Rearranging Gibson Grover tuners

[MikeEdgerton]

Has anyone dismantled a set of Gibson Grover tuners and tried to make them into a set of Worm over tuners? Did it work?

[Willie Poole]

Mike, I have converted tuners from worm under to worm over, I don`t know that they were Grovers, it takes a little bit of figuring and studying to do it.....

Willie

[mandroid]

It Works With Schallers, Easily, As i may have said before..

To get worm gears out of The others Grover, etc, the shaft journal is essentially,
Riveted to the backing plate..


So you have to get that rivet/swaged connection broken , then re assembled ..

I have Repaired a Loose one on my 90 year old A, making a tool [via bench grinder] that takes the force, just at the edges

So the hole the shaft passes thru is not ovalized .. flattened,
as I used a punch on the other side,
to re set the riveting- like connection to the backing plates.




Schaller tuner's back plates are Die-cast, the journals for all 4 shafts and backing plate are the same part,
and unscrewing the round gear, lets all the worm-button shafts come out, the back.

Thus I have a Gold plated MOP in the buttons Shaft over F5 tuner set, that was a 'backwards (CW) turning' shaft under set,
when supplied on my Lebeda. that got a replacement, gears cut the other way..

and so the reshuffled one is not being used..

[MikeEdgerton]

The Gibson Grover tuners look like they will come apart. It should simply be a matter of figuring out what goes where. I knew you'd done the Schallers. That's why I'm even considering this.

[Loudloar]

I haven't messed with tuning gears in quite a while but I'm pretty sure that if you reassemble worm-over parts to be worm-under that you will need to turn the button the opposite direction to tighten the string. I've had these on a mandolin and it's a constant pain to remember to turn them the "wrong" way. I believe the worm-under gears are cut the opposite way.

Steve

[MikeEdgerton]

Looking at these I don't think that's going to happen. From what I can see the gears are cut the same way if I move from the them from the lower space to the upper space on the other side. I'm sitting here right now getting ready to try it out. It can be reversed back so it's no problem. They totally disassemble. I Have no desire to have the wrong way tuners. I know you can get used to it, I don't want to. I have three other sets of worm over tuners I can use if I have to. I just like these tuners.

[HoGo]

Looking at these I don't think that's going to happen. From what I can see the gears are cut the same way if I move from the them from the lower space to the upper space on the other side. I'm sitting here right now getting ready to try it out. It can be reversed back so it's no problem. They totally disassemble. I Have no desire to have the wrong way tuners. I know you can get used to it, I don't want to. I have three other sets of worm over tuners I can use if I have to. I just like these tuners.

The tuning direction of the tuners WILL change when reassembled the other way. NO DOUBT.
I've said it many times in the past... look how the worm is cut on standard guitar tuners (worm over configuration is always left hand worm) and typical "worm-under" mandolin tuners (always right hand worm) for worm over machines on mandolin that tune in typical direction you need all worms left handed just like on guitar machines, not just swapping of the shafts.
Just a side note: all Schaller tuners I ever received were assembled as worm under tuners, even the sets that were intended to be worm over and had the left hand worm were factory assembled as worm under... then there's the confusing naming of the two styles...

[MikeEdgerton]

I have a set of Schaller Worm overs that turn correctly. They do seem to have a weird naming convention for them though.

[Loudloar]

Ok Mike,

Before you go tearing up a bunch of tuners, study this graphic. You may have to study which way the worm gear is pushing the crown gear to be convinced. But it's all there for you to see.

Ask me why I know about this? In the early 70's some Japanese or maybe Grover F-style tuners came out with worm-under configuration but they had only rearranged the standard worm-over parts, as you are proposing to do. I had a mandolin with these tuners and I remember well having to turn them backwards to tune up.

Steve

[MikeEdgerton]

This isn't going to be tough. I'm going to remove two screws and move one worm. If that one worm doesn't work I remove it and put it back. I'd never tear an entire set up and it won't destroy the set. Unfortunately I don't have time to do it today or I'd do it now.

[MikeEdgerton]

OK, they do indeed turn backwards so this is out. I'm down to my Rubner, Gotoh and Schaller worm over. Also, the tuners that are already on it. No name brand Schaller knockoffs.

[Austin Bob]

I just ordered some worm over Grovers from Stewmac today.

They always treat me like I'm their best customer even though I've only ever ordered a few things from them.

[MikeEdgerton]

I'm just not fond of the new Grover plates. I know that's silly as they make decent tuners.