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Thread: Fretting Technique

  1. #1
    Horton River NWT Rob Gerety's Avatar
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    Default Fretting Technique

    I'm new to mandolin and although I have played acoustic guitar for many years I never played much in the way of melody or lead. One of the reasons I started with the mandolin was to begin learning celtic and other melodies. I have made a lot of progress. But I'm definitely a beginner or intermediate at best and I have a lot to learn.

    Lately I have begun to speed things up a bit with many of the tunes and I am finding that my playing often becomes choppy when I get going at a faster pace. If I am playing in the range of 60 to 80 bbm I'm usually ok. But when I start going over that range I often find that my playing isn't smooth. I'm convinced that the source of the problem is my fretting hand, not my picking hand and I am beginning to think that a major part of the problem is related to my failure to pay close attention to keeping my fingers down on the fretboard as I move notes up a string and removing my fingers one at a time (depending on the situation of course) as I work down a scale. I tend to learn tunes (I play just about 100% by ear) at a very slow tempo and then when I start moving up the speed I discover that the fretting technique I burned into my fingers is not ideal and doesn't work smoothly at speed. Then it is very hard for me to go back and relearn my fingering - I have to almost go back to square one and learn the tune again at very slow speed concentrating hard on keeping my fingers down on the board to the extent possible. Basically its the old finger flapping issue rearing its ugly head from time to time.

    Are you all strict with yourselves about this? Do you pay close attention and leave your fingers down on the board when possible? Do you have this same issue I am experiencing as far as a loss of rhythmic quality because of imperfect fretting technique? Any suggestions how to conquer this issue?
    Rob G.
    Vermont

  2. #2

    Default Re: Fretting Technique

    Keeping the fingers down is very important. I find that a lot of my students need to know that a quarter note for example needs to last for its full time value, too often they clip the note short and this can lead to a choppy sound. Co-ordination between the left and right hand is important too, you don't want to pick the string before it is cleanly fretted. Using the metronome and slowly increasing tempo always helps.

  3. #3

    Default Re: Fretting Technique

    Economy of motion is something that I'm continually having to focus on. Not only with keeping my fingers close but also not pressing any more than necessary. Sometime when trying to speed up the right hand tenses so the left does as well. If you are aware you can focus on relaxing and keeping your form even when playing faster. At least that is what I notice in my own playing, I'm no speed demon...

  4. #4
    Horton River NWT Rob Gerety's Avatar
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    Default Re: Fretting Technique

    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Bunting View Post
    I find that a lot of my students need to know that a quarter note for example needs to last for its full time value, too often they clip the note short and this can lead to a choppy sound.
    I think this is exactly what I'm struggling with when the speed starts to move up. But I think the source of the problem is primarily my fretting hand technique not so much a coordination issue or tension issue (although I am sure some tension does creep in). I need to work on economy of motion so that I can give the notes the correct time value. This is exactly the issue.

    I think sometimes I lift a finger unnecessarily out of a subconscious to desire to get it out of the way to avoid a buzz from touch the adjoining lower (higher pitch) string. It may be that I should work a bit on keeping my fingers more erect .
    Rob G.
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    Default Re: Fretting Technique

    Quote Originally Posted by Rob Gerety View Post
    I think sometimes I lift a finger unnecessarily out of a subconscious to desire to get it out of the way to avoid a buzz from touch the adjoining lower (higher pitch) string. It may be that I should work a bit on keeping my fingers more erect .
    If that is an issue reviewing the way you hold the instrument may help. If you have it tilted towards you a little to view the fretboard your fingers have to travel round a greater curve, or if your fretting fingers cross the strings at right angles, the angle between adjacent strings is less forgiving than if they cross obliquely.

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    Registered User Ivan Kelsall's Avatar
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    Default Re: Fretting Technique

    Rob - One of the best ways that i've discovered that 'works for me' when learning a new tune or simply practicing what i already know,is to literally noodle around,but,all the while, paying close attention to my fingering. This way i don't 'over concentrate' or get tense over it. I simply take care to hit the notes as cleanly as i can & after a while it becomes automatic. I don't mean to imply that my way of working things out takes the place of 'proper' practice,it's more of an add-on to it,the way i 'refine' what i'm doing. I'll literally play the same tune a 100 times if necessary to get it 'clean',once i've done that, i'm ready to roll !,
    Ivan
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  7. #7
    Horton River NWT Rob Gerety's Avatar
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    Default Re: Fretting Technique

    This is great help folks. The issue I'm dealing with is that I when I learn the tune slowly I use a fingering technique that works fine slow but falls apart at speed. This isn't all the time - just some tunes. I think the biggest thing I can do is to pay closer attention to keeping my fingers down on the fingerboard when I am learning the tune so that I will have that muscle memory as I crank up the speed. Also, I do tend to tilt the mandolin slightly upward - just a little mind you - but it does help to keep it aligned perpendicular to the floor. I'm already seeing improvement. Thanks for the input folks.
    Rob G.
    Vermont

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    Registered User Ivan Kelsall's Avatar
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    Default Re: Fretting Technique

    A couple of weeks ago,i finished reading "I Hear A Voice Calling" By Gene Lowinger,a former fiddle player with Bill Monroe & in passing,i'll say it's a book well worth reading. When he'd finished being a Bluegrass Boy,one of the things he did was to become a Classical Violinist & also a Violin teacher.
    He advised learning pieces slowly at first & then learning to play them up to tempo. Some of his students remarked that they made less mistakes if they played faster. His take on that, was that they didn't make less mistakes,the mistakes were still there but didn't last as long. I think we could all learn from that,
    Ivan
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    Innocent Bystander JeffD's Avatar
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    Default Re: Fretting Technique

    I like to do finger exercises. Not because I am a glutton for punishment, but because I often want to play the mandolin but have no particular tune in mind.

    There are many sources of finger exercises, as one can use the books for mandolin as well as those for fiddle. FFcP is widely considered an excellent set of exercises.

    I have been trying to do exercises lately that emphasize the notes of chords, arpeggios and the like. That way the exercises can be fit into background playing and help with turnarounds and improvs. I practice at slow speeds moving only those fingers I need to.

    Another short cut I like is when reaching up the neck with my pinky, I put all the fingers down. They're all on the same string so they are "hidden" behin the pinky and make no sound, but it adds support to the pinky, keeps the fingers down, and often enough the tune will need them there in the next note or two.
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    Ben Beran Dfyngravity's Avatar
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    Default Re: Fretting Technique

    Two things that most great players have is efficiency and great coordination. Keeping the left and right hand in sync with each other is probably one of if not the most important aspect of playing a plucked instrument. If one or the other becomes out of sync then the sound will be choppy and probably muffled. That's why practicing with a metronome is so important. Everyone has the ability to play fast, you just have to train your brain a bit.

    Efficiency or as Terry put it "Economy of Motion" is also extremely important too. Anything you can do that reduces the energy inputted to obtain the same output is always better. Whether it is keeping certain fingers down or even slides, hammer-ons and pull-offs. All ofthese are fretting hand techniques that reduce motion, in return making your picking more efficient. Also pick motion can be reduced too. The longer the pick stroke, the more energy/ time is needed to return the pick for the next pick stroke. So working on a short, precise pick stroke is another way of becoming more efficient.

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    Work in Progress Ed Goist's Avatar
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    Default Re: Fretting Technique

    Quote Originally Posted by JeffD View Post
    I like to do finger exercises. Not because I am a glutton for punishment, but because I often want to play the mandolin but have no particular tune in mind....snip...I have been trying to do exercises lately that emphasize the notes of chords, arpeggios and the like. That way the exercises can be fit into background playing and help with turnarounds and improvs. I practice at slow speeds moving only those fingers I need to....snip...
    I just started to work on Tim O'Brien's Mandolin Warmups. In the first half he's working on floating a-scales, while in the second half he displays a 'chord splitting exercise'. Just listen to it - Sweet! Jeff hits the nail on the head when he says this will '...fit into background playing and help with turnarounds and improvs'

  12. #12

    Default Re: Fretting Technique

    Rob, sorry to go off subject, but I did the Horton in 1993. Greatest trip of my life.
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  13. #13
    Horton River NWT Rob Gerety's Avatar
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    Default Re: Fretting Technique

    Really! Small world. Aren't that many folks on this planet that have dipped a paddle up there. Some country eh? It sure gets in your blood stream. I just wish it wasn't so darned expensive.
    Rob G.
    Vermont

  14. #14
    Horton River NWT Rob Gerety's Avatar
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    Default Re: Fretting Technique

    Since I started this thread perhaps I can take a little privilege and point everyone reading this to these photos which will explain what Bob and I are talking about - http://www.mandolincafe.com/forum/album.php?albumid=621. Turns out and Bob and I share the experience of having paddled the Horton River in the North West Territories - 375 miles or so from just north of Great Bear Lake - to the Arctic Ocean. Here is one shot of a spot on the Horton River, NWT - not far from the Arctic Ocean (Anderson Bay):
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    Rob G.
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