Results 1 to 12 of 12

Thread: Refret...

  1. #1
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Location
    Eugene, OR
    Posts
    29

    Default

    Hello, I have an Eastman 804 that I've worn the frets down on quite a bit. I play some bluegrass, but mostly gypsy eastern european music. I was wondering if it a luthier can put larger banjo sized frets on a mando that already has smaller mando frets. Anyone done this? Thanks for the info.

    much love,
    travis

  2. #2
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    Philadelphia
    Posts
    301

    Default

    A good luthier should have no problem using a wider fret. There have been tons of discussions about this topic already. If I were more computer savy I would include a link to these conversations. But I'm not, so a quick search of this website should do the trick for you.

    Jeremy

  3. #3
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Sep 2003
    Location
    Nashville
    Posts
    4,966

    Default

    Yes. You can have about any sized frets you want. You just want to be sure you want a larger fret wire.
    Have a Great Day!
    Joe Vest

  4. #4
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Location
    Eugene, OR
    Posts
    29

    Default

    If you refret with larger fret, does one usually have to replace the nut?

  5. #5
    Registered User steve V. johnson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Location
    Bloomington, Indiana
    Posts
    3,863

    Default

    Shortly after I got a '36 Kalamazoo KM-11 mandolin, a friend played it and complained about the tiny and worn original frets and offered to refret it for me, so I agreed.

    He used larger fretwire than the original (the originals were TINY!!) and I love it. I don't know the actual size, but I'll ask him.
    I think he might know... <GG>

    I didn't need to change the nut, but I did later on, for other reasons. The original ebony one was very worn and I changed it to bone. But that's another discussion...

    stv
    steve V. johnson

    Culchies
    http://cdbaby.com/Culchies
    The Lopers
    Ghosts Like Me
    http://cdbaby.com/Lopers1
    There Was A Time
    http://cdbaby.com/Lopers2

  6. #6
    two t's and one hyphen fatt-dad's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2003
    Location
    Richmond, Virginia
    Posts
    7,635

    Default

    One "problem" with the larger fretwire is that if you push down hard on the fretwire, you'll sharpen the fretted note. Just something to consider. I find the old-style fretwire too thin but the guitar-size fretwire too large. I like the fretwire on my Flatirons - wish I could better describe the size.

    f-d
    ¡papá gordo ain’t no madre flaca!

    '20 A3, '30 L-1, '97 914, 2012 Cohen A5, 2012 Muth A5, '14 OM28A

  7. #7
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Rock Hill, SC
    Posts
    41

    Default

    I think you may have unwittingly solved a little mystery for me, fatt-dad. Thanks! I was afraid I'd somehow messed up my intonation... but as usual, it's the player, not the instrument. I should have known that!
    Chris

  8. #8
    I'll take it! JGWoods's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Location
    Chelmsford MA
    Posts
    1,408

    Default

    Larger goes 2 ways- taller and/or wider.
    Stewmac diagrams show a couple of choices- the height is almost the same but the width varies a lot. Most people seem to like wider frets these days.
    I like the old skinny stuff- it's hard as can be, seems to be much harder than the modern stuff, and there's few intonation problems. If you have tall skinny frets you trip on them a lot if you like to slide notes, and wider seems to be better for sliding around. If the frets are low and wide I often overshoot if I slide into a note.
    Be yourself, everyone else is taken.
    Favorite Mandolin of the week: 2013 Collings MF Gloss top.

  9. #9
    coprolite mandroid's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2002
    Location
    Outer Spiral Arm, of Galaxy, NW Oregon.
    Posts
    17,103

    Default

    slides up the string , particularly with 4 string instruments are easier with a trifle less abrubt fret, low and wider , harder material would be consistant with pitch not getting sharper with fret notching from wear.
    more a speedbump than a parking wheelstop.
    writing about music
    is like dancing,
    about architecture

  10. #10
    Café habitué Paul Hostetter's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2003
    Location
    Santa Cruz, California
    Posts
    6,286

    Default

    Travis -

    One "problem" with the larger fretwire is that if you push down hard on the fretwire, you'll sharpen the fretted note.

    I hear this every so often and in 40 years I have never been able to find anyone who could actually do it. They can grip so hard they bend the string sideways, but raise the pitch? Nope, never. I think the claim is utterly bogus. One can use a very hard-surfaced capo, which is a mechanical clamp, and perhaps bend a note slightly, but do that with finger pressure - no way.

    Sliding on string is far more a matter of motor skills on the part of the player than anything else. Pairs of strings are like a ribbon upon which a fingertip can easily glide, far easier than on a single string. And guitarists still don’t seem to have trouble with that, do they? Is it their frets? No, it’s their playing skill. Rough frets ends are far more of an impediment to playing than sharp edges, although a well-crowned fret is a fine and necessary thing.

    I work with a lot of pretty demanding mandolinists, and by and large they prefer larger frets over the ultra-small stuff that is the norm for Gibsons and their clones. They are easier to get a clear note on, and they last longer. My standard fret for the serious mandolinist is Dunlop 6280, which has changed specs slightly over the years. I bought bales of the stuff many years ago and I’m still using it. They no longer even offer it.* It’s .076” wide and .044” tall. People are fond of calling it “pre-war Gibson” wire, or banjo wire,” even though it’s much larger than what Gibson used on mandolins, or even banjos. It’s a bit like their guitar wire then.

    An alternative wire is Dunlop’s 6230, which was a very normal guitar wire for many years: .080” x .043” (the wire found in older Fender necks). I think height is what you want: the taller the fret, the less finger pressure it takes to get a clear note, and the longer the frets will last – if you adjust your touch to take advantage of the height. Some people squeeze real hard on anything they have and it doesn’t make much difference what wire they use.

    I am quite fond of Stew-Mac’s wires – their alloy is a bit harder than the Dunlop, and their specs are more consistent. I have three bales of 6230 Dunlop wire, each is different. The Stew-Mac wire is not all the same height, and the differences are considerable from the point of view of the player. I place height as the most important consideration. The width of the wire helps a bit with durability, but it has just as much or moreso to do with visuals. Full-on guitar frets look a bit odd on a mandolin. That said, some of my clients won’t settle for less.

    The nut slot has to clear the frets, and unless the board itself has been planed down as part of the refret process, taller frets will require a replacement nut. I just finished a lovely A2Z with Dunlop 6280s, and after the board was trued, the original nut was still just about perfect. I just had to touch off the slots. This is unusual though.

    *Their current 6270 is .076 x .030
    Their current 6290 is .078 x .040 - both are the usual 18% alloy. Both a shorter than the old stuff.
    .
    ph

    º º º º º º º º º º º º º º º
    Paul Hostetter, luthier
    Santa Cruz, California
    www.lutherie.net

  11. #11
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Jordanstown, Northern Ireland
    Posts
    409

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by
    I hear this every so often and in 40 years I have never been able to find anyone who could actually do it. They can grip so hard they bend the string sideways, but raise the pitch? Nope, never. I think the claim is utterly bogus. One can use a very hard-surfaced capo, which is a mechanical clamp, and perhaps bend a note slightly, but do that with finger pressure - no way.
    Just tried this on my homemade and I'm sorry to say that we'll have to meet up cos it DEFINITELY does this if I fret too hard!! Especially if I play A as a 4 string barre, then a two string barre and a finger on the E string too...... gotta get outa THAT habit!!!
    Quote Originally Posted by stout1
    Now, thanks to Martin and his guitar shaped mandola, I have been stricken with GBMAS, guitar body mandola acqusition syndrome
    hey!! I got my own Syndrome!!!!

  12. #12
    Registered User ira's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Location
    holliston, ma
    Posts
    2,217

    Default

    love the banjo fretwire on my mando. it frets like a dream, easy slides, bends,etc... much improved playability for me over mandos with thin fret wire. but like raduis boards, f vs a, fhole vs oval hole, etc... its all preference.

Similar Threads

  1. Cost of refret
    By Stephen Lind in forum Builders and Repair
    Replies: 50
    Last: Oct-20-2015, 3:43pm
  2. Refret job
    By JeffD in forum Builders and Repair
    Replies: 18
    Last: Jul-04-2007, 3:32pm
  3. refret in n.c.
    By John Rosett in forum General Mandolin Discussions
    Replies: 8
    Last: Mar-04-2006, 12:44pm
  4. Refret and vintage value...
    By AndyG in forum Builders and Repair
    Replies: 6
    Last: Oct-01-2005, 10:58am
  5. refret
    By happycamper in forum Builders and Repair
    Replies: 1
    Last: Mar-15-2004, 8:24pm

Bookmarks

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •