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Thread: Bowlbacks of Note

  1. #4501

    Default Re: Bowlbacks of Note

    ipt, are you implying that you are in, or taking the mandolin to Sparta? That would be quite the mando-repatriation! In any case, Stathopoulo's instruments are very fine, indeed, and I congratulate you on your recent acquisition.

    If I may say so... με γεια!

    Cheers,

    Victor
    It is not man that lives but his work. (Ioannis Kapodistrias)

  2. #4502
    Mando-Accumulator Jim Garber's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bowlbacks of Note

    There is a Stathopoulo mandolin pictured on the Epiphone blog.

    Ipt, is this you on that Epiphone blog?:
    Γιάννης Τ January 11, 2009 at 10:06 am

    Anastasios Stathopoulo was from Sparta Greece (Magoula, a village exactly were the ancient Sparta was). This summer, here in Sparta we are organizing a congress about A.Stathopoulo and his contribution to the 20th century luthiere. There will be an exhibition of many Stathopoulo instruments.
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    Jim

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  3. #4503
    Mando-Accumulator Jim Garber's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bowlbacks of Note

    At the National Music Museum in South Dakota is a SStathopoulo bouzouki.

    Unfortunately, it looks like this one had all its hardware changed and converted to an 8 string. Those are 1950 tuners.
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    Jim

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  4. #4504

    Default Re: Bowlbacks of Note

    Dear Jim and Victor
    Actually i live in Magoula Sparta were Stathopoulo was from.
    There are many Stathopoulo Bouzoukis here in Greece,but i have never found a mandolin.
    I have the mandolin in my hands right now. Its not labelled ,but is for sure Stathopoulo.It had some bad repairs through the years but i will fix it.
    This summer we are organizing a congress about stathopoulo and Mediterranean lutherie generally (I am member in a non profit cultural organization based in Sparta who is focused in music and lutherie).I will inform you about the date.
    Greetings from sunny Sparta!
    Giannis

  5. #4505
    Registered User Martin Jonas's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bowlbacks of Note

    Quote Originally Posted by Martin Jonas View Post
    Not one, not two, but three modern reproductions of baroque mandolinos for sale here. I don't think I've heard of the maker, Smyskewich. Two of these are six-course, the third is four-course (if I understand the descriptions correctly).

    Interesting reason for sale: "I am selling these in order to buy a Pedal Steel Guitar so that I can study a Phd in Country Music in America."

    If they are all that their are said to be, that looks like a good price for the entire lot.
    This seller is really desparate to sell: now relisted and dropped by another 900 Pounds.

    That's now around $1000 each -- I don't know anything about the quality, and from looking into the maker's CV it seems he was still a lutherie student at the time, but these prices are fairly silly for a one-off bespoke period reproduction.

    I might have to consider making him an offer on the four-course instrument...

    Martin

  6. #4506

    Default Re: Bowlbacks of Note

    interesting bowl on the Stathopoulo mandolin
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  7. #4507

    Default Re: Bowlbacks of Note

    Interesting, indeed!

    Incidentally, I passed through Magoula in the summer of 1978, as a highschool buddy and I rode a (rather rickety ) motorcycle all along the periphery of the Peloponnese (counter-clockwise), stopping for lunch in Magoula on our way to Monemvasia, where we spent that night.

    Unforgettable, magical places, all of them... As Solomos wrote, echoing Ugo Foscolo, "Κλείσε στην καρδιά σου την Ελλάδα και θα αισθανθής κάθε είδους μεγαλείο..." (He actually wrote it first in Italian himself, while a student, I think, as "Chiudi nel tuo cuore... e sentirai ogni forma di grandezza... e sarai felice.") I'm sure he had places like those in mind...

    I hope Stathopoulo's mandolin feels at home.

    Cheers,

    Victor
    It is not man that lives but his work. (Ioannis Kapodistrias)

  8. #4508

    Default Re: Bowlbacks of Note

    Victor
    Magoula comes from: τόπος μαγικός= magus locus =magical place.

    I hope we see you again soon (we have a beautifull open theater)!
    Congratulations for your work!

  9. #4509
    Full Grown and Cussin' brunello97's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bowlbacks of Note

    Here is an eyecatching bowlback under the label of one Albin Ludwig Paulus from Markneukirchen. Has Herr Paulus appeared in the ranks before? He is making a strong debut for me here:

    http://cgi.ebay.com/Beautiful-vintag...3A2%7C294%3A50

    I enjoy the red-w-mop rosette and even like the fussy strikeplate. It looks like a very nicely made mandolin.

    Mick

  10. #4510
    Registered User Martin Jonas's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bowlbacks of Note

    I haven't come across him, but I note that the label says that Herr Paulus was the court luthier by appointment to His Majesty the King of Saxony (Markneukirchen is in Saxony). I don't know the appointment policy of the royal Saxon court, but assuming that there was only one court luthier, he presumably earned that title against some pretty strong competition from all those other Markneukirchen luthiers, and that suggests that at least he aimed fairly high (whether he reached there, who knows).

    Edit: From a quick Google search, there is some biographical data out there, and several of his violins for sale at prices of $5000 and above. There is also a bit of info here (in German) about the significance of the "court luthier" title. In brief: probably given as an accolade at the discretion of the court to particularly high-quality craftsmen, possibly against payment of a fee, but not implying that the luthier actually made any instruments for the royal family.

    Martin

  11. #4511

    Default Re: Bowlbacks of Note

    There is a Paulus family of bow-makers currently active in Markneukirchen-- incidentally, THE central spot of German lutherie, from all I can tell.

    During the dubiously "good" years of the DDR, there were all sorts of instrumental competitions held there. Invariably, American contestants and/or adjudicators would customarily return with their suitcases stuffed with (more often than not) EXCELLENT bows, all bought at OUTRAGEOUSLY low prices.

    I did, in fact, try out a few Paulus bows. They struck me as... *ahem*... rather spineless, but that of of course may not be indicative of the entire output of the family firm, less yet on the myriad other luthiers of Markneukirchen. Some others I know of, for example, were true masters of their craft. I play a 1904 (then prototype) Adolf Schuster, whose great-grandsons still run the family business, and provide e.g. the bass-section of Berlin Phil with their workhorse-bows routinely. NO superlative is good enough to describe the quality of at least some Neukirchen products.

    Martin, I am also told that, in said DDR-era, the town was abysmally drab-- something not quite hard to imagine. I hope and trust it has improved since...

    Cheers,

    Victor
    It is not man that lives but his work. (Ioannis Kapodistrias)

  12. #4512
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    Default Re: Bowlbacks of Note

    From my violin researches I've learned that Markneukirchen was a central collecting point for home-shop violins since the nineteenth century at least. It also housed factories dedicated to manufacturing of musical instruments, and is the home source for at least two million Stradivari violins.

    As Victor noted, they run the gamut from steam-pressed factory dreck to the finest instruments Germany has produced.

    I think the bowlback in question is a handsome instrument in what appears to be good condition. the top wood looks to be of quality, and the scalloped ribs are frequently indicative of a superior instrument.

  13. #4513
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    Default Re: Bowlbacks of Note

    The Paulus bowlback sold for $515. Seems on the low side. Anyone here score?

  14. #4514
    Mando-Accumulator Jim Garber's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bowlbacks of Note

    Hard to say that $515 is low for a German-made bowlback, even higher-end. if it were Italian. I bet you can double that price. Similar things happen with violins.
    Jim

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  15. #4515
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    Default Re: Bowlbacks of Note

    FWIW, Henly has this to say about Ernst August Paulus: "Born at Wohlhausen, 1888. Worked at Markneukirchen, 1920." There was an August Paulus born in 1851, who made violins in Dresden.

    Delightfully enough, I stumbled on Antonio Pasta, a Brescian maker working from 1700-1730, whose instruments are very highly thought of. I myself can only afford his tastier namesake. Pity he wasn't named Alfredo.

    It's somewhat surprising that there are not more fake Italian labels in mandolins; the violin world is awash in fraud. But I guess there's no real money in mandolins, at least relatively speaking.

  16. #4516
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    Default Re: Bowlbacks of Note

    Dang, just goes to show what happens when you don't bother to read. There's a bunch of Pauluses in Henley's book, and somehow I fixated on August.

    Anyway, here's Albin Ludwig's entry: "Born 1866. Pupil of Doelling. Established at Markneukirchen, 1890. Assisted by son Kurt. Splendid Cremonese models in the category of "commercial". Oil varnish."

    Henley doesn't mention any other instruments made by the man. There are a dozen Pauluses mentioned all told; Adolf P, born in Markneukirchen in 1874, is noted as making guitars and similar instrument, and was known for experiments in violin construction.

    The Germans are slighted in the violin marketplace, at least in terms of prices realised, which one can take as somewhat insulting, or else to the bank as a source of bargain-priced instruments with excellent playing characteristics. As to mandolins, I only have one German bowlback, the Konrad Woelki signature model, and it seems to me that there is a difference between it and the various Italian instruments, in sound and construction. Unfair to extrapolate from a single example, so I won't.

  17. #4517

    Default Re: Bowlbacks of Note

    i have a bouzouki like the one jim garber posted except the sound hole has a dark wood rosette that is more ornate. mine was fallinmg apart when i saw it in a junk store window so i bought it(for $90)and i have had it repaired several times and now it is my main instrument. i love the stathopoulo sound and the shorter scale is much easier to paly for fast tunes than a standard greek bouzouki. i bought another on ebay for $300. iy ws in terrible shape but i loved the first one so much i am willing to spend a grand on repairs. i strung the first on with eight strings in four courses as it has eight machine heads, but i have since learned they used mandolin equipment but meant these to be strung with six strings and three courses so i may get the new one done that way.

    i am a real fan of anastasioa stathopoulo. these mandolins look fabolous as well. he was areal artist and a part of greek and american history.

    i saw a posting that there is to be a festivasl in has honor in sparta this summer. please tell me about that if anyone knows. i was in greece last year and i had a great time--and loved the music. especially cretean music. waht a great country to visit. the ruins are breathtaking, the scenery is spectacular and the people are kind generous and fun. and i was swiming in the lybian sea in december--and i'm canadian!!!!

    i am now looking for a laouto. ther was one on ebay but it got pulled so i missed it. it was a ststhopoulo as well but from 1921 so it must have been by his son epiminondas. a funny name for a spartan. epiminomdas of thebes was the general who ended the spartan hegemony in ancient greece.

    so pleas some information on the festival .i might go.i'd love to see many of his instruments and i might bring one with me. i play celtic music but greeks didn't seem to mind my playing gigs and reels on their national instrument. in fact in crete they seemed absolutely ammused by celtic instest in their music.

  18. #4518

    Default Re: Bowlbacks of Note

    I have send you a private message about the Festival.
    Later i will post in the forum more informations

  19. #4519

    Default Re: Bowlbacks of Note

    In fact, ollaimh, one of the best-known players of the Cretan lyra is an Irishman or Scot-- the name escapes me. Despite the fact that folk music is by definition nation-specific, I, too, have found that people from ALL around the world take pleasure and delight in other people's folk music.

    If only one could expound upon this goodwill globally, and in other matters, too...

    I would LOVE to see a laouto by Stathopoulo! You say that the one listed on eBay has been withdrawn but, if such a thing reappears, please post it here. As far as I'm concerned, that's mando-related enough.

    Cheers,

    Victor
    It is not man that lives but his work. (Ioannis Kapodistrias)

  20. #4520

    Default Re: Bowlbacks of Note

    You mean Ross Daly.He has a web site www.rossdalymusic.com.
    He plays ethnic and also traditional cretan music.I will post pictures of mine stathopoulo lute.

  21. #4521

    Default Re: Bowlbacks of Note

    You are right! As final proof of the phenomenon of osmosis, Ross even LOOKS Cretan!

    ... and, if you have had a chance of hearing him speak --in fluent Greek!-- you surely know that he speaks it with a WONDERFUL regional accent. Τσ' ήρτα' οι λυράααρηδες τσ' επαίξανε πορράαααα...

    My grandmaternal lineage goes back to Rhethymno; clan Vardakis-- another place on my to-do list, by way of vacation travels. The serious risk, however, in such a visit is that I may return home with... more instruments!

    Cheers,

    Victor
    It is not man that lives but his work. (Ioannis Kapodistrias)

  22. #4522

    Smile Re: Bowlbacks of Note

    More istruments for sure!!!

  23. #4523

    Default Re: Bowlbacks of Note

    Demetrios Mourtzinos

    Here is a mandolin from the greatest greek maker.He was born in Aegina probably at 1870? and died in Athens at 1932.
    This mandolin (1902)has an ebony bowl, and the decoration istortoise shell, silver and mother of pearl.A real piece of art.Needs restoration
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  24. #4524

    Default Re: Bowlbacks of Note

    I am familiar with the legacy and reputation of Mourtzinos but... are you sure that the bowl is made of ebony? I had always been told that ebony is simply too hard a wood to bend on the heating-iron. (That, of course, excludes baglamades/tzourades whose bowl is carved, and therefore IS made occasionally from ebony-blocks.) Curious...
    It is not man that lives but his work. (Ioannis Kapodistrias)

  25. #4525

    Default Re: Bowlbacks of Note

    Ebony is hard to bend ,but this one is made of ebony, as many mourtzinos and kopeliades lutes(ebony and flamed maple).Also zozef a famous bouzouki maker used in his top instruments. Tzouras and baglamas are usually made (carved) from mulberry tree walnut or maple,although I have seen an ebony baglama. The less expensive instruments are made from soft woods.
    (Sorry for my bad english)

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