Wooden tailpiece

[Rob Powell]

Looking for a wooden tailpiece for my new Breedlove KF... I did a search here but couldn't find anything...anyone know someone who's making these or maybe where I could get plans for making them myself?

[Chris Baird]

What kind of wooden tailpiece? It would have to be violin style, as in floating. Wood wouldn't be strong enough to be applied in the usual tailpiece configuration.

[thistle3585]

Use the search feature to search the builders section with the key words floating tailpiece. It has been discussed several times before and there are some posted links to people who have them.

[Rob Powell]

Hey Chris!

Something like the on the Monteleone(sp) Radio Flyer...only in satin blond hard maple...and yes, it is a floating tailpiece. After looking through the eye candy section, I think maybe Stephen Holst makes one.

If I could get some specs, I'd love to make them myself...

Might have to do just that to ensure that I don't need to put any new holes in my new mando.

Thanks!

[Rob Powell]

thistle,

I must be putting it in the search wrong...I only come up with 2 topics and just one of them has a single link (to the Holst site I mentioned before.)

Sorry to be a pain...but if you post a link to the topics or post the actual links here I'd be grateful!

Thanks,
Rob

[Jim M.]

The Phoenix Neoclassical has a wooden tailpiece, but I don't know if they are generally available.

[SternART]

Holst tailpieces look a bit different than the Monteleones......which attach with a flexible wire over an ebony block and then wrap around a cast metal endpin surround. Tailpiece is actually floating. Can't quite see the detail on any of the Holst photos, he talks about a metal bracket somewhere in his guitar info......looks like he has certainly been inspired by John's work...both guitars & mandos...anyone ever seen or played one?
Priced very competitively, and very zippy looking.

[thistle3585]

Rob,
My mistake. I remembered the discussion, only because I was going to give it a try to make one, and I thought I remembered there being several links. I guess not, as I got the same result as you.

I remember there being one that was floating and one that was mounted on a metal bracket. Maybe a a wood cover to a stamped tailpiece?

I've thought about making some, but don't know how I'd attatch it to the mando.

[Lee]

If the NeoClassical uses the same tailpiece as my Deluxe, the ebony is a cover on top of a bent piece of steel.

[Jim M.]

I haven't examined the NeoClassical closely but the Mandolin Brothers website describes it as an all wood instrument except for strings, frets and tuners.

[otterly2k]

If I'm not mistaken, Eric Darnton uses a wooden tailpiece on his OM's...might be worth a look / ask.
www.ericdarnton.com

KE

[mandroid]

J. Sullivan makes a slick cover ,cover, for common slide off gibson type tailpieces, the gold plate doesn't wear off ebony. it looks fine, edge bound like instrument.
I bet its not a patented idea.

[douglas2cats]

I think this is the previous thread where this came up a while back.

[Rob Powell]

Well so far as I can tell, all of these have some metal in them... Is there some reason a tailpiece carved from a solid piece of hard maple would not work? Forgive me my ignorance but what would be the structural problem with it?

[thistle3585]

You have to mount it somewhere other than the top, so the obvious way is to use the tailpiece. This requires coming up and over the top. A metal bracket, as opposed to a wood one, will give you more strength. To get the strength out of a wood one, it would be pretty bulky. It would also be more likely to flex than a metal bracket. The closest you could get is with a cable like a violin uses, but you would still need some sort of corner block to keep the cable from digging into the instrument.

[Dale Ludewig]

I would be interested to know if anyone has found a way to make an "underpinning of metal" covered by wood that truly floats on a cord attached to the endpin. Forgive my ignorance, but is that how the Monteleone works?
I would seem that metal pins on some sort would be necessary to hold up to the tension from the string- wood would just bust off, eventually if not immediately.
Plus, has anyone heard a mandolin (Monteleone or other) with a floating tailpiece and if so, what does it sound like? The idea has intrigued me, but I wonder that even if you could work out a truly floating arrangement, would if intonate properly. Think of the stress going in different directions on the tailpiece when you say, chop an A chord?
If anyone has experience, please let us all know. Thanks.

[SternART]

Well Dale, there are metal turnscrews under a Monty floating tailpiece that the cord or wire attaches to, holes thru the wood with the hardware inset. I'm not familiar with arch top guitars, might this be a similar detail?

As for sound, I've found them to be harplike, if that communicates..... with an open pure sound.....ultra sensitive to touch and nuance of playing, offering what I perceive as a wider color palette of sounds available, than the cast Monty tailpiece......however I'd also say a tad less woody, percussive, or BG sounding, what I might consider a more modern sound than a Loarlike sound. Very pure noting and incredible sustain......play a complex jazz chord and you hear all the notes ring out equally. Mine are very balanced up, down the neck & across the strings. They make the strings feel like they are a bit easier to press down......I've found them to be very player friendly and very expressive instruments. But then again, there obviously is more to that than just the tailpiece.

[Dale Ludewig]

[QUOTE]

That sounds exactly what I'm interested in. A broader range of tone, if I understand you description. I'm not personally interested in imitating a Loar sound in my instruments. Nothing against them, they're great instruments, needless to say. But there's other areas to explore and what you describe sounds really interesting. I've really gotten attached to the sustain and tone that the Allen/ Monteleone tailpieces give, but I'm interested in pursuing some other stuff. Like what you're talking about. So, even if some others have mentioned some sources, what would you recommend as a source? Or should I just make my own? Thanks a bunch.

[Dale Ludewig]

My last post didn't quote properly (or at all). I was trying to quote sternArt's post about the Monteleone tailpieces. Thanks again.

[BluegrassPhilfromFrance]

www.corradogiacomel.it from Italy #

[Rob Powell]

Dale and Arthur,

That's EXACTLY what I'm looking for in terms of tone. Although I'm just learning to play mandolin, I've ben playig guitar for over 30 years and I play all different styles. My Breedlove KF with the standard tailpiece has a very nice ring and sustain already. Harp-like sounds exactly like where I'd like the tone to go.

Phil - That looks really good but does he sell the tailpiece by itself? My english isn't all that great much less my Italian

I'm wondering if, as a practical matter, you could scale and modify Benedetto tailpiece for archtop guitars.

Anyone know where I could get the specs for a wooden Monteleone? Does anyone have the Benedetto book and does it spec out the wooden tailpiece?

Thanks for all your help!

[BluegrassPhilfromFrance]

Hi Rob,
I don't know if you can buy a tailpiece from Corrado and I don't know him personnally but if you send him an e-mail in english, I'm sure he will reply.

[Neil Dean]

In the past few years I have been experimenting with various different configurations of wooden tailpieces, both floating and with a brass bracket. I'd have to say that I like the sound of the floating a bit better. I have a few photos on my website neiljdeanmandolins.com if any of you might like to check them out. You'll have to forgive me as the site is still under construction. Another place you might want to check out fiddletree.com. As he has some really fantastic photos, one of them being of a floating violin style mandolin tailpiece... thanks
Neil

[SternART]

Hey Neil........nice looking mandolins.........clearly you've been experimenting with tailpieces, that L&H inspired asymetric 2 point looks veddy nice, what difference in sound do you hear with the floating tailpiece as compared to a cast tailpiece?

Also, looks like Otis Tomas @ fiddletree.com indeed has a beautifully sculpted floating wood tailpiece, looks fabulous......there are more mando luthiers out there experimenting with these than I realized.

[Rob Powell]

Neil..thanks a bunch! Are you interested in selling the tailpieces?