Mann........is this a good idea?

**Andrew Reckhart** · Mar-03-2004, 9:47am

I was looking at an ad for a Mann 'A' style in the classifieds. #Here is what it said.........

NEW MODEL MANN A-5. I COULDN'T DECIDE ON WHAT KIND OF NECK JOINT TO USE ON THE NEW LINE OF MANDOS...DOVE TAIL? BOLT ON? TENON?...THEN IT HIT ME ! WE DON'T NEED NO STINKIN NECK JOINT! I CARVE & GRADUATE THE NECK AND BACK AS ONE PIECE.

I was just wondering what everybody else thought about it. #I really have no idea how it works out, but it seems ingenious to me. #What would be the pros and cons of this design and construction method. #I would think that it would surely add to the sustain and clarity of the instrument in much the same way as a neck-through-body electric guitar. #I am probably wrong, I'm just guessing. #What do you knowledgeable luthiers think of this? #Has anybody else tried something similar?

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**grsnovi** · Mar-03-2004, 12:58pm

One benefit of the current assembled construction technique is the freedom it provides in getting optimized wood.

If you carved your neck from the same billet as the sides/back, your grains wouldn't be running in the optimized directions.

To provide strength, the side grain should be oriented differently from the back and the neck grain and back grain should also be different.

I won't speculate on how such an instrument would sound, but an instrument constructed using traditional methods would be both stronger and would waste less wood.

**Big Joe** · Mar-03-2004, 1:53pm

There is a builder who does not use a neck joint, but rather builds the neck and joint as one assembly. The back and top and rims are seperate, but the neck and neck block are one piece. While that appears on the surface to be an interesting proposition, it presents several real problems over time. Should the neck ever need repair, the only way to really repair that is to cut the neck out, take off the back, put a real neck joint in and the set the neck and replace the back. That is a lot of work and could cost more than the instrument would be worth. Time will tell how well that will hold up, but I know the success rate of a well built dovetail joint and will take it any day over any alternative I've seen to date.

**Hummingbird_Mandolins** · Mar-03-2004, 4:01pm

I agree with Gary and Joe. I would stay away from that type of construction.

Hummingbird Mandolins

**MANNDOLINS** · Mar-17-2004, 11:24pm

Andrew, thanks for the compliment (I think!) or at least the hint of encouragement on my Manndolin A-5. Your right about the sustain. I had the oppotunity to compare it to some nice Mando's at Gruhn's and it defintley has more sustain/volume than most of what he has on the wall (I'll be nice and not mention names). I have 2 more A's and an F almost done. As for the other's concern's about "wasting" wood and strength..I guess they didn't see the photo's. And for the "down the road" neck reset issue, 95% of the mando necks I've seen that needed reset were because of neck joint failure. I love a well made traditional mandolin as much as the next guy, but I'm just trying to do my own thing (and from what I've seen lately on the post I'd better hurry and get it patented)!

**grsnovi** · Mar-18-2004, 12:12am

You're right - I didn't look at the picture, I envisioned a huge chunk of wood where the entire back and sides were hogged out of one piece. You obviously don't do THAT. I rarely look at the classified section here so I tend to forget its there. It looks like you've done a modified "neck through" with traditional bent sides and a back with wings.

I guess I jumped to a preposterous conclusion.

Jonathan, I just visited your web site and you make some unique and interesting mandos. The chambered electric looks pretty cool.

**Rob Grant** · Mar-20-2004, 4:01am

Seems like none other then ol' Orville himself was playing around with this concept in mandolin construction. His one and only only patent, granted in 1898, was for the sides and neck to be carved out of one piece ( source: "Acoustic Guitars And Other Fretted Instruments" by Geo. Gruhn & Walter Carter).

Frankly, one reason I got into building mandolins was because of the relatively small bits of timber that were required for construction as opposed to something like guitars or bass fiddles <g>. The "one piece system" would seem to negate this economy of scarce resorces.

**Rob Powell** · Mar-20-2004, 11:49pm

I guess the question really is...does this produce a more beautiful tone and/or more beautiful instrument.

For me, if carving the the whole thing out of one piece of wood has some advantage in tone or produces at least the same tone and a better looking instrument then damn the torpedoes.

Fantastic looking, bad tone...hang it on the wall.
Fantastic tone, looks like crap...play in dark clubs.
Fantastic tone, fantastic looks...brag.

**MANNDOLINS** · Mar-21-2004, 11:06am

I'll try to post a photo of an F model in progress to show what I'm doing. I was a little misleading in the ad when I said I carved the back from one piece, I should have said AS one piece . It is actually a neck through with wings glued on then carved.