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Thread: Tone and string crossing

  1. #1
    Handle Of Science UnityGain's Avatar
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    I've noticed something odd about when I am playing sometimes, I avoid playing certian notes in certian places on the neck due to tone issues.

    Each pair of strings seems to have really different sound to me. The Gs dont sound like the Ds and they don't sound like the As and the Es don't sound like anything else either. This is pretty obvious, but sometimes I find myself avoiding an easier fingering on a string crossing because I don't like the change in tone between the strings. I often play the 7th fret A instead of the open A because the open string plain steel sound doesn't seem to fit with the fretted wound string sound. Sometimes I play whole phrases on a single course for tonal consistancy, but I know that it would be better technique to play multiple courses.

    I'm also concerned that this may be a crutch I've developed to avoid string crossings I'm not confortable with. My right hand is effective, but I have a lot of bad habits and I've neglected formal practice. But it does sound nice to have that tonal consistancy. Or is it an attack and tone issue, that I have to adjust my picking style for each course to get a tone that "fits".
    Gotta start sometime, might as well be now...

  2. #2
    jbmando RIP HK Jim Broyles's Avatar
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    I would make sure that the mandolin's intonation is as good as it can be, and put a new set of strings on there. There's no reason the difference in, say, an E on the 9th fret of the G strings compared to an E at the 2nd fret of the D strings should be all that noticeable. The wound strings will sound less metallic or less shimmery than the plain strings, but it still should not be that drastic.
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  3. #3
    Ursus Mandolinus Fretbear's Avatar
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    The good news is that you are clearly really "listening" to the sounds that you (and the instrument) are producing. This might seem like an obvious thing to do, but it is really important. Often people who play or sing seem to have very little sense of the tone (and tones) they are creating and thereby little sense of the effect that it creates in the listener. I also have an intimate and different relationship with each particular string on my mandolin and they bear little resemblance to one another. Our playing is not just our technique, it is also our set-up and pick and string choices and even the instrument that we own, and it is a long journey towards getting closer to what we are wanting to hear in our heads.
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  4. #4
    Keith
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    I do the same. On the plus side, it encourages me to use my pinky to maintain the same tone in a melody, but I'm sure that it limits my playing in other ways. I've been noticing it (the tone differences in strings) more now as I am working on playing songs in all-closed positions. For me the tonal differences between strings are higher the higher up the fretboard I play, especially on the G and D.

  5. #5
    Registered User Bruce Clausen's Avatar
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    You seem to have stumbled on to something that is a real science among violinists and classical guitarists. No doubt some mandolins are evener across the strings than others, but you'll never get exactly the same sound from a long thin string and a short fat one. And open strings tend to have their own distinctive sound. Classical violinists go to a lot of trouble to avoid playing open strings (for them the lack of vibrato on open strings is part of the problem), and tend to keep phrases on one string where possible. A general rule is not to change strings when you don't really need to. For example, a phrase that rises as high as E but no higher should be kept on the A strings; but if it's going to continue up, change strings (normally by playing open E). Same thing descending: don't change to a lower string if the lowest note you need is available as an open string. As others have said here, it's great to be sensitive to these differences and to use them musically, and it's also a good thing to be using that fourth finger. So I think you're on the right track. But if you're worried you may be avoiding difficult crossings, practice passages both ways, to make sure you aren't choosing your fingering on the basis of going with the easiest solution. Hope this helps.

    BC

  6. #6
    Registered User dj coffey's Avatar
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    Some of the methods out there actually legitimize what you're doing, UnityGain. I think it's Bickford that suggests rather than doing a string crossing on the off beat to an open string, you put that pinky into the action. It seems to be from an economy of motion perspective as well as keeping the notes in the phrase connected.

    We talk about this at the mandolin orchestra a lot - how the open E and A sometimes just doesn't sound very nice - and we'll try instead to use the pinky. But if it comes down to having an ugly open string tone and missing the note altogether, we'll favor the open string in that case!
    Dotty

  7. #7
    but that's just me Bertram Henze's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by (Bruce Clausen @ May 07 2008, 00:16)
    You seem to have stumbled on to something that is a real science among violinists and classical guitarists.
    That is exactly what it is - when I had to learn violin in my youth, I was constantly bugged by teachers NEVER to use open strings because of the difference in sound and the easier transfer of patterns into different positions.

    That is, on the other hand, exactly what I liked about the mandolin - open strings and nobody bugging me. I even like those tone differences on the way when I play a tune, making a constant flow of melody through many sounds, liKE wRitinG wiTHout CarIng abOUt cApiTals.

    Bertram
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  8. #8

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    if it bothers ya, you may want to have your intonation checked as JB said. also, you may want to try the jazzmando strings. i tried them and the sound from fretted and unfretted notes was very close. you may also want to consider running some leather behind your nut and near your tailpiece. what your hearing may be overtones that clash with other strings.

    for the record i like that the notes sound different on different strings, it keeps the mandolin from sounding like the high notes of a piano, now how boring would that be?

  9. #9
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    I think that your choice regarding string crossing is largely artistic preference. I, for one, prefer the tone of the open strings and I cross strings whenever possible because I like the effect of sustaining each note - letting them bleed into one another.

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