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Thread: Need OM Info

  1. #1
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    So, I've had my Trinity College for about a year now and, while I knew I'd never become a full blown master picker in need of some serious hardware, as a musician for the past 16 years, the intonation issues of my OM is starting to become very irksome.

    So, I'm looking to upgrade to a mid-level instrument (maybe in the $1000-$1200) range and I was wondering if anyone had any reccomendations. The only one in contention right now is the Breedlove Quartz OO (http://breedloveguitars.com/products..._of/index.html). If anyone has any personal experiences with this or other OM's, please share them.

    Rob

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    Registered User jmkatcher's Avatar
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    Unless there are new models out, Breedlove doesn't make OMs.

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    Are you asking for an oval hole mandolin or an OM = Octave Mandolin. I'm not aware of a Breedlove Octave Mandolin. They make some good oval hole mandolins...but no octave.

    Paul

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    Hi Rob - That OM bug can sure bite you hard, eh. While I think the Breedlove oval holes are very nice for the money, they aren't OM's. They only come as standard mandolins. There are a good number of makers out there in your price range, though. One that I like is Peterson. You can see his stuff at Elderly and Gryphon, and I believe he has a website of his own. Another builder that I like very much is Chris Baird at www.archesmusic.com I have a flat-top mando from Chris, and I have an F4 on order from him. I haven't played one of his OM's, but the folks who have them say they are great. Good luck and happy hunting.
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    Quote Originally Posted by (PCypert @ Oct. 03 2005, 22:50)
    Are you asking for an oval hole mandolin or an OM = Octave Mandolin. #I'm not aware of a Breedlove Octave Mandolin. #They make some good oval hole mandolins...but no octave.

    Paul
    Appears I got the oval confused with the octave on that website... I'm looking for am OM.

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    AKA BBQ King Dan Eaton's Avatar
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    I have a Petersen Level 3 Spruce/Koa OM that I'm very pleased with. #

    I bought it off the shelf at Gryphon Strings in Palo Alto, CA. #It plays beyond belief. #The strings ring longer than anything I've ever heard.

    Matter of fact, I'm happy enough that my second Petersen is in the works. #This time it will be a Level 3 Cedar/Rosewood.

    One of his Level 1 or 2 OMs would definitely be in your price range. #There's a link to his website in the Eye Candy section. #Bill is very responsive with email.

    Happy Hunting !!

    BBQ
    Dan

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    Quote Originally Posted by (BBQ King @ Oct. 03 2005, 23:03)
    I have a Petersen Level 3 Spruce/Koa OM that I'm very pleased with. #

    I bought it off the shelf at Gryphon Strings in Palo Alto, CA. #It plays beyond belief. #The strings ring longer than anything I've ever heard.

    Matter of fact, I'm happy enough that my second Petersen is in the works. #This time it will be a Level 3 Cedar/Rosewood.

    One of his Level 1 or 2 OMs would definitely be in your price range. #There's a link to his website in the Eye Candy section. #Bill is very responsive with email.

    Happy Hunting !!

    BBQ
    I picked up my Trinity College at Folk of the Wood -- so I'm looking to take advantage of their trade-in (100% minus a few costs), but the selection there jumps from about $800 all the way up to $1700 for a Weber...

    I was looking at the Petersen -- wonder if FOTW can get them. ;p

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    Good luck trading up with FOTW. You might want to seriously consider selling it and taking a hit and buying elsewhere. You can get more OM for your dollar used. In the 1K range I'd look at Mid Missouri, Flatiron OM, Peterson, Fylde, and maybe a Weber Sage. If you must go FOTW I'd wait a while and let all the dust settle. There's a whole changeover going on there and you don't want to send you instrument and never get another. Do a search here in the threads. Best of luck. Let us know the sound characteristics you're after....whether you play melody lines or back up mostly.

    Paul

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    Quote Originally Posted by (PCypert @ Oct. 04 2005, 00:42)
    Good luck trading up with FOTW. #You might want to seriously consider selling it and taking a hit and buying elsewhere. #You can get more OM for your dollar used. #In the 1K range I'd look at Mid Missouri, Flatiron OM, Peterson, Fylde, and maybe a Weber Sage. #If you must go FOTW I'd wait a while and let all the dust settle. #There's a whole changeover going on there and you don't want to send you instrument and never get another. #Do a search here in the threads. #Best of luck. #Let us know the sound characteristics you're after....whether you play melody lines or back up mostly.

    Paul
    Paul,

    I'm mostly doing outdoor playing -- as for sound characteristics, I'm still a bit of a novice to know what I want; I just know that with my Trinity College (and my friends', we have the same one) there are a lot of intonation issues with the G string... if you push down with any force, the string starts to go sharp and it's much worse the higher up the fret board you go.

    So, in terms of characteristics, I'd really be happy with an instrument that had a decent amount of projection and sounded stellar and in tune from the bottom of the fretboard to the top.

    Am I asking too much for a $1200 OM?

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    Hey,
    1200 can get you a very good OM. You're not going to get a Sobell or a carved top OM (probably) but you can get a very good one. There's some builders in New Zealand and Australia that'll build you a very good OM for a little bit more. They have a waiting list that'll let you save up some more money while you wait...but know you probably want one now. Many good options, good players, etc. I really like the MidMo as it's a no frills version of everything else out there. At this price point you're paying for a lot of the same stuff and this way you can save some money. Like the Weber Sage is a lot of the same OM (IMHO) as the MidMo Octave...but you can get the MidMo in rosewood if you want (good overtones...maybe sacrifice a little volume over the maple). Really an old Flatiron OM/Zouk or a MidMo at this price point. A few hundred more dollars and you could get into private builders and a hole new range of instruments. I think it's best to save a couple hundred towards your next one so save some money by not getting the Weber and get the MidMo for example. It'll beat your Trinity college hands down and will save you some bucks. Plus great guys to work with. Then save your money (while playing the dog out of the one you have) so you can join the Crump club later on . Another option is with the money saved get a little beater mandolin to go along with it for fun....

    Paul

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    Quote Originally Posted by (PCypert @ Oct. 04 2005, 10:31)
    Hey,
    1200 can get you a very good OM. #You're not going to get a Sobell or a carved top OM (probably) but you can get a very good one. #There's some builders in New Zealand and Australia that'll build you a very good OM for a little bit more. #They have a waiting list that'll let you save up some more money while you wait...but know you probably want one now. #Many good options, good players, etc. #I really like the MidMo as it's a no frills version of everything else out there. #At this price point you're paying for a lot of the same stuff and this way you can save some money. #Like the Weber Sage is a lot of the same OM (IMHO) as the MidMo Octave...but you can get the MidMo in rosewood if you want (good overtones...maybe sacrifice a little volume over the maple). #Really an old Flatiron OM/Zouk or a MidMo at this price point. #A few hundred more dollars and you could get into private builders and a hole new range of instruments. #I think it's best to save a couple hundred towards your next one so save some money by not getting the Weber and get the MidMo for example. #It'll beat your Trinity college hands down and will save you some bucks. #Plus great guys to work with. #Then save your money (while playing the dog out of the one you have) so you can join the Crump club later on . #Another option is with the money saved get a little beater mandolin to go along with it for fun....

    Paul
    Paul,

    Thanks for the advice -- I was looking at the MidMo and wasn't sure how they might've stacked up... I was looking at this one:

    http://www.folkofthewood.com/page2184.htm

    Any thoughts on the M-80?

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    Look around. I bought Mike Orlando's Flatiron 3MC bouzouki off the Cafe classifieds for $850 a few months ago, and have it tuned as an OM. This is a 96 model, looks like it was made yesterday. Other than the 23.5" scale length which is way too long for me, it sounds and plays great. I'm sure it will be up for sale again when Chris Baird gets my OM made, because I am mando poor lately. But, I may have to hang on to it if I can. Seems like you can get a lot more for your $ in an OM than in a mando, maybe because they are better suited to flat top?

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    Butcherer of Songs Rob Zamites's Avatar
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    Another luthier to look at is Doug Dieter, in Burlington, IN -- he advertises a base OM model for $995. The soundclips I've heard of his instruments are quite nice. Kennaquhair Instruments.
    For that price, he *includes* a Fishman NT-1 pickup and a custom hard shell case -- now that's a hell of a deal!
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    You may want to take a look at these threads before you have further dealings with Folk of the Wood:

    FOTW - Thread 1

    FOTW - Thread 2
    Fiddles
    Arches F4 / Newson F5
    Crump B1 / Old Wave GOM

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    Quote Originally Posted by (Jim M. @ Oct. 04 2005, 12:35)
    You may want to take a look at these threads before you have further dealings with Folk of the Wood. #


    Thanks, Jim -- I've had good dealings with them in the past, so I'll keep a more reserved head when I'm dealing with them.

    I've become enamored with the look of the Kennaquhair big bodied OM, and have sent an inquiry out about that to the maker -- I'm just really looking to offload my Trinity College as soon as I have everything together to get a new one.

    I recently made a recording and the bloody G string is killing me (http://devnull.dtcc.edu/gfx/120.mp3). #Just hoping it isn't me... #remember, I've only been play just about a year with no guitar or previous string experience. ;p



  16. #16
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    Wynder-
    It may be that a little skilled technical assistance could fix the intonation problem with your Trinity College OM... have you looked into that? it may be a matter of adjusting the action, nut or bridge. Worth considering even while you are exploring other options...
    KE
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    KE,

    I'd though about having it looked at, but the fact is that I wouldn't trust any of the guys at the music shops around these parts. Granted I'm (just barely) south of the Mason Dixon, but mandolin isn't much of a common instrument... Octaves even more so. ;/

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    Registered User steve V. johnson's Avatar
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    HI Wynder,

    Doug Dieter at Kennaquahir is a wonderful guy. His zouks tend to be quiet acoustically and wonderful when plugged in. I know of two for sale just now, but both are five-course, that is, ten-string models. Very nice, but quiet.

    I would recommend looking at the classifieds here, and on Elderly Instruments website. As mentioned above, the Peterson OMs/zouks are a real good value, and in your price range.

    Folk of the Wood seems to be in 'crash & burn' mode, I wouldn't count too much on being able to deal with them any more.

    All the best,

    stv
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    The G string intonation problem that you mention is common on TC & other short scale OMs. It is caused by a combination of factors - the heavy string needed to get a solid G at 20" is stiff and the fretwire used on the PacRim Oms is quite tall. If you are pressing down hard enough that the string touches the fingerboard you bend the string out of pitch. If you lighten your touch to the point that you just hit the frets most of the intonation problems will clear up (assuming the bridge is in the right place). You can also dress the frets lower & cut the nut slots to give 1/64 clearance at the first fret.

    This will hopefully reduce your frustration while waiting for a better instrument.

    GD




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    Quote Originally Posted by (GD Armstrong @ Oct. 05 2005, 02:15)
    The G string intonation problem that you mention is common on TC & other short scale OMs. It is caused by a combination of factors - the heavy string needed to get a solid G at 20" is stiff and the fretwire used on the PacRim Oms is quite tall. If you are pressing down hard enough that the string touches the fingerboard you bend the string out of pitch. If you lighten your touch to the point that you just hit the frets most of the intonation problems will clear up (assuming the bridge is in the right place). You can also dress the frets lower & cut the nut slots to give 1/64 clearance at the first fret.

    This will hopefully reduce your frustration while waiting for a better instrument.

    GD
    GD,

    I've experimented playing with a light touch, a heavy touch on the near and far sides of the fret and everywhere in between and, though sometimes I can get the note to play clean on the lower octave, I still run into an issue as the notes are higher.

    >You can also dress the frets lower & cut the nut slots to
    > give 1/64 clearance at the first fret.

    Mind translating this for someone who's new to stringed instruments?

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    Butcherer of Songs Rob Zamites's Avatar
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    If your hands can manage it, you might also look at getting Doug to craft your OM with a slightly longer scale length, say 22-23.5". My Romanian-built SSZ (Short-Scale Zouk) is 23.5" in scale length and is perfect for my hands. I'm going to have Aaron Cowles in Vicksberg, MI make my new instrument to the same scale length.

    Rob
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    Registered User steve V. johnson's Avatar
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    I have a good friend with a couple of Trinity instruments, a mandola and an OM. She likes to trade and play my instruments, and I enjoy hearing her do so, but I can't play those Trinities in tune to save my life. I used to be really baffled by it, kept checking the tuner and all, and I finally figured all this out. Now I just fake it while she plays mine. <GGG>

    stv
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    Quote Originally Posted by (sliabhstv @ Oct. 05 2005, 14:14)
    I have a good friend with a couple of Trinity instruments, a mandola and an OM. #She likes to trade and play my instruments, and I enjoy hearing her do so, but I can't play those Trinities in tune to save my life. #I used to be really #baffled by it, kept checking the tuner and all, and I finally figured all this out. #Now I just fake it while she plays mine. #<GGG>

    stv
    Hahaha... Nice!

    I checked the classifieds here and saw a couple of really nice OM's I may check out at some point... Thanks for the ideas and suggestions, folks. Feel free to keep them coming!

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    Butcherer of Songs Rob Zamites's Avatar
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    There's a nice Weber Sage 1 OM in the classified for $1000. That's a nice deal.

    /wishes he had a $1000 to spend right now
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    Registered User steve V. johnson's Avatar
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    I've heard and played several Sages. Two of them have really come apart, I'm very sad to say, tho one of them lived in a pretty extreme situation on the banks of the Ohio River. From what those owners told me, PJ and some other folks didn't feel very surprised at the problems with these, and one of the two has been wonderfully restored, at, I think, only shipping cost to the owner.

    The Sage, to my ear, is one of the more guitar-sounding zouks out there (on my theoretical scale which has "guitar" at one end and "mandolin" at the other), with a big, open and deep, body sound.

    I think that all the ones I have seen were maple, but I have the idea that PJ at Weber might have told me that they'd make 'em with other woods, too.

    Today <GG>, given the choice at the same price, I think I'd take a Peterson. Today... <GGG>

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