Wasburn vs Luna vs Michael Kelly?

[LochJessMonster]

I recently have been wanted to get a mandolin that is a bit better than what I'm currently using (Rogue A style) however, being a college student I cannot afford a higher end mandolin at this time such as an Eastman or Gretsch.

I'd like to get an F-style and possibly an electric acoustic.
I went to play some mandolins in person, I played an F-style fender f63s, a washburn ms3w, and some sort of electric eastman that i cannot remember the number for. I did not like the feel of the fender or the eastman (not that I could normally afford one, but this was on sale for about $500) I did enjoy the feel of the washburn as well as another washburn which was an A style (m1sdl) and I really like the sound that came out of it.

Looking online I found a luna moonbird f style, which was pretty unique looking and is electric, as well as a washburn ms3we which is also electric. I cannot find any information on the luna so If any one has any experience with them please share, as I am only familiar with their guitars. I also have found a Michael Kelly legacy mandolin (MKLFSTBS) blem at folkmusician for $500, which seems like a good deal.

This post probably seems a bit scatter brained, but I would really like to hear from you guys what you think of any of these instruments!

Thanks!

[allenhopkins]

1. Overall, I'd advise to get the best acoustic mandolin you can for your $500 (assuming that's your budget), and retrofit it with an aftermarket piezo transducer -- unless you want to get into fairly aggressive rock-ish playing, and want the sound of a magnetic pickup. Get all solid woods, carved top and back rather than heat-pressed, and don't pay a bunch extra for fancy inlays and (often too-thick) flashy finish.

2. You can find Eastman MD-315 F-model mandolins with finish flaws (called "B stock") for around $500; here's one. Regularly, they're around $700 discounted. The Eastman '300' series gets pretty consistent good Cafe press.

3. If you do some look-ups on the Cafe, you'll find that Fender, Washburn, and Michael Kelly generally get fewer positive reviews than Kentucky, Eastman, and Loar. I'd also offer, as a suggestion, the Rover RM-75, generally available around $450. It's a Saga brand -- Saga also distributes Kentucky -- all solid wood, carved top and back.

4. Standard Cafe advice: you can get a better mandolin for your money, in general, if you get an A-model, and don't pay for the additional manufacturing required to construct an F-model mandolin. In my experience, people who like F-models like 'em, and put up the additional hundreds of $$$ to get an instrument of equal quality to an A-model.

5. In any case, make sure you get good shop set-up. Robert at Folkmusician does a great job here, as does Elderly Instruments. Other dealers may not, and you'll need to either learn to do your own set-up, or pay a shop to do it.

[Mandoplumb]

What you are talking about really is no better than what you have. If that is what you can afford at this point I wouldn't do anything. You can waste enough in a few of this kind of " upgrades" to buy an upgrade. Save your money until you can improve on what you have just MHO.

[Br1ck]

You would be happier with your budget if you buy a used A style. I saw a Kentucky KM 150 in the classifieds recently that would nicely get you through your college years. An all solid wood mandolin is a must IMHO. If you are patient, you can snag a nice mandolin from someone who is upgrading.

Place a want to buy add in the classifieds with what you can afford and see what comes up. There have got to be many unplayed mandos out there whose owners might just want to help you out. Maybe someone would part with one of the recent close out Michael Kelly Festivals. You never know.

[LochJessMonster]

This is exactly why I joined this site! Thank you for all of your responses! I never knew that the F was only more expensive due to production costs. The more i think about it, the more I agree that I should just wait until I can afford a higher-end carved solid top mandolin. Not trying to digress back into the topic of F styles vs A styles, but say I were to pay $500 for another mandolin, would I be able to get a better A style mandolin then the F style Michael Kelly Legacy which is normally $1000 but currently half off?
Thanks again for your comments!
-Jess

[Chris Daniels]

A month ago I played a Washburn and a Luna (both F-styles) at a shop just to see what they were like and was VERY underwhelmed even compared to some of the starters I went through, especially the Luna. MKs can be OK but nothing special. Check the Cafe classifieds because there are a few decent options at the moment.

And yes. You can get a better A model than an F for the same $$ but there are bargains out there depending on your budget.

C.

[pops1]

There was a thread here a few weeks ago about the Michael Kelly mandolin that were on sale. Several people bought them and were very happy.

[Folkmusician.com]

I try to stay out of threads where someone is asking an opinion of something I am selling, etc.. Obviously I have a vested interest and shouldn't be butting in.. In this case I will though.

At $500, my top choice would be the Eastman MD305. It is quite nice, and yes, it is a better choice than the MK I have at $500.

[pops1]

I think Robert has a point, I was mentioning the MK mandolins that sold for $199 and were all thought of as sounding good, but needing much setup. These were the Festival Legacy if I remember, and an F style mandolin.

[almeriastrings]

I have known of more than a couple of those 'Luna' instruments to suffer collapsing top problems. I would steer clear of those.

[GDCB]

I think Robert has a point, I was mentioning the MK mandolins that sold for $199 and were all thought of as sounding good, but needing much setup. These were the Festival Legacy if I remember, and an F style mandolin.

I picked up a used MK Legacy Plus? F style mandolin this Saturday for 300$ as my first Mandolin.

I'm outta Nashville, so I've been to Carters and played nearly every brand and style.

The MK is a close contender to most of the low end mandolins they had there( Eastman, Weber, even the Arnold Cross they had there)

I usually spend a few months researching before I buy any instrument, so I wasn't going into this blind.

Overall, the brand doesn't matter at this price level. Get carved wood, a Straight neck, quality craftsmanship and a good tone. A good setup will make most mandolins sound good.

[mandolin breeze]

IMHO, I'd stay put with what you have and save until you can budget $1,000 - $1,400 where a lot more quality options will open up. Warning, this pattern of wishing you could move up to the "next level" isn't likely to end anytime soon . . . it's an affliction very common to our breed, very contagious with no known cure. That said, enjoy your journey!

[allenhopkins]

IMHO, I'd stay put with what you have and save until you can budget $1,000 - $1,400 where a lot more quality options will open up...!

Tend to disagree; IMHO there's a good deal of "improvement space" between a sub-$100 Rogue A-model, and $1K-1.4K. I've purchased quite a few sub-$1K instruments that were performance-level quality. (At least I used them in performance, without noticeable damage.)

Many of us would strain to make $1K available for an instrument purchase. We might have to put our "upgrade" off for years, given the demands of daily life. But we might have half that amount in discretionary funds, and there are opportunities to get well-made, solid-wood, hand-carved mandolins -- new or used -- for less than four figures.

I agree that "churning" through a succession of mediocre instruments is a waste of money and effort. But sticking with an unsatisfactory beginner mandolin until we have enough to buy a pro-grade one, may not make sense either. Lots of good mandolins around that won't break the bank.

[Mike Stewart]

IMHO, I'd stay put with what you have and save until you can budget $1,000 - $1,400 where a lot more quality options will open up.

For half that, the OP can make a jump to a mandolin that is considerably better than a Rogue. Hell, for under $200 a used Kentucky KM-150 would be a huge jump, IMO. Now, I'll agree that at about $1000 the quality options really start to open up. But there's an opportunity cost if money is tight. Better to play the $500 mandolin one can afford today than to keep playing the plywood because that $1000 just never quite makes it into the mandolin fund. Buy used, of course, so the deprecation is minimized. Then you've got pretty close to $500 in the mandolin "savings account", but unlike money in a bank, you can play it. Sell it, trade it when the time comes and money is needed, or keep it as a backup.

[Folkmusician.com]

Allen is spot on.

If we were talking about one of the stand out affordable mandolins (Kentucky KM-150, Eastman MD305, etc..), then there would be no major reason to look for something else under $1000, or maybe under $2000. But from the Rogue to a KM-150 is a night and day difference. A KM-150 is good enough for the average professional player. A Rogue is not.

[Br1ck]

Guys, I know a lot of us are old and our memory doesn't quite work like it used to, but the OP is a student. Try to remember when a twenty in your pocket was a great feeling. I don't think he wants to spend five hundred, he just needs something better for now, so OP should jump on the KM 150 in the classifieds, or any used Eastman, Loar, Kentucky or, yes MK that he can snag for around $250. Those would get him through grad school just fine.

[MediumMando5722]

Save up some bucks, keep your eyes peeled for a deal and be patient. I got my Eastman MD315 from a Music Go Round in very good condition for $300 with a decent bag.

[JeffD]

Unless you are a bluegrasser, don't ignore the many great flat tops out there. A flat top could well get you more a more quality mandolin (better wood, better build, etc.,) than the same amount you would spend for an arch top, even an A style. Just a thought. You can electrify it as easily as an arch top as well.

[CES]

For 500, I'd be looking for Kentucky 505 and Eastman 300 series. Got my 315 on clearance at a guitar center affiliate for 429. It's a lot of mandolin for that price point. Either of these would bet mandolin. These would be an upgrade from your present mandolin. Good luck!!

[LochJessMonster]

Hmm, So it looks like I should either 1. get a used A style by either Kentucky, MK, or Eastman for under 500, as long as it's Something all solid and carved (what is the general opinion on Breedlove btw?) or 2. I could stick with my rogue until I can get something more expensive than $500.
Say that I stuck with my rogue, I have this issue where it doesn't stay in tune very well and it needs a full tuning every time I pick it up. Should I buy new tuners for it? I have already tried once but they didn't fit the holes.
I have a friend who is a luthier, I could have him set up the rogue for me and possibly replace the tuners, or would that be a waste?

[pops1]

I wouldn't worry about replacing the tuners on the Rogue. A setup wouldn't hurt any mandolin. Most mandolins have to be tuned while you play them, let alone setting a day. They have short scales, high tension and are fussy.

[Br1ck]

Functionally just about any tuner does it's job. People thinking their tuners are slipping have a nut issue. People who think they can tune down to pitch are delusional. Tuners may and do feel cheap and cheesy, but they rarely fail. Don't sink any money into that Rogue. Spend $300 on a used well made all solid mandolin. If your Rogue has never had a setup, start there. You need to know what a good setup plays like to be able to evaluate your next purchase.

[Frogstar]

Hmm, So it looks like I should either 1. get a used A style by either Kentucky, MK, or Eastman for under 500, as long as it's Something all solid and carved (what is the general opinion on Breedlove btw?) or 2. I could stick with my rogue until I can get something more expensive than $500.
Say that I stuck with my rogue, I have this issue where it doesn't stay in tune very well and it needs a full tuning every time I pick it up. Should I buy new tuners for it? I have already tried once but they didn't fit the holes.
I have a friend who is a luthier, I could have him set up the rogue for me and possibly replace the tuners, or would that be a waste?

I have a Breedlove Premier OO (and a pair of Mid Mos) and do not currently suffer from MAS, for what that's worth.

I wouldn't worry about replacing the tuners on the Rogue. A setup wouldn't hurt any mandolin. Most mandolins have to be tuned while you play them, let alone setting a day. They have short scales, high tension and are fussy.

I agree. My Rogue doesn't seem to be worse off than any of my nicer mandolins in this regard.

[Woodrow Wilson]

I disagree with the *tuners don't matter* crowd. I've had tuners on various instruments that had the annoying tendency to slip; it's not unheard of. But, $100 thrown at good tuners vs saving that towards a nice used instrument, it doesn't seem like money well spent unless you're like me and love to have lots of parts lying around to swap between instruments over decades... in which case, totally justified. :P

Watch a few you-tube videos and make sure that you are properly stringing the Rogue. How the wire wraps around the post can create helpful friction and down pressure over the nut. That's definitely a better starting point than spending money beyond new strings when it's time to swap. Also be sure that you are tuning up, not down, so as to have good tension on the string once in tune.

[CES]

Have your luthier friend check out the nut and bridge slots for you. Generally, a little filing is inexpensive (my guy did a little for me on a Martin A style recently and charged me $25). You could also shoot Rob Meldrum (search function) an email and get his set up book for free. Lots of good info in it, and a Rogue is a good instrument to practice such skills upon.

The tuners on my Eastman 315 are functional, but they're not as stable as I'd like. It stays in the same climate controlled environment as my Silverangel and MT (usually), but requires much more adjustment while playing than they do. And, the nut and bridge slots are right on it, it's just the tuners could be more stable...it happens. I may be changing them out at some point, but haven't been able to talk myself into sinking the $$ into my "beater" yet.

If a little set up on the Rogue buys you time to save up a little more, great. If not, I still contend that you can get a lot more mandolin for you 500 dollar budget that will keep you happy for a while yet. Especially if you broaden your search to Mig Muddy and Flatiron pancake models...they're not great for playing bluegrass in an ensemble (fine for practice or small jams, though), but are great for everything else, and tend to be a lot of mandolin for the money. I contend that my Flatiron 1N has professional grade workmanship and tone, and I paid 500 for it...