Page 2 of 4 FirstFirst 1234 LastLast
Results 26 to 50 of 85

Thread: Does playing Mandolin Help in learning to play the fiddle?

  1. #26
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    maryland
    Posts
    1,410

    Default Re: Does playing Mandolin Help in learning to play the fiddle?

    Playing the mandolin helps you in every part of life.

    Seriously, it helps, but how much? Tough to say.

    The mandolin can closely copy anything that a fiddle does, anything that a banjo does, anything a guitar does, and even the bass....with a good chop. I'm serious. With a good right hand and good technique the mandolin is the most versatile of all instruments, IMHO.

    What was the question??? Probably not much. The bow is pretty tough.

    Bob
    re simmers

  2. #27
    Still Picking and Sawing Jack Roberts's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2002
    Location
    sigmaX>=hbar/2sigmaP
    Posts
    1,701

    Default Re: Does playing Mandolin Help in learning to play the fiddle?

    Yes, it does.
    Ha, ha! keep time: how sour sweet music is,
    When time is broke and no proportion kept!
    --William Shakespeare

  3. #28
    Innocent Bystander JeffD's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Upstate New York
    Posts
    24,807
    Blog Entries
    56

    Default Re: Does playing Mandolin Help in learning to play the fiddle?

    Quote Originally Posted by foldedpath View Post
    At the risk of offending OldTime fiddlers here, that's a fairly easy entry point. After that, if you want to learn Western Swing, or Jazz, or Bluegrass, or Irish trad, that's another big bump in the learning curve.
    I would not want to line up the genres of music by mandolin difficulty. I think if entry into a jam and mostly holding your own is the goal, that can be achieved relatively early. But that goes for any jam really. Perhaps the difference with BG and Jazz is the expectation of taking a break, which requires the next level of experience.

    I could practice all day every day and I will never, ever, ever be a Bruce Green, or a Greg Canote. There is genius in good OT fiddle playing, just as there is elsewhere. And if anyone called me a genius I would check my bourbon to see if he had been sneaking some.
    A talent for trivializin' the momentous and complicatin' the obvious.

    The entire staff
    funny....

  4. #29
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Bingen, Germany
    Posts
    1

    Default Re: Does playing Mandolin Help in learning to play the fiddle?

    I have been playing violin for some time and, after seeing a video of Doyle Lawson, decided that it was time to try something new. So I got a The Loar 600 as well as an Acoustic Guitar (never played either instrument before).

    I immediately had some results with the Mandolin. The fingerings are the same, the tuning is the same, it basically plays the same. Using the pick is a bit of work, but I think I do fine considering I've only started three weeks ago

    The Guitar is a totally different thing. I just don't get the tuning. How can any sane person tune an instrument in fourths? I constantly mess up string changes because I subconsciously thing they should be tuned in fifths. The chord positions are _far_ more difficult. Ok, admittedly, I don't yet manage to do chop chords on the Mandolin, but the rest at least works ok after some positioning. But on the Guitar?!? Total trainwreck. Single notes don't work, either.

    I really doubt my musical abilities. ANYONE on this whole wide world can play guitar, except for me. I seem to be too stupid for it. I started with both instruments the very same day and my progress with the Mandolin is far greater than with the Guitar.

    So I think, knowing how to play Violin helps you play the Mandolin. I don't know the other way round, but I would imagine it to be the same. After all, the big thing are the tuning and chord positions, all of which are identical.

  5. #30
    Facing the Storm Duane Graves's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    New Brunswick, Canada
    Posts
    420

    Default Re: Does playing Mandolin Help in learning to play the fiddle?

    Quote Originally Posted by JeffD View Post
    And if anyone called me a genius I would check my bourbon to see if he had been sneaking some.
    ....Jeff, you're a genius.....hic-up, hic-up....(wink)......
    "....if you can't find a way out...go deeper in..."

    Eastman 805D
    Fender 53S SB

  6. #31
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Nov 2003
    Location
    Northwest
    Posts
    780

    Default Re: Does playing Mandolin Help in learning to play the fiddle?

    Novatian's description of his experience is far more typical, in that, as stated in another post, fiddlers usually can be fairly functional on mandolin in a very short time, whereas most mandolinists struggle greatly with the fiddle. For many fiddlers, the bowing hand and arm convert very quickly and comfortably to handling a pick, and the fingerings with a fretted board make life even easier. It would be interesting to poll those who are masters of both to find the progression of their musical development. For those who fiddled first, how quickly did they become proficient on mandolin, and for those who were mandolinists first, what sort of challenges did they face when switching?

  7. #32
    Still Picking and Sawing Jack Roberts's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2002
    Location
    sigmaX>=hbar/2sigmaP
    Posts
    1,701

    Default Re: Does playing Mandolin Help in learning to play the fiddle?

    The difficulty of bowing is a little overestimated. Yes, it takes time to get the hang of it, but unlike classical violin, fiddlers have a lot of different and acceptable ways to fiddle with the bow--go to any jam and you will never see two fiddlers bowing alike. (I went to see the Vienna Philharmonic and EVERY bow moved in EXACTLY the same way all evening.)

    Probably the hardest part of playing fiddle for a mandolinist is intonation and the second hardest might be reading notation (if you've only played by ear or tab.) In either case, playing the mandolin will help with intonation as you can learn a tune first on the mandolin to get the pitch and feel for the notes down, and then move over to the fiddle. To keep intonation, it's good to make a recording of yourself chopping along on the mandolin: that will keep you playing in tune.

    Every mandolin player who can't read notation should beg or borrow a fiddle and spend some time with it. Soon enough reading notation will become second nature, and a lot of music that can be found in print but not often heard will be accessible.
    Ha, ha! keep time: how sour sweet music is,
    When time is broke and no proportion kept!
    --William Shakespeare

  8. #33
    Innocent Bystander JeffD's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Upstate New York
    Posts
    24,807
    Blog Entries
    56

    Default Re: Does playing Mandolin Help in learning to play the fiddle?

    I think there is something to be said here about going from one instrument to another. We have seen threads that start out "I have been playing guitar (or what ever) for 20 years. I just fell in love with the mandolin, and I figure I should be playing no problem in the next couple of weeks."

    What ever instrument one learns first, is the instrument on which one learns musicality, gets ear training, learns melody, harmony, chords, improvisation, reading, all that stuff that is transportable to any other instrument. So in that way, the second instrument is always easier.

    But to play the second isntrument takes a lot of work. Going from fiddle to mandolin, in no time at all your playing the mandolin like a picked fiddle. Going from guitar to mandolin, in no time at all your playing mandolin like wee guitar. It takes a lot of time to start playing the mandolin like a mandolin.

    So I am sure the reverse is true. Going from mandolin to fiddle, soon enough I am able to play mandolin on the fiddle. And, because its a second instrument, all my "boilerplate" musical experience will apply, and so I will be ahead of someone starting out on the fiddle cold. But soon enough (in my case 6 months), the rank beginner has caught up, and all my mando-advantages are for nothing, because now I am faced with playing a fiddlistically in a fiddle.

    Though I cannot identify it myself, I am sure a good violin teacher can easily identify somone who played mandolin first - not because of what they can do, but more because of their mandolistic approach to the music and what fiddlistic things they haven't even started to tackle.
    A talent for trivializin' the momentous and complicatin' the obvious.

    The entire staff
    funny....

  9. #34

    Default Re: Does playing Mandolin Help in learning to play the fiddle?

    Maybe the bow seemed to difficult to me because the other stuff comes easy. I've been reading standard notation since I was eight years old and it's like second nature (akin to a child who grows up speaking two languages instead of trying to learn a second language as an adult). And I learned to sing on key even earlier than that plus played trombone in middle and high school which, like the fiddle, demands ear-hand coordination to play in tune.

    But I don't know what background one could have to make bowing a fiddle or violin come easily. Of course as Jack says for certain styles of fiddling there is not "right answer" as to good tone. But my comments have all been presuming you want to produce a tone that a person with good hearing can be in the room with for an extended period without getting that look of pain and panic in their eyes...
    The first man who whistled
    thought he had a wren in his mouth.
    He went around all day
    with his lips puckered,
    afraid to swallow.

    --"The First" by Wendell Berry

  10. #35
    Innocent Bystander JeffD's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Upstate New York
    Posts
    24,807
    Blog Entries
    56

    Default Re: Does playing Mandolin Help in learning to play the fiddle?

    I have gotten to the point that I don't have a look of panic and anguish in my own eyes. The eyes of the audience is the next step.
    A talent for trivializin' the momentous and complicatin' the obvious.

    The entire staff
    funny....

  11. #36
    Registered User Eliot Greenspan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Location
    Costa Rica
    Posts
    138

    Default Re: Does playing Mandolin Help in learning to play the fiddle?

    "all been presuming you want to produce a tone that a person with good hearing can be in the room with for an extended period without getting that look of pain and panic in their eyes... "

    great line!

    I can muddle my way through standard notation if someone puts a gun to my head, but haven't really used it in 30+ years, and ain't using it in my current stab at fiddling. Got plenty of tunes already in the finger/muscle memory from mando, and like just randomnly picking a melody out of my head and finding it on the fiddle

    seem to remember that Vassar Clements never read no notation, remember him at a festival talk a million years ago saying something like "never could understand how they could read all those little dots and play at the same time"

    would be good to ask that earlier question of progression to some of the pros. Tim O'Brien, Anthony Hannigan, Drew Emmitt, all come to mind as pretty decent dual players, heck that's just in Colorado...

  12. #37
    Registered User foldedpath's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Pacific Northwest, USA
    Posts
    5,293

    Default Re: Does playing Mandolin Help in learning to play the fiddle?

    I was wondering about multi-instrumentalists like Tim O'Brien too. According to his bio, he started first on guitar and banjo, then picked up fiddle and mandolin. But that all happened by the time he was a teenager. And you know how quickly kids can pick up things, especially the hyper-talented ones.

    I'd love to hear Tim talk about how he picked up fiddle and whether previous experience on other instruments helped, but it could just be that he got an early enough start. I've heard him do that bit in concert where he sings and plays fiddle at the same time, harmonizing with his voice. It sure does sound like he's been doing it all his life.

  13. #38
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Location
    Raleigh NC
    Posts
    2

    Default Re: Does playing Mandolin Help in learning to play the fiddle?

    A friend is getting me a fiddle for my birthday. I have been playing the mandolin only a year. I am very interested in playing fiddle as well, but perhaps it's a mistake to learn another instrument before being a stronger more confident mando player. Based on the comments posted, not sure I'm up to the fiddle just yet.

  14. #39
    Mando-Accumulator Jim Garber's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    Westchester, NY
    Posts
    30,753

    Default Re: Does playing Mandolin Help in learning to play the fiddle?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mandolover77 View Post
    Based on the comments posted, not sure I'm up to the fiddle just yet.
    Try and see how it goes. It also helps to have friends who are supportive and a community of other players including those that are at your level and those who can teach you. That goes for lots of instruments but esp for fiddle. A lot also depends on what type(s) of music you want to play.

    In our area I run one monthly old time jam session and a good friend runs another one. At both of these, players of all levels are invited. I hope to keep these going because players will improve the longer these sessions go on. We have a core group of regulars.
    Jim

    My Stream on Soundcloud
    Facebook
    19th Century Tunes
    Playing lately:
    1924 Gibson A4 - 2018 Campanella A-5 - 2007 Brentrup A4C - 1915 Frank Merwin Ashley violin - Huss & Dalton DS - 1923 Gibson A2 black snakehead - '83 Flatiron A5-2 - 1939 Gibson L-00 - 1936 Epiphone Deluxe - 1928 Gibson L-5 - ca. 1890s Fairbanks Senator Banjo - ca. 1923 Vega Style M tenor banjo - ca. 1920 Weymann Style 25 Mandolin-Banjo - National RM-1

  15. #40
    Still Picking and Sawing Jack Roberts's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2002
    Location
    sigmaX>=hbar/2sigmaP
    Posts
    1,701

    Default Re: Does playing Mandolin Help in learning to play the fiddle?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Garber View Post
    ....
    In our area I run one monthly old time jam session and a good friend runs another one. At both of these, players of all levels are invited. I hope to keep these going because players will improve the longer these sessions go on. We have a core group of regulars.
    I wish I lived near you, Jim. I can find places to play mandolin in public at my intermediate level, and I seem to be a welcome participant, but I can't find a jam for playing upper-beginner level fiddle. So I just play fiddle at home.
    Ha, ha! keep time: how sour sweet music is,
    When time is broke and no proportion kept!
    --William Shakespeare

  16. #41

    Default Re: Does playing Mandolin Help in learning to play the fiddle?

    When you have a violin, you have the synthesizer of the 1600's. You control every aspect of the note. Attack, pitch, decay, sustain, everything. Some folks like the challenge. Anything I say from here will sound like boasting, so all i'm going to say is, I love to play violin/fiddle, and you may too, but you won't if you don't try it.

  17. The following members say thank you to farmerjones for this post:

    Petrus 

  18. #42
    poor excuse for anything Charlieshafer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Madison, Ct
    Posts
    2,303

    Default Re: Does playing Mandolin Help in learning to play the fiddle?

    Eh, coming at it from a slightly different point, the mandolin experience helps slightly, but can be more in certain circumstances. I am very biased towards some sort of classical lessons on any instrument (or at least classically-oriented) as you have to learn to read music, and you have to learn proper technique. Not saying you need to take years of lessons, that all depends on where you want to get. But, a mandolin player who reads music will have a head start on the left hand. As most have mentioned, intonation will take a little time, but at least you have an idea of where to be for what note.

    Where mandolin playing really helps the fiddle, if you've taken it somewhat seriously, is that mandolin players have a better sense of chord structure and basic music theory, which is really lacking in violin teaching. Thus, you can contribute more quickly when picking up the fiddle, as at the very least you'll know chord shapes for chops, chunks, and other cool fiddle sounds. You'll also have an advantage at fills as you can draw two or three string chords that last for a measure or two, giving other members of a group to play melody over. Make a simple G or C chord shape, and use the bow to hold that for a bit while other fiddlers, mandolinists or guitar players play the melody over that, and you can get a nice rich sound with just a few players.

    So, you can contribute fairly quickly, but making some cool solo runs will take a while, especially if you're one of those who wants to hit the right note, in tune, at the right time.

  19. #43
    I'll take it! JGWoods's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Location
    Chelmsford MA
    Posts
    1,408

    Default Re: Does playing Mandolin Help in learning to play the fiddle?

    I'd say 25-30% or more help if you want to play the same tunes on both instruments. You get all the left hand fingering from mandolin, work on finger placement for intonation and a new job for the right hand. I know some long time fiddlers who give plenty of credit to early experiences on the mandolin. It's a big help.
    Be yourself, everyone else is taken.
    Favorite Mandolin of the week: 2013 Collings MF Gloss top.

  20. #44
    coprolite mandroid's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2002
    Location
    Outer Spiral Arm, of Galaxy, NW Oregon.
    Posts
    17,103

    Default Re: Does playing Mandolin Help in learning to play the fiddle?

    reverse it, (?) Violin , in School Band, would help your mandolin playing , later ..
    at least you can read the music in the treble clef.

    I didn't and I Can't ..
    writing about music
    is like dancing,
    about architecture

  21. #45
    Registered User Petrus's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Location
    Los Angeles
    Posts
    2,623

    Default Re: Does playing Mandolin Help in learning to play the fiddle?

    Oh-oh, I feel a new obsession coming on ... 7-string Viola da gambas, apparently being made in large quantities by a Chinese company on eBay. Also offered in 4, 5, and 6 string models, some fretted. Incipient VdGAS possible.

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	0violagamba-7string.JPG 
Views:	105 
Size:	97.5 KB 
ID:	119890

    Then again, unless they make an 8-string, it's not going to help my mandolin playing.

  22. #46

    Default Re: Does playing Mandolin Help in learning to play the fiddle?

    After playing mandolin for 5 years I jumped in and bought a violin a month ago. Have to agree with the side that mandolin playing is a large help. It allows you to ignore your left hand (mostly) and just focus on the bow. There are a lot more variables with playing violin for tone and I would strongly recommend lessons. Positioning is critical for violin. Cleared out the house for the first two weeks with the sounds but now it is starting to come together. Nice thing about mandolin is that even a rank beginner can make some pretty nice sounds with the instrument, definitely not the case with violin. Give it a try!

    Doug

  23. #47
    MandolaViola bratsche's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Location
    south florida
    Posts
    2,820

    Default Re: Does playing Mandolin Help in learning to play the fiddle?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gkar66 View Post
    Nice thing about mandolin is that even a rank beginner can make some pretty nice sounds with the instrument, definitely not the case with violin.
    Yeah, with a violin, even a nice beginner can make some pretty rank sounds!

    bratsche
    "There are two refuges from the miseries of life: music and cats." - Albert Schweitzer

    GearGems - Gifts & apparel for musicians and more!
    MandolaViola's YouTube Channel

  24. #48
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    Columbus, GA
    Posts
    1,360

    Default Re: Does playing Mandolin Help in learning to play the fiddle?

    Many mandolin pickers are also fiddlers. Without conducting a survey, it doesn't appear that as many guitar pickers also play a fiddle. It seems to me that there are enough similarities in the actual creation of specific tones in the two instruments to smooth the transition from one to the other. For instance, the A and E strings help make up a G chord and can be played on both instruments. I'm not saying they the two instruments are the same. If they were, I'd have a bow in my mandolin case.

  25. #49
    Deacon M100A Minorkey's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    Darlington UK
    Posts
    250

    Default Re: Does playing Mandolin Help in learning to play the fiddle?

    I would say apart from tuning they are completely different beasts. First you have to learn how to use a bow, then there's the fact that there's no frets and its a much shorter scale. With gut strings.
    Id love a go (I have tried a cello a long time ago!)

  26. #50
    Registered User jimbob's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2003
    Location
    Grand Lake of the Cherokees, Oklahoma
    Posts
    684

    Default Re: Does playing Mandolin Help in learning to play the fiddle?

    I can only speak for myself....NO
    I bought a fiddle thinking the mando experience would be a benefit....the fiddle is the most difficult instrument I can think of

Bookmarks

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •