point protecters

**mandolinplucker** · Apr-25-2006, 12:33am

I am building a 2 point with F holes,or at least thats what I hope thats what I hope it winds up being. I am almost to the stage of binding. I will cut the binding ledge with a shop made fixture on my router table. I will use bone for the point protecters but I dont know the procedure. Do I make the bone the thickness of the sides plus the the thickness of the top and back,glue it on and shape it and then cut the binding ledge around the complete outside? Or do I bind it and then go back and file down the points between the bindings and then cut,shape, and glue in the bone between the bindings?

**Antlurz** · Apr-25-2006, 1:08am

I personally feel more comfortable putting the protectors on first, then cutting the binding ledges. Seems to me, one gets a better fit that way. YMMV

Like anything else handmade, there are a million different ways to do it.

Ron

**HoGo** · Apr-25-2006, 3:39am

I'd install the bone after the binding. You can ruin router bit on a really hard bone. The gluing surface can be prepared before routing for binding. On my last mandolins I forgot to do this and filed the edges after cutting for binding with no problems.
For plastic edges you can glue on oversized point protectors before gluing plates on the rim and shape the rim with them...
Adrian

**sunburst** · Apr-25-2006, 8:00am

As mentioned, there are as many ways to put the protectors on as there are points to protect. I've tried several of them, and settled on the one that sounds the hardest, but for me, is the easiest.

I leave the points on the rim, (still wood, not cut off yet) and apply the binding. That makes it easier to get good miters on the binding corners, especially with plastic bindings, because the wood is still there to support the binding.
Next, after the binding is cured, I cut away the wood between the bindings, cut a dovetail into the binding, and cut the protectors over-sized, so that they fit against the wood and in the binding dovetail, but are big and standing proud all around. That way, the dovetail can tighten, and the protector can be cut flush with the rim later.
The binding dovetail clamps the joint. I don't have to tape them, or rig up some sort of clamping mechanism to clamp the points on to glue them.
I've done this with bone points, but now I use ivoroid for the point protectors. The method works for any material.
After the glue is cured, I just file the protectors down to the rim, and continue preparing for finish.

**carleshicks** · Apr-25-2006, 8:37am

Sunburst. That is probably the same procedure used at Gibson in the '20". Can you show us any pictures of your finished product or your process.

**sunburst** · Apr-25-2006, 9:19am

carleshicks, I got the idea from looking at the Loars. I don't have any pics, sorry, but I have a mandolin that is almost ready to bind, and maybe I can get some when I get a chance to work on it.
When they're done, the points look very much like the ones on a Loar, only they haven't had 80 years of some degree of "distress" to move things around.

**buddyellis** · Apr-25-2006, 11:13am

Originally Posted by (mandolinplucker @ April 25 2006, 01:33)

I am building a 2 point with F holes,or at least thats what I hope thats what I hope it winds up being. I am almost to the stage of binding. I will cut the binding ledge with a shop made fixture on my router table. I will use bone for the point protecters but I dont know the procedure. Do I make the bone the thickness of the sides plus the the thickness of the top and back,glue it on and shape it and then cut the binding ledge around the complete outside? Or do I bind it and then go back and file down the points between the bindings and then cut,shape, and glue in the bone between the bindings?

I read an article the other day re: dudenbostel, and he applies them first, then cuts the binding:

"I put the points on the rim before gluing on either the top or back plates and shape them at that time, then level them with the rest of the rim. Once the top and back are glued on, I route for the binding, right over the points, and glue it in as usual. I often "butter" the ends of the binding where they contact the points or where two pieces come together with a bit of binding material melted in acetone. That helps make the joints invisble. I use ivoroid for the points, not bone."

http://www.mandozine.com/resources/CGOW/dudenbostel.php

**Larry Simonson** · Apr-25-2006, 7:57pm

Mandolinplucker, any chance you could post a few details or a picture of your ledge routing fixture? Thanks.

**mandolinplucker** · Apr-25-2006, 10:31pm

I got the Idea from the mandolin making series on DIY By Lyn dudenbostle. I havent figured the picture thing out yet but I'll try to explain. I used a 2in wide by 1in or a little thicker board. Narrow and round the end so that it will fit into curves around the points and get close to the scroll. Drill a hole about a half inch back from the pointed end of the jig that a straight bit will fit in. Make the jig long enough that you can clamp it to the router table. Shape another board about 1 in wide and make the end just a little wider than the bit that you are using and rounded at the front. Glue and screw it to the bottom board so that the front of the top board is over the front side of the hole in the bottom. clamp it to the table with the bit through the hole. turn the router on and raise the bit and cut into the top board to the debth of your binding ledge and with a hammer tap the jig back till you have the bit exposed enough for the width. With this jig you hold the body in your hands and feed it slowly to make the cut. Confused? The mando sits on the bottom board to controll the width and goes back against the top board to controll the debth. MAKE TEST CUTS FIRST

**Gail Hester** · Apr-25-2006, 11:08pm

This is just one way but it seems logical to me. I put the point protectors on as soon as the rim is finished, then glue on the plates and trim. Lastly, I route the binding channels and install the binding. Here are a couple pictures.

**Gail Hester** · Apr-25-2006, 11:09pm

Then the binding.

**amowry** · Apr-25-2006, 11:15pm

Here's the guide I use on the router table-- it sounds similar to what Tony is describing.

**Chris Baird** · Apr-25-2006, 11:18pm

I think I do it mostly like Gail. Glue the points on the rim sans top and back. Flush them up; I also spindle sand them into almost finished shape. Then I glue on the top and back.

**sunburst** · Apr-25-2006, 11:48pm

OK, here I am, so far. The points are there, but they're still wood. I'll finish binding, then cut the point away between the bindings.

**sunburst** · Apr-25-2006, 11:51pm

I usually leave a gap between the ribs at the corners. It's going to get cut away anyway, so I don't take the time to try for a good fit, other than to the corner blocks.

I'll be traveling the end of this week and into next week, so it might be a while before I can continue the pictures, and besides, the binding has to cure.

**Michael Lewis** · Apr-26-2006, 12:25am

Gail, ebony points! I didn't think anyone else did that beside me.

**Gail Hester** · Apr-26-2006, 1:06am

Michael, I try to keep everything very traditional but I like the clean binding line with ebony points. I'm caving in though on my current batch and using some celluloid points.

John, that method went out in 1924.

Very cool, someday I'll get brave enough to try that.

**mandolinplucker** · Apr-26-2006, 10:18am

newtonamic- A picture is worth a thousand words- Amowry has the same setup as mine except his is more refined. He uses wing nuts for adjustments and I use the skillful whack if a hammer. Before I do another one I am going to get a downcut spiral straight bit. Supposed to lessen the chance of tearout and shears a cleaner edge.