the human brain from birth to the late teens . In the series they mentioned that the same part of the brain which controls language also controls our musical ability. A 3 years old or so is capable of learning multiple languages and music is just another form of language . The articles also stated the between the ages between 9 and 14 ( hope my memory is correct ) are the years in which the human brain develops and learns the more than any other time in our life. .
There is also another benefit of learning music at an early age . Its a great memory trainer . This becomes an advantage in learning and helps them greatly in their academic studies. Its a sad thing that we don't demand music as a mandatory part of the early education of our children. It fustrates me to see our school districts cut music out of the children's educational curriculum as " We can afford it " and " its not necessary " . Only if they would realize how much this could help them help our kids.

My hats off to you for starting them out early .

**250sc** · Jul-24-2012, 3:09pm

Originally Posted by sarai

This uke thing is an interesting idea, except I wouldn't have a clue what to help them with on it... WIth the one son specifically asking to try Banjo I'm leaning on letting him get one. Unless there is some specific advise that says it os super difficult. I dunno.

Banjo has a much longer scale length than a 5 or 6 year old might be able to play. I think I read that you are in Michigan. Take them to Elderly if that is correct.

**John Flynn** · Jul-24-2012, 3:50pm

Here's a thought: A banjo uke, strung and tuned like a 4-string mandolin. Advantages:
1. It looks like a banjo and it technically is one of sorts
2. It's easy to play and a good scale length for a kid
3. Tuned like and mandolin, you can help them with it, as can any mandolin instructor
4. A decent one is not all that expensive
5. Elderly in Lansing appears to have a wide variety of them in stock

If the child really wants a real, 5-string banjo, tuned for bluegrass, you might consider one of the miniature, or "travel" banjos out there, like the Gold Tone "Plucky." Only a 16" scale length and only about $260 new.

Personally, I made a mistake with my daughter trying to teach her guitar. She wanted to learn, but didn't really want to put in the practice time. I got her a decent, 1/2 sized instrument, but I pushed her too hard to practice, with all the best intentions, but she gave it up and never went back to it. There was that whole father/daughter thing going on. I guess some parents can teach their own kids, but if I had it to do over, I would have gotten her lessons.

**grassrootphilosopher** · Jul-24-2012, 4:10pm

Originally Posted by sarai

This uke thing is an interesting idea, except I wouldn't have a clue what to help them with on it... WIth the one son specifically asking to try Banjo I'm leaning on letting him get one. Unless there is some specific advise that says it os super difficult. I dunno.

Basically you can´t help your children with music. A prophet has no honor in his own country. Other than that, let them try out what they want and what they can lay hands on. Let your children learn from others as much as possible. They will then get back to you to learn more, if by then they´re not better than you.

**sarai** · Jul-24-2012, 4:10pm

you might consider one of the miniature, or "travel" banjos out there,

I think I was thinking about this method.

but I pushed her too hard to practice, with all the best intentions, but she gave it up and never went back to it.

I do fear this which is part of why I want to make sure I don't start them too early.

**chhearn** · Jul-24-2012, 4:18pm

elderly has soprano uke strings with tuning in fifths...works great with a cheap uke (as long as the tuners are geared).

my son is almost four and he is still a wild man, but we play around with the mando-uke and have some fun together with a version of 'molly and tenbrooks' rewritten about monster trucks...any arrangements of songs from his children's cd that i have worked out have been big hits with him and his little sister...

i am optimistic about the future, but will heed the experienced fathers' advice on this post about pushing too hard...thanks.

**catmandu2** · Jul-24-2012, 4:31pm

Ukes and recorders, recorders and ukes...

I went into Wal Mart one day and played all of the ukes on the shelves...bought all of them that were "playable"; a few of them are actually not bad sounding at all, although of course intonation is imperfect. $16.00, and they're one of my kids' favorite "toys"

My kids (7 year-olds) can play all of my instruments--except for my woodwinds--with supervision. They enjoy emulating my picking styles, and they love their little fingerpicks I give them--they "can't" play their ukes without them

I think one of the valuable things we can impart to our kids is immersion in a musical environment. My kids can't help but hear playing and singing every day. Sometimes, they say, "stop dad"... but they generally love it. I think they benefit from me modeling how to play, make music, and entertain. They're proud when children gather around us in parks when I'm playing--they notice that other children experience music wonderously and curiously. Kids always ask many questions about playing the instruments, so my kids acquire lots of information about the whole thing regularly, whether they're aware of it or not

One more anecdote: I started playing with my dad's steel guitar at age 7. These can be great fun and good for acquring skills such as ear development--and played intuitively

**John Flynn** · Jul-24-2012, 4:32pm

You might consider the Academy of Bluegrass online. What I like about it is that it is interactive and self-paced. No one is pushing you, so nothing to get burned out about, but there is a lot of good positive feedback, which is very rewarding. I like it a lot, but I can imagine it would be even better for the younger set, because they are so oriented to the Internet. I've noticed that AOB has a wide range of aged students, including a few very young ones.

**sarai** · Jul-24-2012, 4:35pm

I believe that starting a child out in music should be done as early as possible. A number of years ago The Chicago Tribune did a series of articles on the development of the human brain from birth to the late teens . In the series they mentioned that the same part of the brain which controls language also controls our musical ability. A 3 years old or so is capable of learning multiple languages and music is just another form of language . The articles also stated the between the ages between 9 and 14 ( hope my memory is correct ) are the years in which the human brain develops and learns the more than any other time in our life. .
There is also another benefit of learning music at an early age . Its a great memory trainer . This becomes an advantage in learning and helps them greatly in their academic studies. Its a sad thing that we don't demand music as a mandatory part of the early education of our children. It fustrates me to see our school districts cut music out of the children's educational curriculum as " We can afford it " and " its not necessary " . Only if they would realize how much this could help them help our kids.

My hats off to you for starting them out early .

I like it - good encouragement.

You might consider the Academy of Bluegrass online.

I may look into this.

**sarai** · Jul-24-2012, 4:42pm

Ukes and recorders, recorders and ukes...

and I might try this too. They can play them while I'm practicing n such.

**Charlieshafer** · Jul-24-2012, 5:12pm

At that age, no reason not to start them. We've hosted Bearfoot's bluegrass camp for kids, and had a bunch of 5-6 year olds in the starter section, and many have stuck with it and are regular attendees at the jam we host. Forcing them to practice daily? Well, you can suggest it, but I wouldn't force it. I do think that you can make a deal with them, that if you're going to buy an instrument for them, they have to play it at least 10 minutes a day, even if it's just noodling around. You'll know soon enough how serious they are.

I do think a banjo is tough to start on, but not impossible. John mentioned a banjo uke, which could be the ticket. Uke tuning and chords are super easy, many of them one or two fingered. But let them have a go at something. Sure, they may lose interest, but, heck, what if they don't? They have a nice head start, for sure. I know you'll hear tons of stories about how people lost interest because they "started too young" but I have a boatload of examples that also show otherwise.

**palosfv3** · Jul-24-2012, 5:15pm

Originally Posted by sarai

I think I was thinking about this method.

I do fear this which is part of why I want to make sure I don't start them too early.

Take a look at Mark O'Connors web site about his method of teaching violin to youngsters. He hits on the issue of music training and allowing kids to explore music to find what is of interest to them .

http://markoconnor.com/index.php?pag...&family=method

**catmandu2** · Jul-24-2012, 5:44pm

Originally Posted by palosfv3

Take a look at Mark O'Connors web site about his method of teaching violin to youngsters. He hits on the issue of music training and allowing kids to explore music to find what is of interest to them .
]

I'll have to look at that--that's our model too. My approach (with my own kids) is non-directive. If nothing else, I'll be certain that my kids were exposed to A LOT of music, and a lot of musical context. I think the context piece is in fact the most important piece--in nurturing my kids' relationship with music in their lives. And I think the exploration is a vital piece--especially at this age

**TNT** · Jul-24-2012, 6:06pm

My oldest started on fiddle at 3 (Started on a 1/16th size) and decided he wanted to play mandolin at 5. I bought him a rover and dropped the tuning 4 notes and put a capo on at the 4th fret, So he was still playing in 440 but the frets were closer for him to learn with his short little fingers. Then my youngest started about the same age on the fiddle but use to keep it pretty simple. Marshal ( my fiddle player) Has really only been taking breaks for about 2 and a half years. The biggest thing is keep it FUN and praise them for every right note they get. My guys will jam just the 2 of them and are constantly trading licks. They Love it!

Both my boys learned different when starting. Marshal the youngest want me to play the line 10 times so he could get the tune in his head and then I would write it out in a simple tab. Once he got that line I would work on the phrasing and timing of it. Wyatt (mandolin/fiddle player) was a monkey see monkey do kid . We spent a lot of time nose to nose I play a couple notes he play them back then add a few more. To me there is nothing cooler then making music with my boys.

They are 7 and 9 now and having a blast. They are opening for Rhonda Vincent at the end of August. Here is a video from June/12. If I can help in anyway please feel free to contact me direct.

**catmandu2** · Jul-24-2012, 6:19pm

Originally Posted by palosfv3

Take a look at Mark O'Connors web site about his method of teaching violin to youngsters. He hits on the issue of music training and allowing kids to explore music to find what is of interest to them .

http://markoconnor.com/index.php?pag...&family=method

Cool. I scrolled down to Mark's piece about context. My feeling is that--the relationship with music (understanding, feeling for) will be highly influenced by the child's total experience of music. Is it fun? Is it interesting? What do we do with it? If music is meaningful, then it will have more value in the child's life. If they're around people making music--and experiencing the social functions of music (context)--it will make more pragmatic sense to them, as well as all the other things

**Ivan Kelsall** · Jul-25-2012, 1:20am

As long as they're able to hold the instrument,no age is too young. Earl Scruggs began by sitting on the floor with the banjo resting on the floor beside him as he was too small to hold the weight. I have a documentary Video tape about the 'Gypsy Jazz' culture,from whence came Django Reinhardt.Those guys set their children off learning to play guitar around the age of 6.The idea of having a Uke around the home is a very good one.It's light,easy to hold,the basic chords are easy & a youngster can learn to 'make music' pretty quickly.That's a really good thing for boosting their confidence,
Ivan

**JeffD** · Jul-25-2012, 6:42am

Originally Posted by Ivan Kelsall

As long as they're able to hold the instrument,no age is too young.

I don't know any musician who doesn't wish he(she) started earlier.

I wish I started ten years before I was born, actually.

Earl Scruggs began by sitting on the floor with the banjo resting on the floor beside him as he was too small to hold the weight.

Hey, I can relate. I am still too small.

**Gerard Dick** · Jul-25-2012, 7:19am

I remember seeing a you tube clip of a very young Ricky Skaggs on stage with Monroe. Considering that he was good enough to attract attention from the Master he must have been playing for quite a while already.