Calling all wood experts...

**Patrick Gunning** · Feb-22-2004, 1:28am

Hey all you wood experts. A while ago while fishing around under the workbench for a block of maple (for making bridges), I stumbled across 2 big chunks of this stuff. Being curious, I cut a couple of quartersawn blanks out of the lumber and made a one-piece, solid-foot bridge for my 1919 Gibson A. I have tried using Red's bridge designs as well as solid-foot and plain-arched bridges out of ebony and maple, but all of these designs, though powerful and loud, took away from the richness and woody tones of the A (with its 85 year old ebony bridge). But when I put this new bridge on... wow... The volume went way up, and it not only retained its woody vintage tone but it seemed to improve as well. The only problem is I haven't the slightest idea what I'm working with here. The only clue I have is that this wood was used as dunnage for a steel shipment from the Philippines about 15 or so years ago (my dad used to have a huge pile of the stuff). Take a look at the pics below and see if you can help me out by identifying the stuff (disregard the fuzziness and burns from my bad table saw).

Thanks,

Gunning

**Patrick Gunning** · Feb-22-2004, 1:29am

bridge made from the stuff

**Patrick Gunning** · Feb-22-2004, 1:31am

bah poor scan quality
*socks old scanner in arm*

**Bluemando** · Feb-22-2004, 2:51am

I am no wood expert, but I do deal a lot with steel shipments, since i work at a machine shop. And most of the wood used for steel shipping (to my experience here) is oak.
The pic kinda looks like oak also I think.

**Patrick Gunning** · Feb-22-2004, 3:01am

trying to add a better pic (upped the DPI's, took a non-fuzzy, non-burnt section)

yay - success! hope that helps you guys to ID it.

**Mteresko** · Feb-22-2004, 3:38am

I would hazard a guess that it is apitong. It is often used for crates and truck beds.

**Patrick Gunning** · Feb-22-2004, 3:46am

yes I know I am being a caffiene-high night owl, but i figured some stuff to add. This wood is really heavy and dense, and about twice as hard to saw and sand as any hard maple or ebony - god knows I practically burned off a layer of a sanding drum for my drill press trying to round off about a 1/4 inch of extra wood on the bridge. It also has one of those really loud "tink" or ring sounds you hear from a good piece of wood. Thanks again for the input everyone.

**Luthier** · Feb-22-2004, 4:13am

I am not a wood expert by any stretch of the imagination but I am going to venture a guess between one of two woods. #I think it is either Bloodwood or a wood called Redheart. #The Bloodwood (brosimum paraense)comes from South America and the Redheart (Erythroxylon spp) from Central America. #Again I gave it my best shot. #
I have used both before. #The Redheart has a tendency to burn even with a sharp blade. #Both have straight tight
grain.
(I just get up early)

Don

**sunburst** · Feb-22-2004, 7:56am

There are thousands of similar woods in the tropics. I might have a couple of guesses, but I'd probably misspell them anyway. If you really want to know, send a small sample to:

Regis Miller
Forest Products Lab
1 Gifford Pinchot Dr.
Madison Wi. 53705-2398

Thats how I found out what that "Brazillian Rosewood" I bought at the auction really is!
(It's OK. It was cheap enough to take the chance)

**Bob DeVellis** · Feb-22-2004, 8:11am

Paldao?

**Jim Hilburn** · Feb-22-2004, 8:35am

maybe it's teak.

**mandolooter** · Feb-22-2004, 9:22am

teak was also my first guess. A dead give-away with teak is the sweetish smell it produces when cut. It also looks a tad like paduk which is almost for sure misspelled but is a really dense hard wood. What ever it is it looks to have made a fine bridge. If it had a positive effect on the sound its good wood!

**Spruce** · Feb-22-2004, 12:12pm

I know zilch about tropical woods, but it sure looks like the wood that is sold as Luan or Philippine Mahogany....

**Dolamon** · Feb-22-2004, 12:30pm

That looks exactly like a few boards of a type of wood I recieved from a friend who made a deck out of it for his house. I made a fret leveling and smoothing "tool" from it and have been watching it for the past two years for stability. An eighteen inch long 2/3 weighs just under four pounds and it is still as flat as the day it was milled. The name - escapes me at the moment but ... I'll call the carpenter on monday to see if he can spell it for me.

It supposedly came from south east Asia and won't float. The idea of making a bridge out of it is a neat idea but - burning up a bunch of carbon steel or tungsten cutters is probably a reality. Oh yeah - the carpenter had been warned about wearing a mask when you cut it. The chips and sawdust are really annoying and potenitally dangerous. He needed to use hardened drill bits to assemble the deck.

**crawdad** · Feb-22-2004, 12:54pm

My Grandfather did a whole house full of cabinetry with Phillipine mahogany and it looks just like this. However. I don't think it was that dense.

**crawdad** · Feb-22-2004, 1:04pm

Here's a pic of the wood--all varnished.

**atetone** · Feb-22-2004, 1:25pm

I have a couple of chunks of Eki wood. It is from South Africa. It is bulletproof. We use it for bridge decks where I work. It looks very similar to yours.
I just weighed a peice of it- 9 X 4 1/2 X 1 3/8 weighs 2.5 lbs.
Quite a few years ago we couldn't get it from South Africa due to a trade embargo because of Apartheid, so we got some from South America somewhere. It was not as good.
This stuff is so hard that you have to drill it before spiking it down and one cut of a plank wrecks a chainsaw blade. More like burning it rather than cutting it. Also the dust is a health hazard.
We re-decked a local bridge on a heavily used highway about 11 years ago. The Eki is still holding up fine even through the heavy traffic and snowplowing. Tough stuff.
I was thinking of making a bridge out of it (mandolin bridge, not the type you drive over) but the chunks that I have, have lots of checking and splitting so I am keeping my eye out for some better peices, but wood bridges are becoming a thing of the past so it is hard to come by. I have to wait till we tear one down to salvage some of it.
Just thought I would throw this in as a possibility.

**thistle3585** · Feb-22-2004, 3:38pm

Dolamon,
I think the wood you are talking about is ipe. I would guess ipe or teak. Both are heavy woods, high silica count and heavy grain.

**sunburst** · Feb-22-2004, 4:42pm

thistle,
Ipe or palopia (sp. same as Ipe) would have been one of my guesses. The other would be Andaroba (sp). I've heard these names pronounced but don't know how to spell them.

Gunning, if you find out what this stuff is let us know!
Anyone up for a pool

?

**Patrick Gunning** · Feb-22-2004, 5:18pm

thanks for all the input.

-checked out apitong? Might be it. It's from the philippines and it's pretty sturdy - couldn't find any close-up pics on the net though.
-might be Philippine mahogany but again, lack of up close pics hurting the investigation
-will look into ipe and teak as well
-don't think it's Eki or any of the other chainsaw-proof woods - my scroll saw can get through it, it's just sloooow going, but it still floats. I may have exaggerated the density of the wood a bit.

Still thinking and looking (though I have more than enough for my purposes now).

Sunburst - How would I go about getting the wood tested by that guy? What would it cost?

Thanks again guys

**Luthier** · Feb-22-2004, 5:22pm

This is great!!! #What do we give the winner??

Don

**sunburst** · Feb-22-2004, 5:24pm

Gunning, It doesn't cost anything. It's the US forest products lab. Our tax dollars at work.
Just put a little piece in a package and send it with a note saying you want to know what it is, and you'll get a note back with genus and species and probably at least one common name.

**Spruce** · Feb-22-2004, 5:35pm

Pools are great, but I wouldn't trust the USFPL for your definitive answer...
I've fooled them a few times now...

They would know a whole lot more than I do about what species of wood it is, however, and the price is sure right....

The big clue here is that the shipping crates came from the Philippines...
There's no way in the world they would import wood to make crates there, for a variety of reasons....
I once visited a wood monger near Pinituba (sp?) volcano, and the myriad of woods that even they didn't have names for was stunning.
I remember some ebony-looking stuff and some other mahagony-type wood that reminded me of the Cuban stuff I've seen...

If the Philippines is anything like the US, they'll use just about anything in pallets.
Pallets are my major source for violin block material, which is difficult to buy commercially....
Available all day long in the light-weight pallets at the local Safeway...

**sunburst** · Feb-22-2004, 5:45pm

Spruce,
I thought you were going to offer the prise for the winner!

**Patrick Gunning** · Feb-22-2004, 5:52pm

The wood wasn't used as crates - it was used originally as long 4x6's and 4x8's, placed in between the steel beams to keep them from crashing into eachother while on the freighter at sea (shipment was from philippines to seattle), so that was the need for the high density. Just a little clarification.

Ah, the government doing work for me, now that I can live with. Now, to cut a little slab piece to send in...

I'll send it in soon and see if we get a winner back.

Maybe the winner will get a bridge blank... I dunno...