Higher end Chinese Mando or "lower end" US mando. Need advice.

[Johnny60]

Hi folks,

before I start this thread, it's important to point out that I'm NOT ready to splash the cash just yet, but am just in the beginning/planning stages of thinking about the future. Been playing guitar for around 40 years, just started mando in January and am really enjoying it.

I've got a Kentucky KM 162 and an Eastman MD 505. The Kentucky was my first "starter" mando (after an aborted attempt with the worst Savannah in the world), and then I bought the Eastman in March whilst shopping for strings! (It sounded SO good, and was available at such a great price that I'd have been stupid not to buy it!).

So, I have 2 very nice mandos that I play every day and am steadily improving. Part of me (quite a large part) is hankering after an F style mando. But I also realise, from reading all your posts and advice here, that F style comes at a premium.

So, here's the big question. WHEN the time comes to get an F-style, am I better going for something like a higher-end Kentucky/Eastman, or something like a low-medium range Weber/Ratliff US-made mando?

Over here in the UK, prices are a lot higher, so there's no way I'd be able to get something like a Weber Fern, but a used Bitterroot or a Ratliff Country Boy might be affordable. Or, for the same kind of price (or less) I could get a better-appointed (ie "prettier" Kentucky/Eastman).

One thing I do know is that both of my Mandos sound very nice, but the Eastman has the edge for me. It has a warmer tone, and the radiused fretboard is somewhat easier to play - that's not to say I don't like the Kentucky. Music-wise, I'm using it play country, americana, and am also learing bluegrass. Not really into Irish jigs and such.

So, over to you guys. If money was tight, and tone and playability were important to you, would you get a KM 1000, MD 815, etc, with their lovely bindings and flames? Or a cheaper US model without all the trimmings?

thanks

John

PS Once again, I'm NOT financially able to pull the trigger just yet - but the MAS is starting to build up!

[lenf12]

For me, the aesthetics should be there as well so I would opt for the high end Pac Rim mandolin. The Kentuckys and Eastmans are really good and you should also consider the Northfield brand as well. Sell the two mandolins that you have now and use the seed money to seriously upgrade to a great looking and sounding new (or used) mandolin.

Len B.
Clearwater, FL

[bmm5255]

Posted in error.

[Capt. E]

Fiddlers Green Music Shop in Austin TX has a used Weber Bitterroot for $2300.

[tkdboyd]

I have owned or still own Eastman, Kentucky, and a Northfield mandolin. All great mandolins. But to my ears and fingers none of them compare to my no thrills Weber. Obviously you need to try out as many as possible for YOU to make the best decision for yourself, but tone and play-ability mean much, much more than any "bling" on any instrument, unless you are a collector.

Good Luck!

[blueron]

As you are in Britain, the availability of different brands from Asia and America is always going to be a contributing factor. Not being in the market right now might be to your advantage, perhaps leaving you open to snapping up the best used F5 deal that crops up in years to come.

I was really lucky with a no-name Japanese F5 that is maybe late-1970s. I got it in a swap deal, and after getting a bit of work done on it, I have a very sweet F model that I love.

Going for a brand name, the KM1000 and KM1500 mandolins have great reputations, and are highly thought of here on the forum. In fact, for the prices they are available at, I doubt very much if a genuinely comparable American instrument might be found anywhere in Britain.

The Loar F5s are good instruments, and if you got one second hand from someone who knows mandolins, it would likely come set up and ready to make the most of. The LM520 is also available new from Thomann.de for what seems like silly money - under 260 pounds plus shipping.

So there are some options out there. Happy hunting.

ron

[August Watters]

Sounds like you really need to talk to Trevor!

[houseworker]

Buying an F-style mandolin in the UK is not nearly as easy as it is in the US. If you're intending to import from the US, budget an additional 25% in customs charges on top of what you pay upfront to the seller. If you're wanting to buy inside Europe, you won't have that expense to worry about, but availability is very limited.

It would help if you could give us some idea of your likely budget. I'd say do your saving first, then be prepared to move quickly when the right opportunity presents itself.

[Markus]

Sounds like you really need to talk to Trevor!

That was my thought. Get your hands and eyes on some to get a direct feel for what each are like. Each neck feels different, each maker/model has a different tone that may please you more or less. When I looked for my current mandolin, it wasn't the one I wanted going into the process - but it's the one that fits me best.

I have not sampled hundreds of mandolins, but from my limited experience I have found that the level of `visual/carved perfection' between imports and the great US makers was easy to note.

If having a `perfect object' with exact curves and carves is important that I would lean strongly towards Weber or others. When I have gone over these instruments with a picky eye [especially on F styles] I am always struck at how perfect the US makers get it. When I play them, I realize that slight imperfections in the scroll don't affect the sound or playability in the slightest and that if I judge by ear and feel I value things much more equally.

It's your call to make, but I'm thankful I didn't go online and end up with a neck profile that didn't fit my hand as perfectly as shopping in person found me. While I don't want to encourage you to take hours of people's time in shops you have no intention to buy from, buying something that is a poor fit isn't great either.

[nickster60]

I think the lower line webers are a great value, and there customer service is very hard to beat.

[Brett Byers]

Give Trevor a call at The Acoustic Music Co. He knows our product line inside and out, and I'm confident he can help you with anything Weber related if you choose to go that route. We take great pride in our lower priced mandolins, and you can rest assured that we don't cut any corners on the Hyalite, Gallatin, Bitterroot models, etc.

[Johnny60]

Many thanks for all your advice. I need to start saving and, when funds allow, take a trip down to Brighton to see Trevor.

[JEStanek]

Get your hands on and ears into everything you can afford. Pick the ones you like the best and have them played to you as well. Buy the best playing and sounding one you can afford. Don't worry about the headstocks.

Jamie

[Ray Neuman]

I faced the same debate this past winter. I did have the advantage of being a "robo player" for a collector that does not know how to play. He sent me new top end custom mandolins to "break in" then he stores them, so I had some experience with some VERY nice mandolins. When it came time for me to buy one, I bought a LM-500 The Loar. No bells and whistles, but a very solid, great sounding and playing mandolin. No regrets. Sure, its not the same as a custom built Brentrup, but it did not cost $20K, and I can take it anywhere, sound good and not worry!

[yankees1]

Well-----------------I did both ! An Ellis and a Northfield !

[TomBrisk]

He sent me new top end custom mandolins to "break in"...

Nice job, Ray, you lucky sum-o-gun!

Cripes, eh- I trust that procedure doesn't require cheese?

-Tom, a GB Escapee

[Mandobart]

I faced the same debate this past winter. I did have the advantage of being a "robo player" for a collector that does not know how to play. He sent me new top end custom mandolins to "break in" then he stores them...

Man how do you get that gig? The human tone-rite! Back to John's question - you have other options than the fine instruments built by Weber and Ratliff. Howard "Sonny" Morris (NFI) has been building great A and F style mandos for many years now. You could get a custom build F-style, with your choice of woods, fret size, radius (or not), oval or f hole, etc. shipped to you for under $2 k US. Sonny has built and shipped mandos to folks all over the world. I'm unaware of any builder who offers such fine hand-built instruments for his prices.

[Mike Scott]

I also did both. I have a KM1500 and a Silverangel A. Hard to pick between them. Depending on what you are looking for they both have their strengths. A tough call indeed. Politics not withstanding.

[Ray Neuman]

Mike, wise words indeed. The gig was a fell in the lap sort of thing. My son worked for a very successful boss that collected them. The collection included Collings, Red Diamond, Brentrup (matching twins, one oval and one F) and a doz or better like it. All top shelf.

Having played all of these, and now my "affordable" The Loar LM 500, the differences in fit and finish are indeed evident if you look. Some played better then others, (most likely a subjective call at best) and they all sounded unique to themselvies. None were "IT" just different. Personally, I would have a difficult time ponying up the additional $19,500 for one over my Loar. Mind you, I am NOT a professional musician that makes a living at it, nor am I a collector. Just a player.

So, back to the thread, I truely believe the final test of what mandolin to buy comes down to what speaks to you in your financial range. To some, that will require big money, to others, we are satisfied with the simpler things. While I do support "buy Americian" as often as I can, the difference in price here is hard to swallow. To my thinking, I might just as well save the $2000 and buy a LOT of other American things.

One last opinion if I may, not ALL "top shelf" mandolins are great, or even good. Some are wonderful works of art that should be hung on a wall and NEVER played!