How can I convince you [hypothetical craigslister] I'm legit?

**Nate** · Mar-17-2009, 1:29pm

Here's the scoop:

I have a friend on the other side of the country interested in picking up an inexpensive mandolin for travelling.

I found just the thing! "Callooh! Callay!", he chortled in his joy.

The only catch is that the seller is located 300 miles away from me. I'll be a little bit closer this w/e helping my in-laws with a move, and offered to meet him halfway to make the sale (it's been sitting unsold for nearly a month now), but he's pretty reluctant to do that.

The first time he responded to any of my four email inquiries was just this morning, in fact, since he figured anyone even remotely suggesting travelling 300 miles for a $250 mandolin was scamming him. It's just a hard mando to find, and a good deed for a friend. I understand his suspicion.

If it were you, how could I convince you:

1) That I was a legitimate buyer;

2) To make the 3-4 hr round-trip trek on your own time / gas to meet me halfway to make the sale (I just don't think I can swing the 8-hour round-trip to his actual location in the middle of this move, but 4-5 hours might be doable; this would probably be the difference between me buying it or not).

Thoughts? I'd like to get this mando this weekend and have my mother-in-law (experienced eBayer) give me some thoughts for packing it up to ship to my friend, but I don't know whether it's going to work out under these particular circumstances. Still, it seems like it should be doable?

Who knows. Maybe my seller is even a registered member here and would be able to tell me straight from the "horse's mouth"! (If you are here, I hope you're not offended! Just count this as evidence of my sincere interest in the instrument.) Maybe someone else has done something similar?

-Nate

**MikeEdgerton** · Mar-17-2009, 1:35pm

Did you give him your phone number and ask him to call you?

**Nate** · Mar-17-2009, 1:39pm

Originally Posted by MikeEdgerton

Did you give him your phone number and ask him to call you?

See, these are the "duh" questions that I haven't been able to ask myself. No, I didn't.

**MikeEdgerton** · Mar-17-2009, 1:44pm

If he's talking to a real person he might feel a bit more comfortable. You can offer to call him as well.

**Jim MacDaniel** · Mar-17-2009, 2:17pm

You could offer to send him a cashier's check from a bank he's never heard of for at least twice the amount of the purchase price, and ask him to send you a personal check for the difference.

Seriously though, I can't think of anything better than Mike's suggestions, although you could supplement a phone conversation with an email to him of a picture of you and your mandolin(s), to better illustrate that you are indeed a mandolin enthusiast. Alternatively, if you have your own mandolin-centric web site or on-line photo gallery, you could send him a link to that.

**John Flynn** · Mar-17-2009, 3:07pm

Originally Posted by Jim MacDaniel

You could offer to send him a cashier's check from a bank he's never heard of for at least twice the maount of the purchase price, and ask him to send you a personal check for the difference.

That's why I draw all my cashier's checks from The East Bank of the Mississippi. It gives you instant credibility!

**MikeB** · Mar-17-2009, 4:21pm

It couldn't hurt to direct him to this site and let him read this thread.

**man dough nollij** · Mar-17-2009, 4:27pm

Originally Posted by Jim MacDaniel

You could offer to send him a cashier's check from a bank he's never heard of for at least twice the amount of the purchase price, and ask him to send you a personal check for the difference.

Offer to send him a check for $42,000 from the Bank of Nigeria, and have him refund you the $41,750. That'd prove you're legit...

**jim simpson** · Mar-17-2009, 4:32pm

I was suprised to hear from buyers out of state regarding items I've listed on craigslist. I ended up shipping to 2 different buyers once I established that they were for real and not scammers. I guess they were willing to take a chance that I would follow through once I received payment. It went well in both. I guess communication is your best tool.

**mrmando** · Mar-17-2009, 4:51pm

You could ask if any Cafe-denizens live in or near such-and-such a town and would be willing to pick up and ship the mando for you, given reimbursement. It's worked for me once or twice.

I always send my name and phone number to out-of-town Craigslisters, although many of them are so scared by Craigslist's warnings that they won't talk to me anyway.

**jim_n_virginia** · Mar-17-2009, 11:21pm

I don't understand why you are not shipping? You will spend MORE in gas, food and drinks than you would if you just shipped it for $50.00

IF I was a seller there would be NO WAY you could convince me to make a 3 hour round trip (pretty much all day) trip for a $250.00 mandolin.

Mike is right, call him and your info will come up on his Caller ID and if your name shows up it usually is enough to convince people they are real.

good luck

**mrmando** · Mar-17-2009, 11:40pm

Jim -- some people don't put phone numbers in their Craigslist ads, and some people have an irrational fear of shipping.

Nate -- do you have the seller's phone number? Did you think of asking whether he'd just ship it to your friend?

**Nate** · Mar-18-2009, 7:10am

Well, he seems to have come around now, but it's still just proving impossible to work out in practice.

Originally Posted by jim_n_virginia

I don't understand why you are not shipping? You will spend MORE in gas, food and drinks than you would if you just shipped it for $50.00

IF I was a seller there would be NO WAY you could convince me to make a 3 hour round trip (pretty much all day) trip for a $250.00 mandolin.

Yeah, I think this is what it comes down to... it's just a bit too far. I know someone who, when relocating in his job, took a map and drew a 400 mile circle around his family (too far to drive, too close to fly) and picked a point on its edge. That's not quite, but pretty close to, the distance involved here.

It was right on the cusp to make me think it might be doable, but just too hard and costly to work out logistically. Probably my friend ought to try to convince the guy to ship to him.

Really, though, I just don't like the idea of shipping from craigslist. No record of sale and no feedback on quality (safety) of shipping = ew. It's not that I wouldn't trust the guy, it's that neither him nor my friend would have any real recourse if something were to go wrong in transit.

Originally Posted by mrmando

You could ask if any Cafe-denizens live in or near such-and-such a town and would be willing to pick up and ship the mando for you, given reimbursement. It's worked for me once or twice.

. . . . .

Nate -- do you have the seller's phone number? Did you think of asking whether he'd just ship it to your friend?

Yeah, this seems best. I think we've probably given up on this particular mandolin, though. Oh well.

**mrmando** · Mar-18-2009, 1:21pm

Originally Posted by Nate

It's not that I wouldn't trust the guy, it's that neither him nor my friend would have any real recourse if something were to go wrong in transit.

That's where insurance enters the picture. Ship with UPS and insure the package for the sale amount.

**Nate** · Mar-18-2009, 1:33pm

Originally Posted by mrmando

That's where insurance enters the picture. Ship with UPS and insure the package for the sale amount.

I suppose so. I guess I always chalk up insurance as "insurance against loss," not "insurance against damage." Maybe the claims against damage aren't as hard to make / defend as I imagine them to be.

In any event, I've given my friend the CL link and the guy's contact info, so they can (if he still wants this particular mandolin) work out a direct shipping method instead. Turns out I didn't need most of this advice. Oh well. :p

**MikeEdgerton** · Mar-18-2009, 1:38pm

Have him send you a series of pictures before it ships.

**Nate** · Mar-18-2009, 1:51pm

For pre-/post- in case of damage?

Sounds like a good idea. The mando is described as being in mint condition and the far-away pictures I do have show this pretty well, but a series of close-ups makes a lot of sense.

In any event, looks like my friend is probably going to go with a kit.

I promise, I'm not really as stupid as I sound.

**D C Blood** · Mar-18-2009, 1:54pm

Seems like thats a mighty lot of trouble for a $250 mandolin (unless it's a $2000 mandolin selling for $250)...Nice of you to go to that trouble for your friend, but I would think they ought to be able to find something in that price range in a music store or pawn shop near where they live, or you find one near where you live, instead of going through all that convolution...

**Nate** · Mar-18-2009, 1:58pm

He was looking specifically for a small-size mandolin for travel / campus, and the mando in question was the long-discontinued martin backpacker. I haven't seen another listed anywhere online that I could find. If it was just a cruddy made-in-china beginner's model, I wouldn't have bothered even trying.

**man dough nollij** · Mar-18-2009, 2:05pm

There's a Weber Sweet Pea in the Cafe classifieds. That'd be a good one.

**Nate** · Mar-18-2009, 2:07pm

Originally Posted by man dough nollij

There's a Weber Sweet Pea in the Cafe classifieds. That'd be a good one.

Yep. I had already given him that link, too. I've been poking around as many places as I could (especially on the classifieds here) to find stuff in his range of price / interest.

**EdSherry** · Mar-18-2009, 2:08pm

I suspect that the seller is concerned about the "meet me halfway" issue. You're asking HIM to drive 150 miles one way (300 miles round trip) in order to make a $250 sale. At 30 miles per gallon and $2/gallon gas, that's $20 in gas alone, not to mention roughly six hours of his time (at 50 mph) just for driving time .

If his time is worth (say) $20/hour to him, you're effectively asking him to invest $140 (six hours @ $20, plus $20 in gas) in order to make a $250 sale, and that's IF you show up and IF you buy it when he gets there.

As a buyer, I've driven a significant distance only to be "stood up" by a seller who said he'd be there but wasn't. I strongly suspect that sellers are even more likely to be "burned" by buyers who promise they'll show up at such-and-such a time, only to flake out at the last minute.

If you were willing to drive the whole distance to the seller's place, I can't imagine that the seller would care where you are located.

**Nate** · Mar-18-2009, 2:12pm

Originally Posted by EdSherry

I suspect that the seller is concerned about the "meet me halfway" issue. You're asking HIM to drive 150 miles one way (300 miles round trip) in order to make a $250 sale. At 30 miles per gallon and $2/gallon gas, that's $20 in gas alone, not to mention roughly six hours of his time (at 50 mph) just for driving time .

If his time is worth (say) $20/hour to him, you're effectively asking him to invest $140 (six hours @ $20, plus $20 in gas) in order to make a $250 sale, and that's IF you show up and IF you buy it when he gets there.

As a buyer, I've driven a significant distance only to be "stood up" by a seller who said he'd be there but wasn't. I strongly suspect that sellers are even more likely to be "burned" by buyers who promise they'll show up at such-and-such a time, only to flake out at the last minute.

If you were willing to drive the whole distance to the seller's place, I can't imagine that the seller would care where you are located.

This is probably the consensus, it seems... as well as the conclusion I probably should have reached prior to pursuing the instrument further. I just have a thing for trying stuff out in person, I guess. Thanks.

**DerTiefster** · Mar-18-2009, 10:31pm

Two solutions come to my mind. At first. There are others, of course.

1: You want the mandolin and $250 isn't the choke point. Spend $50 and send him gas money. Ask him if he's ever wanted to take his spouse/girlfriend somewhere close to mid-way and make it possible for him.

2: Send him ebay listing fee money and ask him to set it up for a certain start time with a buy it now option agreed upon. Or a high first bid to dissuade interlopers plus a "Make offer" option. Your friend makes his offer, the shipment occurs, and all is well. For a few dollars extra you can pay the associated fees. Credit card protections keep you from damage in case he doesn't carry out his end. If he has a paypal account, maybe ebay is superfluous and you can just use a credit card through paypal to pay (plus fees). Then if he doesn't ship, you make the claim on the credit card for non-shipment of goods. I suspect paypal has a mechanism which can be used to escrow money in such cases. Not that it would be necessarily intended for that purpose, but it might be usable for that purpose. If you were to defraud your credit card company, you'd be the one in hot water. Mulitple variations on the theme.

3: It is said that everyone knows someone who knows someone who knows someone who knows just about anyone else in the world. Only 3-4 hops gets you to him. If you can find someone who knows someone who... then maybe you can get the chain completed in few enough jumps to justify confidence in the transaction.

4: Find a friend of a friend who lives closer (10-20 miles) see if you can get him to do the pick-up for you. This is a variation on #3 above.

I actually don't see anything wrong with #2 or some variation on it. Just get clear enough photos to verify the item's condition and either get photos of the packaging process or have a UPS franchise packer do the packing so UPS won't refuse payment if it arrives damaged. (That could even work.)

**liestman** · Mar-19-2009, 4:17am

Originally Posted by Nate

He was looking specifically for a small-size mandolin for travel / campus, and the mando in question was the long-discontinued martin backpacker. I haven't seen another listed anywhere online that I could find. If it was just a cruddy made-in-china beginner's model, I wouldn't have bothered even trying.

Nate, call Humble Music Center in Humble, Texas. (I have no involvement with them.) I was in there late last week and am pretty sure they have a martin backpacker mando in stock. I do not remember the price, as I was not interested, but they are pleasant to deal with and "a real store". (Humble is just NE of Houston.)